Ridiculous Grievance Panel

[big_arrow_up]

I downloaded the Grievance Panel decisions off of makeupsdeliver.com and it is very clear how the company has little regard or respect for the contract. The long list of deadlocked cases speaks for itself but one caught my eye......


"Chair McCabe called Case N-193-09: Local 177 v. UPS, Hillside, NJ
On behalf of all affected
employees, Union alleges that
the Company violated Article 37
and Article 18. The Company’s
decision to keep Manager **** in its Package operations
whereby he has constant contact
with bargaining unit employees,
has placed the safety and well-
being of all employees in
serious jeopardy. *** has
demonstrated a history of
inappropriate and violent
behavior which culminated in
him smacking two drivers in the
back of their head.
DECISION: Based on the facts presented, case is DEADLOCKED. "

Deadlocked? You've got to be kidding me!

[Hoaxster]

Originally Posted by big_arrow_up

I downloaded the Grievance Panel decisions off of makeupsdeliver.com and it is very clear how the company has little regard or respect for the contract. The long list of deadlocked cases speaks for itself but one caught my eye......


"Chair McCabe called Case N-193-09: Local 177 v. UPS, Hillside, NJ
On behalf of all affected
employees, Union alleges that
the Company violated Article 37
and Article 18. The Company’s
decision to keep Manager *** in its Package operations
whereby he has constant contact
with bargaining unit employees,
has placed the safety and well-
being of all employees in
serious jeopardy. **** has
demonstrated a history of
inappropriate and violent
behavior which culminated in
him smacking two drivers in the
back of their head.
DECISION: Based on the facts presented, case is DEADLOCKED. "

Deadlocked? You've got to be kidding me!

Yep ... absolutely clear cut with no sense of subjective judgment here.

Assuming it is true, UPS will move him, in due time, to another position somewhere and hopefully some EAP help for anger management.

[Solidarity413]

Originally Posted by big_arrow_up

I downloaded the Grievance Panel decisions off of makeupsdeliver.com and it is very clear how the company has little regard or respect for the contract. The long list of deadlocked cases speaks for itself but one caught my eye......


"Chair McCabe called Case N-193-09: Local 177 v. UPS, Hillside, NJ
On behalf of all affected
employees, Union alleges that
the Company violated Article 37
and Article 18. The Company’s
decision to keep Manager **** in its Package operations
whereby he has constant contact
with bargaining unit employees,
has placed the safety and well-
being of all employees in
serious jeopardy. *** has
demonstrated a history of
inappropriate and violent
behavior which culminated in
him smacking two drivers in the
back of their head.
DECISION: Based on the facts presented, case is DEADLOCKED. "

Deadlocked? You've got to be kidding me!

Aww come on in my shop if that was a worker, it'd be deadlocked too. Oh wait, just kidding he'd be fired long ago.

[bubsdad]

We're going through a no violence in the workplace period right now. If you even think about smacking someone in the head you're gonna take the walk of shame.

[705red]

If this is true the company has just opened themselves right up. The next person he assaults just might have to defend themselves. That manager better be very careful who he touches next!

I hope that there is a camera around when/if it happens again!

[JonFrum]

From TDU . . .

" . . . In four days of hearings, the highest UPS grievance body under the contract ruled in favor of the union just four times. The company won 13 cases outright. Another 42 cases were deadlocked. An incredible 78 cases were postponed.

The UPS National Grievance Committee will meet just one more time this year: Oct. 12-15 at the Hilton San Diego Resort and Spa.

Only two of the union wins required the company to pay the grievant and one of these cases involved just 4 hours of overtime. In the other two cases, the company was instructed to comply with the contract and a monetary reward was either assigned to another grievance body to decide or denied outright. What a system!

Thirty-give cases were settled or withdrawn with no details given."

Download the Committee decisions here . . .
http://www.makeupsdeliver.org/news.php

The Company "wins" almost all grievances even if it doesn't win them outright. Delaying a decision for months while the grievance works its way to the top level is a "win" of sorts. And the "win" is extended if the National Committee postpones the grievance for additional months.

A deadlock is also a "win" for the Company because the Company got away with whatever it did, and was not found to be wrong or required to pay any penalty.

Cases that are settled by the parties or withdrawn may also be Company "wins" although that would depend more on the individual details of the cases.

[705red]

Chair Dempsey called Case N-232-09: Local 769 v. UPS, North Miami, FL

On behalf of

Melissa

Tiefenbach, Union alleges that
the Company violated Article
17. On July 17, 2008 the IBT
and UPS reached a settlement on
the appropriate pay rate for
counter clerks in the South
Florida District. The affected
employees did not receive the
agreed to monies until
October 7, 2008. The grievant
is requesting penalties for the
late grievance payment as
stipulated in Article 17 of the
current CBA.
DECISION: Based on the facts and circumstances surrounding the
matter and nature of the settlement, THE GRIEVANCE IN THIS

INSTANT CASE IS DENIED.


This is a joke! The contract is clear! UPS has ten days to pay you your grievance money or penalty starts ticking at half your guarantee per week.
ARTICLE 17
Errors of less than thirty dollars ($30.00) for full-time employees or fifteen dollars ($15.00) for part-time
employees and overages will be corrected in the following weekly paycheck.
Any grievance settlement not paid within ten (10) working days of the settlement shall entitle the
grievant (s) to a penalty payment as outlined above. The ten (10) working day period shall begin
to run when the Labor Department representative agrees to the settlement, or is notified by the
Union or management team of the settlement. The Employer shall pay a maximum of one penalty
payment for a multi-grievant grievance, which shall be subject to the additional penalties set forth
above for untimely payment, until corrected.

[trickpony1]

Originally Posted by JonFrum

From TDU . . .

" . . . In four days of hearings, the highest UPS grievance body under the contract ruled in favor of the union just four times. The company won 13 cases outright. Another 42 cases were deadlocked. An incredible 78 cases were postponed.

The UPS National Grievance Committee will meet just one more time this year: Oct. 12-15 at the Hilton San Diego Resort and Spa.

Only two of the union wins required the company to pay the grievant and one of these cases involved just 4 hours of overtime. In the other two cases, the company was instructed to comply with the contract and a monetary reward was either assigned to another grievance body to decide or denied outright. What a system!

Thirty-give cases were settled or withdrawn with no details given."

Download the Committee decisions here . . .
http://www.makeupsdeliver.org/news.php

The Company "wins" almost all grievances even if it doesn't win them outright. Delaying a decision for months while the grievance works its way to the top level is a "win" of sorts. And the "win" is extended if the National Committee postpones the grievance for additional months.

A deadlock is also a "win" for the Company because the Company got away with whatever it did, and was not found to be wrong or required to pay any penalty.

Cases that are settled by the parties or withdrawn may also be Company "wins" although that would depend more on the individual details of the cases.

.....and I'm pissing away $18 a week (just under $1000 a year) for this type of representation?
What a deal.
No wonder so many people are stepping out of the union.

[Hoaxster]

Originally Posted by trickpony1

.....and I'm pissing away $18 a week (just under $1000 a year) for this type of representation?
What a deal.
No wonder so many people are stepping out of the union.

Looks like it's time for you to go into management ... whatdya say?

[trickpony1]

Originally Posted by Hoaxster

Looks like it's time for you to go into management ... whatdya say?

that's not gonna happen.

[big_arrow_up]

What next? Do all these cases go to arbitration? My opinion of UPS sure took a nose dive after I read all of these.

[Mike23]

Originally Posted by Hoaxster

Yep ... absolutely clear cut with no sense of subjective judgment here.

Assuming it is true, UPS will move him, in due time, to another position somewhere and hopefully some EAP help for anger management.

I'm actually surprised they didn't try to fire the drivers first and claim they assaulted this nut job. 'Yes sir, I was flailing wildly and these peoples heads came into contact with my hand. They assaulted ME. '

[Hoaxster]

Originally Posted by Mike23

I'm actually surprised they didn't try to fire the drivers first and claim they assaulted this nut job. 'Yes sir, I was flailing wildly and these peoples heads came into contact with my hand. They assaulted ME. '

I think that is what they said.

However, I was referring to the truth.

[soberups]

Originally Posted by trickpony1

.....and I'm pissing away $18 a week (just under $1000 a year) for this type of representation?
What a deal.
No wonder so many people are stepping out of the union.

How is the union to "blame" for a deadlock?

The panel is composed of equal numbers of management and union reps. If the company chooses to it can deadlock every case that comes before it, and force it to arbitration.

[DS]

Originally Posted by soberups

How is the union to "blame" for a deadlock?

The panel is composed of equal numbers of management and union reps. If the company chooses to it can deadlock every case that comes before it, and force it to arbitration.

Maybe because the union members are good friends with management,and dont give a rats ass about anyone but themselves.
I agree with trickpony,the teamsters have become a facade of a union.
I hate giving my money to the mob.

[705red]

Originally Posted by DS

Maybe because the union members are good friends with management,and dont give a rats ass about anyone but themselves.
I agree with trickpony,the teamsters have become a facade of a union.
I hate giving my money to the mob.

Hold on now! There are alot of good Teamster locals out there. Look at the cases and see what locals are doing the right thing only to have the cases deadlocked. Locals 70, 177 etc.

A deadlock is not a sell out from the union. A deadlock means that the company disagrees with the grievance/resolution and the union believes that it is a good grievance.

Now after a deadlock there is a time frame for the union to notify UPS that they will be sending the case to arbitration. Now I would love to see a list of grievances that are awaiting arbitration.

[JonFrum]

Originally Posted by soberups

How is the union to "blame" for a deadlock?

The panel is composed of equal numbers of management and union reps. If the company chooses to it can deadlock every case that comes before it, and force it to arbitration.

True.

Nevertheless,
The Union appointed half the panel members.

The Union argued its side of the case and didn't persuade even one member on the other side.

The Union created the whole grievance panel system in the first place.

The Union negotiated, re-negotiated and fine-tuned the system's details with every new Contract.

The Unon decided that the decisionmakers should be selected by loyalty to the Company and loyalty to the Union, and not on the basis of neutrality, good reputation, fairmindedness, justice, objectivity, consistency, respect for the Rule of Law, etc.

The Union allowed UPS to violate the Contract all these years by not putting a stop to its tactics during that time.

The Union agrees to abide by the panel decisions, respects its authority, and always unanimously endorces the Contracts (which contains the language creating the panels and governing their operation) and calls them the best Contracts ever.

The Union sticks with the system no matter how disfunctional it is.

The Union keeps the operation and decisions of the panel largely secret. For years we heard nothing about it. Only this year has word leaked out. And that is from TDU, not the Union. You can't fix something if you don't know much about it, or how badly it's broken.
- - - - -
National Grievance Panel Decisions, June 2009:
http://www.makeupsdeliver.org/e107_f..._june_2009.pdf

National Grievance Panel Docket, June 2009:
http://www.makeupsdeliver.org/e107_f...t-june2009.pdf

Joint National Air Committee Docket, June 2009:
http://www.makeupsdeliver.org/e107_f...r-june2009.pdf

National Grievance Panel Decisions, February 2009:
http://tdu.org/files/ngcminutes-feb09.pdf

National Grievance Panel Docket, February 2009:
http://www.makeupsdeliver.org/e107_f...nalfeb2009.pdf

[DS]

Originally Posted by 705red

Hold on now! There are alot of good Teamster locals out there. Look at the cases and see what locals are doing the right thing only to have the cases deadlocked. .

Yea whatever,I only know what I see first hand.
In your world red, the ibt may be effective,where I am they are crap.

[pemanager]

Originally Posted by big_arrow_up

What next? Do all these cases go to arbitration? My opinion of UPS sure took a nose dive after I read all of these.

Big,

Honest question, why does your opinion of UPS take a nose dive after reading these? There is no back-up documentation, additional information, etc. included. These are allegations, which may not be substantiated and / or they are, hopefully, legitimate differences of opinion on interpretation of the contract. From my experience, most grievances that are clear cut (black and white contract language) are settled early in the process. The ones that make it this far are where people legitimately disagree or there are issues with the 'facts'.

To answer your question, these cases only go to arbitration if the Teamsters decide to take it there. Due to the possible expense of arbitration if you lose, only the 'strong' cases would go.

More valuable information would be how many of these grievances do the Teamsters have enough confidence in to take to arbitration and how many win there.

[big_arrow_up]

Originally Posted by pemanager

Big,

Honest question, why does your opinion of UPS take a nose dive after reading these? There is no back-up documentation, additional information, etc. included. These are allegations, which may not be substantiated and / or they are, hopefully, legitimate differences of opinion on interpretation of the contract. From my experience, most grievances that are clear cut (black and white contract language) are settled early in the process. The ones that make it this far are where people legitimately disagree or there are issues with the 'facts'.

To answer your question, these cases only go to arbitration if the Teamsters decide to take it there. Due to the possible expense of arbitration if you lose, only the 'strong' cases would go.

More valuable information would be how many of these grievances do the Teamsters have enough confidence in to take to arbitration and how many win there.

How many clear cut violations are there on that download? Plenty. Over 9.5 grievances are cut and dry. Either a driver was worked over 9.5 three days in a week or they weren't. There should be no discussion. The company is just stalling.

[tieguy]

Originally Posted by big_arrow_up

I downloaded the Grievance Panel decisions off of makeupsdeliver.com and it is very clear how the company has little regard or respect for the contract. The long list of deadlocked cases speaks for itself but one caught my eye......


"Chair McCabe called Case N-193-09: Local 177 v. UPS, Hillside, NJ
On behalf of all affected
employees, Union alleges that
the Company violated Article 37
and Article 18. The Company’s
decision to keep Manager **** in its Package operations
whereby he has constant contact
with bargaining unit employees,
has placed the safety and well-
being of all employees in
serious jeopardy. *** has
demonstrated a history of
inappropriate and violent
behavior which culminated in
him smacking two drivers in the
back of their head.
DECISION: Based on the facts presented, case is DEADLOCKED. "

Deadlocked? You've got to be kidding me!

a deadlock is three company against and three union for. I would think there were no witnesses or the manager would be on the street?

[tieguy]

Originally Posted by 705red

Chair Dempsey called Case N-232-09: Local 769 v. UPS, North Miami, FL

On behalf of

Melissa

Tiefenbach, Union alleges that

the Company violated Article
17. On July 17, 2008 the IBT
and UPS reached a settlement on
the appropriate pay rate for
counter clerks in the South
Florida District. The affected
employees did not receive the
agreed to monies until
October 7, 2008. The grievant
is requesting penalties for the
late grievance payment as
stipulated in Article 17 of the
current CBA.
DECISION: Based on the facts and circumstances surrounding the
matter and nature of the settlement, THE GRIEVANCE IN THIS

INSTANT CASE IS DENIED.

This is a joke! The contract is clear! UPS has ten days to pay you your grievance money or penalty starts ticking at half your guarantee per week.
ARTICLE 17
Errors of less than thirty dollars ($30.00) for full-time employees or fifteen dollars ($15.00) for part-time
employees and overages will be corrected in the following weekly paycheck.
Any grievance settlement not paid within ten (10) working days of the settlement shall entitle the
grievant (s) to a penalty payment as outlined above. The ten (10) working day period shall begin
to run when the Labor Department representative agrees to the settlement, or is notified by the
Union or management team of the settlement. The Employer shall pay a maximum of one penalty
payment for a multi-grievant grievance, which shall be subject to the additional penalties set forth
above for untimely payment, until corrected.

If the case were that simple I'm sure you guys would have won.

[705red]

Originally Posted by tieguy

If the case were that simple I'm sure you guys would have won.

Locally? You may be right! Nationally? As you can see if you read the results of the cases, its clear that they would rather get along, then do whats right!

[big_arrow_up]

The over 9.5 grievances are what bugs me. I wish every extended center and every center in all of the hubs would see all of their drivers get on the over 9.5 lists. The panels would be flooded with grievances.

[trickpony1]

Originally Posted by pemanager

To answer your question, these cases only go to arbitration if the Teamsters decide to take it there. Due to the possible expense of arbitration if you lose, only the 'strong' cases would go.

It's my understanding that if a case goes to arbitration then attorneys will get involved. The union pays for the grievant's attorney. If your local is about to go bankrupt or if the possble award meets or is less than the expenses involved then it's easier for the BA to whisper in the ear(s) of the union side at deadlock and say, "........go ahead and rule "no contract violation".
I've seen this happen. The drivers job wasn't at stake but the 10 weeks of pay he lost was.

Arbitration is a little more serious than the hand shaking, back slapping and bottom petting that goes on at panel and deadlock but it is still subject to influence.