5 seeing habits

[stopcomplete]

any body been told they are subject to disciplinary action if that cant recite the 5 seeing habits,ten point commentary,8 steps to lift/lower,5 steps to avoid slip/fall injuries and 6 rules of backing.has to be 100 percent word for word and in order in front of bm and safety people. been hearing this a lot lately in our bulding.

[scratch]

What are they gonna do? Send the driver home and leave the Package Car sitting there all day?:confused1

[over9five]

They want us to memorize all that, but I can't find anything in the contract to back them up.

I asked my sup if he will pay me to study it, but he said no.

I look forward to seeing them try "disciplinary action". They'll look like fools.

Don't study at home, and don't worry about it.

[PAS'd out]

I can tell you the 5 seing habits because that was hammered into us during orientation. The 10 point commentary list was not taught as such when I was hired in the mid 80's. We were taught the elements of it and I know them all, but I cannot categorize them as part of a list, and I really do not care. What I care about is incorporating those elements into my driving, so I can drive as safely as possible during my day.

Management measures themselves in part as to what they can recite verbatim, not by actually doing physical work.

It is the same as everything else at this place the past few years. It is not about being safe, it is about being able to recite words. It is not about providing service, it is all about what the reports say about providing service.

How is that talking on a conference call is work for them, but if we are not out humping packages anything else is not for us?

God bless 'em if they want to send me home for not being able to recite verbatim all that. Pay me to study that wordage as part of my day and I will regurgitate it for them.

[eagle1]

We have been told about that also, and our safety com. has been reviewing a little bit everyday at PCM's, it helps. It has helped me learn some of them.

[Hangingon]

So it doesn't matter if you've never been involved in an avoidable accident, nor had an injury, but you are obviously an unsafe employee and should be disciplined and maybe fired because you can't recite their pablum by rote with all footnotes?

[Channahon]

The 5 seeing habits will come in handy when you teach your kids to drive safely, just like you.
I have been gone for a year, and not sure what safety is doing nowadays. However, most of you know the 5 seeing habits and use them everyday in some manner. When you have your yearly safety ride, the sups are suppose to know the 5 seeing habits, 10 point commentary, habits, challenge them to recite them and learn from them. All UPS management should be well versed in these procedures. Are they, some may be, but the majority will not, as UPS does not spend the time or money to train their front line management any longer. Work with them, don't take it out on them.

[Hangingon]

I know the 5 seeing habits (and trust me, my wife at this point, to her great discomfort, knows them also) and use them daily. When I have the Keller people with their clipboards asking me however I always come up cold and have to fall back on All Good Kids Like Milk. The 10 point I have no idea without the crib sheet thay always pass out before a test.

[EAM_Master]

When I was in service provider training last year they spent more time on the 5 seeing habits/10 point commentary than anything else. I felt sorry for all the off-the-street hires who are gonna go out as paranoid safe drivers, but not have a clue on how to work the DIAD.

[Box_Junkie]

Originally Posted by EAM_Master

When I was in service provider training last year they spent more time on the 5 seeing habits/10 point commentary than anything else. I felt sorry for all the off-the-street hires who are gonna go out as paranoid safe drivers, but not have a clue on how to work the DIAD.

Amen brotha!

[DS]

I figgered out an easy way to remember the 10 point commentary...its all association...

1]one car length
2]look two times left
3]count one two three
4]four to six seconds
5]five to eight seconds
6]scan six things
7]stale pizza seven days
8]eight to 12 seconds
9]nine words , signal
mirror shoulder check blind
spot then pull away
10]eye to eye contact
horns lights signals...
Bo Derek

[daniel895]

Originally Posted by DS

I figgered out an easy way to remember the 10 point commentary...its all association...

1]one car length
2]look two times left
3]count one two three
4]four to six seconds
5]five to eight seconds
6]scan six things
7]stale pizza seven days
8]eight to 12 seconds
9]nine words , signal
mirror shoulder check blind
spot then pull away
10]eye to eye contact
horns lights signals...
Bo Derek

What are the eight lifting and lowering keys.

[fredly00]

In our center, those who couldn't recite or demonstrate the 5 or 10

basically just get more training, quizzes a couple times a week until they get it.

[tieguy]

Its on the ketter audit now so we are basically stuck with memorizing the information.

You have to admit if you break down it is information that is helpfull to driving and working safely?

[Channahon]

Originally Posted by tieguy

Its on the ketter audit now so we are basically stuck with memorizing the information.

You have to admit if you break down it is information that is helpfull to driving and working safely?

Isn't is about time to get rid of Ketter? They continually create new audits to keep them at UPS. And whoever in Safety or HR who agreed to this on the audit, ought to go back to operations and see if they could pass the audit.

To ask our drivers to memorize the 10 point commentary, I'm sure Ketter couldn't memorize it.

Now the 5 seeing habits are easy enough. Our drivers have that information from their training, and safety rides.

[govols019]

My wife got rear-ended the other day while sitting at a stop light. She got mad at me when I told her it was an avoidable accident. She didn't leave a proper space cushion behind the vehicle. When I said that she just looked at me like I was the dumbest person on the planet.

[MitEman]

Leave it to the knucklehead management persons to try to discipline employees over safety. We had the same threat here, but they backed off after our local said, "Maybe a requirement to new drivers in training, but this is not in the contract, and it will be grieved immediately." The safety committee stepped up and came up with a contest to diffuse tensions, and learn all the information. In hindsight, one safety section at a time should have been added to everyones' safety knowledge, instead of throwing all five sections at us and overwhelming people. There is a tremendous cost to the company AND the employee when there is an accident or injury. Statistically the more safety knowledge an employee has, the number of accidents and injuries is greatly reduced. But safety is an attitude that should be encouraged in a positive learning enviroment. Management should exhaust ALL learning techniques, and the safety committee should be informed and asked for input, before talking to an employee about difficulty in learning and reciting from memory, safe working and driving habits.

[local804]

Originally Posted by eagle1

We have been told about that also, and our safety com. has been reviewing a little bit everyday at PCM's, it helps. It has helped me learn some of them.

They can make you read whatever the hell they want but we still
1. Have to work in 120 degree package cars in the middle of the summer and keep bulk head door closed at all times.
2. List oversize over weight and improper packages.
3. Get in and out of the truck 250 plus times wearing down your joints while carrying packages.2 foot steps on p1000 lol
4. Drive in zero degree weather and work in a foot of snow( but they will pull you in the building for safety reasons at 7pm((no exceptions) lol
5. Have you ever seen all the diesel fumes when everyone leaves the bldg?
(oh wait, they stagger the start times) lol
6. Icestorm - no big deal, they supply iceshoes lol what about the truck?
I could go on but its time to hit the showers.

[Griff]

Originally Posted by govols019

My wife got rear-ended the other day while sitting at a stop light. She got mad at me when I told her it was an avoidable accident. She didn't leave a proper space cushion behind the vehicle. When I said that she just looked at me like I was the dumbest person on the planet.

Looking on UPSers.com every now and then I see our districts accidents and I've yet to see an "unavoidable" next to one. Amazing how UPS creates a few safety guildlines and all of a sudden everything that can happen to you throughout the course of a day is avoidable. These safety people at UPS are the biggest bunch of monday-morning quarterbacks I've ever seen in my life. According to them World War 2 was avoidable as well.

[Pip]

Couple feeder drivers came in the shop this morning all bent out of shape. Seems the got the word that there will be warning letters handed out to those who can't answer the questions for the 5 "HABITS" and the 10 commentary's.

Shop steward came in right after and said the local is already on top of things. Supposedly there isn't anything in the contract saying you have to recite this stuff upon being asked on the spot. Feeder supervisor said it is considered part of the methods.

could get interesting from the sounds of it.Sounds like there is going to be a few grievences filed once they start demanding the drivers to recite them. There even making us mechanics have to recite the darn things.

Personally, before I came to UPS, I drove for 14 years. Have roughly 1.2 million miles safe driving without an accident. I'm totally dumbfounded how I ever made it have that far without an accident not knowing the "5 habits" or the "10 commentary's".

I'm all for safety, but I think the powers that be, are getting very anal about this. IMHO

[browned out]

We had a feeder driver who was discharged for not knowing 5 seeing habits 10 point commentary. I guess it was for not working as directed.

Anyhow he had 30 plus years in and retirement papers submitted. He probably figured 30+ years of being f__ked by Big Brown; he would throw a little back at em. Needless to say he was reinstated and then retired.

Center Managers do receive bonuses on how well their centers do in these Ketter audits. We are always pre warned of these audits via 2way or pcm. If they wanted a true audit; wouldn't it be more productive to have no one know they are coming? Ketter is just a huge waste of money for about 20 years now.

[Channahon]

Ketter names about 3 operations within a region that will audited. No one knows until the auditors show up which operation is chosen. HR usually speculates and lets the district know, based on the last audit performed in the district. That's why the word is sent out, to make sure everyone is ready. Personally, I think everyone ought to be ready at all times, not just when auditors may show up.

I agree with you, they are a waste of money and time.

[bestpackagecar]

WELL HELLO TO ALL UPSers . ANYBODY ELSE HERE FROM IRELAND???