UPS laying off Technical hourly employees

[tieguy]

Originally Posted by trickpony1

Tie,
It appears the sugar coating is wearing off or do you not remember telling me how it was just my ravaged mind?
It seems this board is receiving input from a number of sources regarding this topic, one of which comments on threats and oppression by management.
Gosh.......what a thought.

Trick,
I'm not sure which alleged threat and oppression incident you are referring to but if it's the latest then any management activity of threat and oppression to prevent unionizing would be a NLRB case. Feel free to file if you feel you have a case.

As far as unionizing is concerned , unfortunately that would not prevent the reorganization of the tsg department. Unless the union would like to pay their salaries and we know unions never care about their members that much.

Just curious Trickpony does the union put up bronze statues for its retirees?

and no ontrickpony I don't remember telling you the sugercoating ravaged your mind or even using the ravage mind phrase. Could you point it out to me?

[tieguy]

by the way anyone notice ford is talking of cutting 30,000 jobs? Not to distract from the 400 jobs we are talking about here but it does provide a stark contrast to our situation. UPS has ridden out many recessions and almost always created jobs during those times. If you really want to talk about the evil empire and how they cut jobs then you have to factor in the big companies that really drop some big numbers.

If that is sugercoating then let me sprinkle it everywhere. I am gratefull I chose to work for a company that has so much to offer and does not drop 20,000 to 40,000 jobs everytime the economy turns sour.

The problem we all have here is they are not allowing the techs to move to other positions even though others are being hired and other positions are available.

The difference is UPS has many other jobs they could place us in. They do not want to because we are making between $25/hr to $30/hr.

[ncrtscisme]

I agree with Tieguy in the fact that you should be thankful we aren't losing as many jobs as ford's employees. However, ford's reason for doing it is that it took a lost of 1.x billion dollars over the year...UPS, I can almost guarantee, will announce a PROFIT of over 3 billion dollars for last year. Will the board of directors vote to give themselves another 7.5% raise this year, when the rest of us can get no more than 3? Probably. Will UPS be able to achieve an even higher profit for next year by cutting down so many tech support employees? Of course...but when will it end? When every drop of blood and sweat is squeezed out of our drivers and loaders and when upper management makes more money than they can spend, will that be enough? Doubt it.
We claim to put so much emphasis on technology here at UPS, but when the price of this becomes the jobs of those who worked to put this technology into place is it really worth it?
Sorry, don't mean to be on the soapbox for too long...

[yankswinagain]

Trickpony1 posted...

"AnotherTSG,
I'll be getting my popcorn ready also.
On the "menu of life", revenge is best served cold.
Go for it and know my thoughts are with you!
While management is fumbling around wondering why the computers are down and pulling their hair out trying to correct the situation I will be grinning knowing the little guy didn't go down without taking someone with him/her.
Godspeed........and, yes, God will understand."


I guess I never understand this type of thing. When "the computers are down" because a soon to be ex-employee gets pissed off - all employees in the company suffer - we may not be able send bills to our customers, pay our employees, or many other things that are critical to the business.

The way this is being done may not be the best (not allowing people to re-apply for open jobs), but that doesn't mean we should be encouraging people to purposely cause havoc for the company.

[DS]

... In my opinion Its the greed that bugs me,we know that they can hire young kids off the street that specialize in computers,and pay them dick all, except for subsidising thier educations,and writing most of it off tax time.Its a kick in the head to the people that got us this far.As far as wreaking havoc on the company goes,how could we possibly do that?
The brown cafe is frequented by people that like to vent,chat,exchange stories,recipes . We are no threat to them. Its hard to tell what you are trying to say in your post Yank...sad? happy? defensive?

Originally Posted by Anonymous Coward

The difference is UPS has many other jobs they could place us in. They do not want to because we are making between $25/hr to $30/hr.

$25 to $30! HA! We were lucky to make $19!

[anothertsg]

Trickpony1 - Thank you very much for your supportive comments!!! Let me just say, though, I personally have no desire to commit any acts of sabotage or even mischief with anything owned or operated by UPS. I simply think that out of 300+ people that are being laid off, someone will probably try something. Not everyone with power handles it wisely (true on either side of this particular scenario). The suspense just begs for popcorn! If there are techs in other areas that are being allowed to move into other positions, then I am very happy for them. However, according to the Corporate memo read to us by the HR rep, all reassignments have been "frozen" company-wide. It is THIS action that has our department incensed. Almost everyone knew the downsize was coming, but we were not prepared for being THROWN OUT. As I said before, there are well over 50 openings in my district at this time, but we cannot even ATTEMPT to move into them, or even quit (give up seniority, etc) and rehire for at least 12 months. No one can make sense of it. Even those who came to TSG from other departments, including Operations, cannot move back despite their experience. Finally, I'd like to work in Anonymous Coward's district!!!! Because after 5 years, I'm not even making $20/hour, much less $25-$30. Maybe after 15+ years as a Senior tech?? Certainly those without seniority won't have close to that kind of pay rate, so even that hypothetical excuse would not be valid.

[anothertsg]

Interestingly enough, they are also reducing the TSG management staff - by transferring them into Operations, IE, HR, etc. The freeze doesn't apply to them, and that's good. I personally don't want to see any of our sups on the street either. They're pretty shaken up by all of this, too. I just wish we were being treated fairly also.

[brown_blood]

WOW...
In our district a brand new tech is starting at over $20/hr. I believe the mid-point for a grade 10 is somewhere around $25/hr.
A grade 11 that I know with 15yrs is making somewhere in the low $32/hr range.
I have heard the there is a wide variance around the country as far as technician pay goes.
Just one more reason... IMHO... those techs should try to unionize.
Right now UPS has the best of both worlds with the technicians.
A highly skilled and professional workforce that management can count on to always come through, work extra hours without asking for OT, take calls on weekends and late nights...
On the other hand, when it comes down to it, the get shafted and demeaned like any other hourly, in fact even much worse. All TSG are at-will employees, no union protections, no MIP, just really abused like no others at UPS.

Its going to be the downfall of big brown I. The way they treat employees post-ipo will get out to the public. All we have going for us is our image. It will soon become shamefull to be a UPSer.

Mr. Casey's vision is gone due to corporate greed.

I work in a TSC as a technician in an unnamed northwestern call center. I want to post this mainly for the TSC/TSG out there. I think there has been a lot of wild speculation at this point, and a pain in the ass flame war between Tieguy and Trickpony1 which have had very little to do with an issue that is important to me. (read: STFU, both y'all will still have a job.)

I'll likely be cut at the end of all of this.

what I have heard from management at this point is a portion of what NCRTSCISME has stated.

"All 8 TSC departments will be closed down this year (these are the call center technicians, all of them in the U.S...the guys you talk to when you dial 1-888-UPS-TECH)
- They will not all be closing at the same time...------ will be closed in Feb. "

Other TSC department close dates were not brought up. As to "frozen reassignments", the opposite appears to be the case. While everything seems to revolve around length of service, it is clear that management does want to do everything possible for the employees and is not pleased with the turn of events. I'd also like to say that few if any people in this department resent the local management, and that I personally don't feel we are oppressed or that we would be fired at the drop of a hat.

What is hardest for me is that our TSC is practically a model of efficiancy, and we have reliably had very high numbers comparatively, in addition to a team spirit that I haven't seen anywhere else I've worked. I think some folks are very concerned about how they will be making rent or mortgage, and I honestly would rather see myself cut that one of these folks with 10+ years in who may not be able to find a quality job soon enough. In general though, while I won't say I speak for the rest of the TSC, I think the mood is "what comes next" and not "what is being done to us."

Anonymous:
If you are in Portland, you guys are indeed awesome!
I will not be missing Ontario, sorry to say.

Hope you guys come out on top in the end!

Originally Posted by Anonymous Coward

Its going to be the downfall of big brown I. The way they treat employees post-ipo will get out to the public. All we have going for us is our image. It will soon become shamefull to be a UPSer.

Mr. Casey's vision is gone due to corporate greed.

Soon become shamefull? It's already like that in our district. You can ask any department the same question..."Are you proud to tell people you work for UPS?" .. 98% of the time you'll get something like "No, I am ashamed due to the companys actions lately.", "No, I don't advertise it.", etc...

[dablues]

We heard about downsizing last Tuesday and we still haven't heard anything official yet in regards to numbers and timeframes. Rumor is tomorrow we'll get something official.
Somebody (Tieguy?) asked why we should keep 400 techs we don't need. I agree but I ask who decided we were overstaffed by 400 techs? The board that voted a possible 250% bonus, the group that decided that the late air could wait until tomorrow or the people who decided money was more important than customer service service.

[ncrtscisme]

DABLUES...
I work at a TSC somewhere in the NORTH CENTRAL area, we were informed today of the following (of course, this may be different than what goes for your TSC):

If your date of hire was JULY 1999 or earlier, there will be a fulltime position available for you...of course, depending on your place in seniority, it might not be very convenient but you will be offered one. If you decide to take severance, which in turn would open up a job for someone below you, you will be awarded severance PLUS an additional 4 weeks of pay for it.

If your date of hire was between AUGUST 1999 and MARCH 2000 you will be considered in the "full time at risk" group. This means that there will only be part time positions for you and that's it. The additional 4 weeks pay for severance does not apply for you.

If your date of hire was between APRIL 2000 and the present you will be considered in the "employment at risk" group. This means there will be no job for you. You can NOT move to another department, and one of the terms of the severance contract is that you will never apply to work at UPS again. Severance will be 2 weeks pay + a week for every year you worked + unused vacation days for the whole year + unused discretionary days for the whole year.

***THESE DATES ARE GIVEN UNDER THE ASSUMPTION THAT NOBODY IN THE "SAFE" GROUP TAKES A SEVERANCE AND LEAVES. IF SOMEONE THERE TAKES THE SEVERANCE (WITH 4 ADDITIONAL WEEKS PAY) THEN THE ORDER MOVES UP TO THE NEXT-IN-LINE TECHNICIAN BY SENIORITY...SO, IT IS POSSIBLE TO STILL GET A FULL TIME JOB IF YOU ARE IN THE "FULL TIME AT RISK" GROUP.

[justcurious]

I just cannot believe that management would blow the minds of all the technical workforce by talking of downsizing and not having a plan at all. Just the word last Tuesday and still nothing new about the plans. Seems as though the managers are keeping things really quiet, trying to plot against us. Do they really think that the people that get to stay are going to be loyal to the company and department? I think not....everyone will remember this forever, much like the strikers remember the scabs. And, since the downsizing will happen, does that mean there is more money in the budget so we can get a pay raise that might equal cost of living? Last years 3% did not help.
By the way I have heard that J. Bevis in corp TSG is behind these reductions. I wonder if he was ever a tech or just became to be in TSG management.

[dablues]

ncrtscime
Good info about TSC. Not quite as bad early rumors. Have you heard anything about TSG in your area?

[solorun1176]

We Need A Union. It is NOT to late. Fellow coworkers if you are serious about organizing a union. Forward your name, a contact phone number, city and state where you are located to the webmaster at www.uatups.com. UATUPS has an offical labor union organization ready and willing to support the Administrative and Technical employees' decision to unionize. Remember, "STRENGTH COMES IN NUMBERS."

[ncrtscisme]

Dablues...
TSG is in that same situation i explained above...we are all in the same "list": TSC, D46 and D47 TSG (external and internal), and CACH...basically, all the chicagoland area technicians...the other districts in our region are doing it seperately, Wisconsin and Indiana haven't lost anybody and I don't know about the other few districts yet.

*** ****** is the man responsible for this. PMT was his baby and he was hell bent on making a name for himself by proving we were overstaffed. Nice Job ***. Thanks.

TSG MGT fought like hell against this crap and lost. Most local MGT knows not to stick their neck out by now but these guys tried anyway. So I give credit where due.

It looks like about 80 techs are losing their jobs this time around in the NCR, with the vast majority being the NCR TSC, NIL, Metro Chicago and CACH. Wonder who is gonna pick up the slack? I sure hope the sups still have some semblance of their minds left.

As far as pay goes we make more around the bigger cities because it costs so damn much to live here. 25 an hour looks good on paper until you see what real estate and rent costs around here.

Bottom line for me? Whoever is left better organize so you can stop the sorry ass increases, no cost of living raise, rising health costs and end the "make it up as we go along" style of management. See you guys tomorrow.

[TSCer]

I always felt like the MGT is the fat of this company. If ups really wants to save some dough they should lay off a bunch of them too. I heard SIL lost 3 and Wisconsin 3. None in Indiana, and what about 80 for NIL Metro and CACH?

Since your post was censored I assume we all can find his name in PMT's PNB entry.

We all need to focus on how we are going to create a union without MGT knowing, much like the UPS logo was all behind the scenes and almost no one knew. Let's start networking and get non-UPS email addresses and non-UPS phone numbers from your fellow TSG/TSC'ers. We all need to remember that this has to be done on your time, not UPS's time! Lunch hour works great for this. A union liaison needs to be created for each district TSG/TSC and work with this new union team. As soon as the leg work is done we'll unveil it to the MGT. Remember the team work that we are famous for right? Let's all rise to the occasion again and make this count! We just can't sit hear sloshing around in each others tears here on this board.

C'mon you guys and gals! Let's make a deal with yourself here. If you accomplish at least one thing at work tomorrow let be on your lunch break by telling at least two of your TSC/TSG buddies about this thread. They will need to come here and then do their part by telling at least two of their buddies the next day. Let's get the snowball rolling!

[UPS_Techie]

This reply is in regards to many of the earlier posts:

No Sups or Mgrs will be affected in my area. None. Nobody has been moved. In fact, we just had a new Sup come in and replace a promotion in the last few weeks. Our District alone will be losing 30-40 Techs, not MGMT jobs. 10% of the estimated company total.

$25-$32... I've been a Tech for double digit years, a UPS employee for nearly 20 and I'm not close to that figure. Not sure where in the US or CA that rate is being paid but, I'd like to do some bumping to get there.

It's a sad shame because it's slammed into our heads about promotion within and how we all have secure jobs. Now this. It's pretty bad when you find out that these jobs are being cut on Browncafe.com before anything was relayed to us, the affected grade 10 and 11 positions. Our MGMT team is still giving almost no details. I've learned and confirmed more on this website. Thanks Browncafe!

UPS has more managment trainees and Co-ops than Techs. The Fat is in the MGMT side and it shows everyday. You see groups of 5-10 MGMT people walking out at Noon for lunch and returning at 2pm... and I mean groups.

I did take the advice and visited the Union site. I signed up to vote yes.To answer the question posted before, what would the Union do for us. Well, just as other unionized departments would walk out for the Divers, Mechs and inside employees, they would also walk for TSG/TSC. We do need a Union!

Speaking of Union action. We as TSG/TSC folks were the ones that were FORCED to deliver and process the packages during the last Strike. Just another example of the thanks we get from our Company. First we're threatened by the guys that make the money for us, now we're being eliminated by the ones that sent us out. Man were we wrong.

To Tieguy: The Union doesn't pay much money during a Strike but, they provide a better rate throughout the contract years. It would more than makeup for a two week pay loss. We're not at Ford. We're at UPS. We don't make an inferior product, we offer a superior service. Shutup.