Strike authorization vote for 705

[Bubblehead]

Originally Posted by moreluck

A loaf of bread is a rye.

AWRY !!

(my apologies ahead of time)

Damn spell check let me down again! I knew it didn't look right. Maybe somebody should develope a context check button.

[705red]

Originally Posted by drewed

why did THEY wait till June? why did YOU wait till june????
You HAD the opportunity to make UPS the biggest ugliest company ever! you could have given them what you wanted in your contract last year when the economy hadnt taken a dump and there was good feelings with the national going well. If they hadnt come to the table you could have played it out in the media and gotten other locals on board.
But no you sat on your thumbs just as much UPS; now you're in the middle of a lake without a paddle. You cant debate economics because the economics are shiet, you can't get the national on board because CMON who would be foolish enough to strike in this economy?
Hey atleast theres some good news coming out of Chicago the Cubs are kicking arse and football seasons just around the corner!

Hey maybe were you are from the men dont have stones but in chicago we have enough stones to strike, no matter what the economy is like.
I see ups say that volume is down, well that makes me wonder were? Because here we are busier than this time last year, stops are up and so are 9.5 grievances. Im not talking because routes are being busted, my averagre monday is around 120 125 delivery stops today was 147 and it has been this way for the last several weeks. Ups might be hurting in other parts of the country but not here. This region is the biggest source of revenue for ups nationwide, more packages move through chicago than any other city.

If you remember last november we were on a 72 hour notice to strike as the national was being resolved over ups's arrogance. Atlanta had to fly in the big boys from corporate to defuse what there regional labor manager started. Now this same guy is as arroagant as ever. Maybe its because the guy that calmed things down from atlanta has retired and hes been taken off of his leash, but we will soon find out.

In walking my building this morning and tonight there are mixed views, and I answered everyones questions as best i could. Now its upto them to vote whats best for them and their famiy. Will see sunday.

[tieguy]

Originally Posted by 705red

Hey maybe were you are from the men dont have stones but in chicago we have enough stones to strike, no matter what the economy is like.
I see ups say that volume is down, well that makes me wonder were? Because here we are busier than this time last year, stops are up and so are 9.5 grievances. Im not talking because routes are being busted, my averagre monday is around 120 125 delivery stops today was 147 and it has been this way for the last several weeks. Ups might be hurting in other parts of the country but not here. This region is the biggest source of revenue for ups nationwide, more packages move through chicago than any other city.

If you remember last november we were on a 72 hour notice to strike as the national was being resolved over ups's arrogance. Atlanta had to fly in the big boys from corporate to defuse what there regional labor manager started. Now this same guy is as arroagant as ever. Maybe its because the guy that calmed things down from atlanta has retired and hes been taken off of his leash, but we will soon find out.

In walking my building this morning and tonight there are mixed views, and I answered everyones questions as best i could. Now its upto them to vote whats best for them and their famiy. Will see sunday.

10 percent voting 100 percent to give the union strike authorization?

[tieguy]

Originally Posted by Bubblehead

What happened to the Tie Guy? His posts are lucid, explicit, inquisitive, and has drawn no ire from anybody today. I even agreed with his summation on negotiation extremes from both sides. Will it last? Has somebody hacked his password? Something is a rye.

not recieving any lucid responses. Same response being thats the way its always been done.

My understanding of our labor history is:

negotiations at one time were tied into master freight. teamsters get whatever master freight gets.

then many locals branched off and had their own negotiations.

this led to the 76 strike where much of the east coast was down for 13 weeks.

This led to many being negotiated under a national teamster contract with local supplements.

For some reason Chicago stayed seperate. Why.

Second question red you mentioned how the chicago locals stayed out an extra couple of days in 97. But I also heard those same locals continued working for a couple of days when the rest of the country first went out?

[drewed]

Originally Posted by 705red

Hey maybe were you are from the men dont have stones but in chicago we have enough stones to strike, no matter what the economy is like.
I see ups say that volume is down, well that makes me wonder were? Because here we are busier than this time last year, stops are up and so are 9.5 grievances. Im not talking because routes are being busted, my averagre monday is around 120 125 delivery stops today was 147 and it has been this way for the last several weeks. Ups might be hurting in other parts of the country but not here. This region is the biggest source of revenue for ups nationwide, more packages move through chicago than any other city.

If you remember last november we were on a 72 hour notice to strike as the national was being resolved over ups's arrogance. Atlanta had to fly in the big boys from corporate to defuse what there regional labor manager started. Now this same guy is as arroagant as ever. Maybe its because the guy that calmed things down from atlanta has retired and hes been taken off of his leash, but we will soon find out.

In walking my building this morning and tonight there are mixed views, and I answered everyones questions as best i could. Now its upto them to vote whats best for them and their famiy. Will see sunday.

Umm wheres the answer to my question?
Domestic volume is down, you cant debate that and the fact that your volume is up; just says people are moving to cities because thats where the jobs are at.
Go ahead and strike I dont care, I wouldnt toot the 705s horn that much; UPS can live on without it.
And one shouldnt question ones testicular fortitude when one doesnt have a brick to stand on...One shouldnt accuse UPS of being arrogant when you havent resolved your own arrogance.

[dillweed]

Originally Posted by drewed

Umm wheres the answer to my question?
Domestic volume is down, you cant debate that and the fact that your volume is up; just says people are moving to cities because thats where the jobs are at.
Go ahead and strike I dont care, I wouldnt toot the 705s horn that much; UPS can live on without it.
And one shouldnt question ones testicular fortitude when one doesnt have a brick to stand on...One shouldnt accuse UPS of being arrogant when you havent resolved your own arrogance.

Drewed, did I misunderstand your post or did you say that UPS can live on without Chicago?

[IDoLessWorkThanMost]

Originally Posted by drewed

Umm wheres the answer to my question?
Domestic volume is down, you cant debate that and the fact that your volume is up; just says people are moving to cities because thats where the jobs are at.
Go ahead and strike I dont care, I wouldnt toot the 705s horn that much; UPS can live on without it.
And one shouldnt question ones testicular fortitude when one doesnt have a brick to stand on...One shouldnt accuse UPS of being arrogant when you havent resolved your own arrogance.

You have to be kidding.

UPS does not need a strike in Chicago, and that probably will not happen.

[HEFFERNAN]

I'm curious if UPS just keeps sliding the same contract the rest of us signed (with minor enhancements)?

I know everyone in Chicago keeps saying that "We've always had our own contract" and "We have seen the faults of the master contract and won't accept them"

I have 3 points on this:

(1) Chicago keeps on using "we" when it should be "us". I know you have you're own contract, but this isn't the time to fight over what Hoffa screwed up on. I predict major labor problems at the end of this contract because Hoffa and his team will try to get back everything they lost on this one (if they are even reelected). Fighting for it all back today isn't a good idea.

(2) Louisville is the keystone of the UPS national empire, not Chicago. I understand more volume goes through Chicago probably. I can see the argument that east meets west in the trainyards of Chicago. BUT all the money and all the revenue sweeps through their city on airplanes. If their local went on strike, that would cripple the company alot faster and harder than Chicago.

(3) I can't see how your 2 locals can't sign the national contract and just have a supplement like other regions. I'm curious why UPS does it this way, or the reasoning behind it. (not accepting it's always been that way as an answer).

I'm just making arguments and will enjoy reading the feedbacks.

[705red]

Originally Posted by tieguy

not recieving any lucid responses. Same response being thats the way its always been done.

My understanding of our labor history is:

negotiations at one time were tied into master freight. teamsters get whatever master freight gets.

then many locals branched off and had their own negotiations.

this led to the 76 strike where much of the east coast was down for 13 weeks.

This led to many being negotiated under a national teamster contract with local supplements.

For some reason Chicago stayed seperate. Why.

Second question red you mentioned how the chicago locals stayed out an extra couple of days in 97. But I also heard those same locals continued working for a couple of days when the rest of the country first went out?

Tie in 97 705 walked out with the national at the same time that sunday night. 710 for some reason did not go on strike, probably due to bad leadership at the time. 705 had to put up picket lines at these 710 buildings in the chicago area and others locals did the same across the midwest. If 710 did work i couldnt have been for more than a day. 710 upsers honored all picket lines that were put up.

[705red]

Originally Posted by HEFFERNAN

I'm curious if UPS just keeps sliding the same contract the rest of us signed (with minor enhancements)?

I know everyone in Chicago keeps saying that "We've always had our own contract" and "We have seen the faults of the master contract and won't accept them"

I have 3 points on this:

(1) Chicago keeps on using "we" when it should be "us". I know you have you're own contract, but this isn't the time to fight over what Hoffa screwed up on. I predict major labor problems at the end of this contract because Hoffa and his team will try to get back everything they lost on this one (if they are even reelected). Fighting for it all back today isn't a good idea.

As you can see the contracts proposed to us does not even mirror the national to this point, its a worse contract that you you guys/gals have received.

(2) Louisville is the keystone of the UPS national empire, not Chicago. I understand more volume goes through Chicago probably. I can see the argument that east meets west in the trainyards of Chicago. BUT all the money and all the revenue sweeps through their city on airplanes. If their local went on strike, that would cripple the company alot faster and harder than Chicago.

Louisville is the main air hub for next day airs. The rockford area here deals with alot of 2nd day airs, while our cach facility has over 6000 teamsters working there. The rail yards here are union to and they would not unload or load struck goods making it next to impossible for packages to get in or out.

(3) I can't see how your 2 locals can't sign the national contract and just have a supplement like other regions. I'm curious why UPS does it this way, or the reasoning behind it. (not accepting it's always been that way as an answer).

I'm just making arguments and will enjoy reading the feedbacks.

I will try and find out exactly why we are seperate and get back to you tonight sometime.

[705red]

Originally Posted by drewed

Umm wheres the answer to my question?
Domestic volume is down, you cant debate that and the fact that your volume is up; just says people are moving to cities because thats where the jobs are at.

705 just does not deliver to the big city chicago. We cover alot of ground and deliver to small towns were the volume here is not down. If it wasnt from reading this site i would think ups is having another great year and growing. But some of you say that your down in volume and all i was saying is we are not.
Go ahead and strike I dont care, I wouldnt toot the 705s horn that much; UPS can live on without it.

You have never said what you do with this company? What is you job? Clearly your hands have no idea what your brain is doing by your last sentence alone!

And one shouldnt question ones testicular fortitude when one doesnt have a brick to stand on...One shouldnt accuse UPS of being arrogant when you havent resolved your own arrogance.

Theres times in life when men need to be men and do whats right. You might not agree that the vote is called for, but what else should the union do? Work without a contract for months?

I spoke of a couple ups people being arrogant not the company ups! Slow down when you read big boy talk as not to confuse yourself!

[ups79]

Originally Posted by 705red

Tie in 97 705 walked out with the national at the same time that sunday night. 710 for some reason did not go on strike, probably due to bad leadership at the time. 705 had to put up picket lines at these 710 buildings in the chicago area and others locals did the same across the midwest. If 710 did work i couldnt have been for more than a day. 710 upsers honored all picket lines that were put up.

Not all 710 upsers honored all picket lines that were put up.

[tieguy]

Originally Posted by 705red

Tie in 97 705 walked out with the national at the same time that sunday night. 710 for some reason did not go on strike, probably due to bad leadership at the time. 705 had to put up picket lines at these 710 buildings in the chicago area and others locals did the same across the midwest. If 710 did work i couldnt have been for more than a day. 710 upsers honored all picket lines that were put up.

thought I heard that. was kind of busy at the time for some reason.

[tieguy]

As you can see the contracts proposed to us does not even mirror the national to this point, its a worse contract that you you guys/gals have received.


Not sure . You have some interesting wording in yours. Some of it sounds like ups gave the ship away. then other language sounds like its weaker. Your debate about the 22.3's is a non issue here.

[dillweed]

Originally Posted by ups79

Not all 710 upsers honored all picket lines that were put up.

We didn't have a picket line at our center but we sure as hell didn't work.

[brownman15]

Originally Posted by HEFFERNAN

I'm curious if UPS just keeps sliding the same contract the rest of us signed (with minor enhancements)?

no


I have 3 points on this:

(1) Chicago keeps on using "we" when it should be "us". I know you have you're own contract, but this isn't the time to fight over what Hoffa screwed up on. I predict major labor problems at the end of this contract because Hoffa and his team will try to get back everything they lost on this one (if they are even reelected). Fighting for it all back today isn't a good idea.

hoffa is not negotiating this contract 705 negotiates it own contract

[ups79]

Originally Posted by dillweed

We didn't have a picket line at our center but we sure as hell didn't work.

Well, we did work.

[705red]

Originally Posted by tieguy

As you can see the contracts proposed to us does not even mirror the national to this point, its a worse contract that you you guys/gals have received.


Not sure . You have some interesting wording in yours. Some of it sounds like ups gave the ship away. then other language sounds like its weaker. Your debate about the 22.3's is a non issue here.

Ups wants to go to an oncall feeder list here in 705. Problem with this is it takes about 14 years to make it to feeder, so now you have to give up your 40 hour guarantee in package to sit at home and hope you get called. Not going to happen!

Ups wants to eliminate competion language, which will allow ups freight and other ups companies to do our work.

ups wants to switch the language addressing the work week as monday through friday to any 5 days in a 7 day period.

Under fmla ups will allow you to return to your job if its still there and you have not been replaced, so you could lose your regular position? NO

Ups now wants seniority to be determined by continous service, so if your on disability or workmans comp you can lose your seniority.

It goes on tie, our most outragous request was 10x your pay rate penalty pay for sups working.

Research it yourself.

[pontiac467]

Originally Posted by 705red

Tie in 97 705 walked out with the national at the same time that sunday night. 710 for some reason did not go on strike, probably due to bad leadership at the time. 705 had to put up picket lines at these 710 buildings in the chicago area and others locals did the same across the midwest. If 710 did work i couldnt have been for more than a day. 710 upsers honored all picket lines that were put up.

there is a no strike clause in our contract (710)

[705red]

Originally Posted by tieguy

As you can see the contracts proposed to us does not even mirror the national to this point, its a worse contract that you you guys/gals have received.


Not sure . You have some interesting wording in yours. Some of it sounds like ups gave the ship away. then other language sounds like its weaker. Your debate about the 22.3's is a non issue here.

Tie ups encourages us to do our best and represent the shield to the best of our ability. Yet they (chicago, atlanta) cant show the same sense of urgency when it comes to this contract, they expect us to work with on a day in and day out basis. Ups should practice what they preach to the back bone of this company, the employees and lead by example.

[pontiac467]

Originally Posted by 705red

Ups wants to go to an oncall feeder list here in 705. Problem with this is it takes about 14 years to make it to feeder, so now you have to give up your 40 hour guarantee in package to sit at home and hope you get called. Not going to happen!

What do you mean when you say on call feeder list because in 710 anyone who goes to feeder either from the outside or from inside has to go to the bottom of the list and the only people that are guaranteed 40 hours are people that have bid runs. I know this because im still on call and it sucks, sometimes i get a vacation run for the week and sometimes i sit by the phone and never get called in. We can work inside loading trailers but we dont get paid the same rate as a driver.

Is it not like that now in 705?

[55andout?]

Originally Posted by tieguy

So is it different or not?

Does chicago have a national and supplemental contract?
Or is it one.

Does the national contract apply to chicago in any way?

Why don't the two chicago locals fall under the national. Why do they insist on being seperate?

Tie, you can only vote one time on the national contract. That is not the Chicago way when it comes to voting on anything. Here you can vote early and often, legal or illegal and my favorite, dead or alive. I believe that is why the locals are seperate from the national. That and they always like to add a few things just to make them feel special.

Hey and just asking, have any of you guys ever talked with Gerald Zero? Wow! That was an experience not worth repeating.

[HEFFERNAN]

Originally Posted by 705red

Ups wants to go to an oncall feeder list here in 705. Problem with this is it takes about 14 years to make it to feeder, so now you have to give up your 40 hour guarantee in package to sit at home and hope you get called. Not going to happen!

Ups wants to eliminate competion language, which will allow ups freight and other ups companies to do our work.

ups wants to switch the language addressing the work week as monday through friday to any 5 days in a 7 day period.

Under fmla ups will allow you to return to your job if its still there and you have not been replaced, so you could lose your regular position? NO

Ups now wants seniority to be determined by continous service, so if your on disability or workmans comp you can lose your seniority.

It goes on tie, our most outragous request was 10x your pay rate penalty pay for sups working.

Research it yourself.

From reading this, it does sound like UPS is trying to change words around to give themselves an advantage. That whole post about (will and shall) in the other forum sums it up perfect.
I would never even of thought of changing mon-fri workweek into 5 consecutive days out of 7

Keep fighting the fight and keep us posted 705red



Let's hope UPS brings more labor negotiators and less english teachers to your next session

[drewed]

Originally Posted by 705red

Ups wants to go to an oncall feeder list here in 705. Problem with this is it takes about 14 years to make it to feeder, so now you have to give up your 40 hour guarantee in package to sit at home and hope you get called. Not going to happen!

Ups wants to eliminate competion language, which will allow ups freight and other ups companies to do our work.

ups wants to switch the language addressing the work week as monday through friday to any 5 days in a 7 day period.

Under fmla ups will allow you to return to your job if its still there and you have not been replaced, so you could lose your regular position? NO

Ups now wants seniority to be determined by continous service, so if your on disability or workmans comp you can lose your seniority.

It goes on tie, our most outragous request was 10x your pay rate penalty pay for sups working.

Research it yourself.

And none of that sounds unreasonable, except for the 10x for sup working. because that is really up to interpretation for what working is...im training a new employee showing him how to load a can, and 20 people grieve it because the 20 mins i spent with him is 80 bucks in their pocket (in their mind atleast) it would cause way too many frivilous grievances
if you go pt to driver you sit on the bench for awhile, do you not? why would you think you wouldnt do it in feeders?

You cant bitch about having a PB delivery the size of a couch, when the company has the larger box trucks to do it, and you dont want them to use them.

alot of drivers dont expierence this but up here most of our 22.3s arent monday through friday, some have split days off (per bid choice) and non of them complain about it

and it should be continous service, if youre on disablity you shouldnt be gaining senority and you shouldnt be losing it either and since most fts are month apart in seniority its a non issue

[705red]

Originally Posted by pontiac467

What do you mean when you say on call feeder list because in 710 anyone who goes to feeder either from the outside or from inside has to go to the bottom of the list and the only people that are guaranteed 40 hours are people that have bid runs. I know this because im still on call and it sucks, sometimes i get a vacation run for the week and sometimes i sit by the phone and never get called in. We can work inside loading trailers but we dont get paid the same rate as a driver.

Is it not like that now in 705?

When you go feeder in 705 you do not go onto an on call list, typically you will driver everyday. You are not in the top 90% but our language allows you to bid the same start time for the week.

The problem i hear from 710 you cant bid out of your building into feeder and not every building has feeder work which leads to hiring off of the street for 710 feeder drivers