Drivers Forced To Work Undermanned Reload/Twilight

[upslocal480]

Anyone know the rules (contractual of course) about sups forcing drivers to stay on the clock after their routes to help a reload or twilight shift? We have been so short on people lately that we've had to have drivers stay and either unload their own trucks or just stay on the shift for a while. Some bitch and refuse and some are glad to do it. In my opionion....the ones that refuse should be written up for "insubordination". I've seemed to have misplaced my contract book so someone fill me in on this.

 

[deliver_man]

In my opionion....the ones that refuse should be written up for "insubordination".

Why would you think that? Maybe these guys have children that they would like to see before bedtime. Don't be so quick to judge.

 

[upslocal480]

They should have to stay children or not. Most of them used to work relad or preload anyway so what should it matter? Besides.....I believe making them stay over a while is in the contract right? They are making the big$$ and we have trouble making our cuts times when we are so short on people and since sups can't work, H.R. wont hire anyone, and preloaders won't come in...that leaves the drivers. I really respect the drivers that jump at the chance to stick around and make extra money. Most just worry about the extra time puting them over 9.5 but the smart ones that see the extra money in it just work. If they are asked to go over 9.5 then it seems like less of a big deal. I just luagh at the ones that whine and complain and threaten to come in late to drive the next day to make up for the time they had to stay over. Those are the guys that go over 9.5 more often anyway and don't care. LOL.

 

[johnny_b]

Unload their own trucks? That adds two whole hours to their day I guess?!?

It's getting near the end of vacation season, so this should end soon. A suggestion, ask if you can sit in the next twilight CERC meeting. Don't even ask if you can, just when it is and go. They probably won't pay you for it, but you might get a free dinner.

 

[wkmac]

Working over on the Reload/Twilight eh! Well I can understand the point made about getting home to the kids and before someone rushes to judge a driver, here's a guy or gal who's paid their PT dues and who comes to work everyday and busts that rearends out there hussling cardboard. No I'm not a driver so I speak from the outside looking in. Sounds to me like the problem is either the quality of PT worker in your area that HR has to pick from is suspect or HR is not doing a quality job and the sort management isn't on their P's and Q's. It could also be other factors I'm not aware of so the above parties may be innocent too. Don't go blasting the drivers for what in reality is a total failure somewhere else.

Maybe the drivers should consider working as much OT on the Reload/Twilight as they can in the hopes that by Friday they are either out of hours from the get go or run out about mid-day. Either way they get a longer weekend and let that happen in mass a few times and someone will get off their rearends and get this fixed. I also think it's absolutely stupid to pay a driver $35 to $40 per hour when you can get the same work for $9 an hour. Again, if things are just as you say management is not doing the wise and economical thing.

And finally:
"They should have to stay children or not."
"They are making the big$$"

upslocal480,
I thought you were better than that!

 

[upslocal480]

Having kids has nothing to do with staying over and working a little while on reload or even the whole shift <~~which never happens. Reloaders, preloaders, etc. have familys and kids also so I won't even get into that argument. The point is that lately we've be WAY undermanned some nights and have been barely meeting cut times and sometimes been late on them. The problem hasn't been the "quality of our part/time help" or even the management P's and Q's. I kinda feel sorry for our p/t sup because he works with what he's got. If anyone is to blame it's H.R. My question about all this is....is it "legal" or "contractual" or whatever you want to call it to force the lower seniority drivers, as they get back to the center, to stay over and help ge the packages out and on the belt? I was shocked the first time I saw drivers refuse. Some were down right ***holes about it and some were on cloud nine when given the opportunity to work over. The worst incident lately was one night we were so short our sup had to unload and still had to beg drivers to stay and help us out yet at the very same time were saying they were gonna file grievances for the sup working...lol

 

[over9five]

First, The original poster is management material.

Second, If someone forced me to work a second shift, I would respond by using my contractual right to an 8 hour only day for the next 2 days. Watch them struggle to cover my pickups.

 

[toonertoo]

This has been going on all summer at my center, but I was accused of being a real class act when I said why not stay and make 60 cents per minute....... plus on the reload. Most of us guys and girls figure what the heck, its already late, and even though it is very hard work, there are lapses. Its easy street by then. You dont have to worry about the driving part, and all the idiots on the road. No one has ever been forced at our building, they usually ask and get help. But I had to find a sup the other night and they were all unloading, guess I should have filed a grievance for them so they wouldnt be forced to work. Because they have kids too, and dont get OT. HR and the district manager is to blame for that, he/she determines the manning. Its not always because of call offs, alot of it is poor planning. They send PT to driving class, and never have a plan to cover it. JMHEO

 

[tieguy]

I would imagine the guys refusing to stay are senior drivers refusing the work and giving it to the junior drivers. In that situation you hope you can get enough volunteers to keep from getting to a point where you have to force drivers to stay. The key is definitely retention 480. If you get the chance take a new hire under you wing and help him get through the first weeks. Once they get used to the work they usually stay a while.

 

[dammor]

Local,
I realize we have different jobs and different outlooks on what we think should be acceptable.
Most drivers have been at this for a long time. We loaded, unloaded, and did anything that was asked of us. If I come in after a 10 hour day and am told to do anything but go home I will surely walk out the door. I suppose they can get the lower seniority guys to do it in a pinch, but they have had a hell of a day also. Each shift has to pull it's weight to make this work.
I know what short handed means. It means you are screwed. Deal with it. It will happen again and again........

 

[upslocal480]

To who ever said the original poster is management material....my response to that would depend soley on whether or not that was meant as in insult or not. Regardless though....I'm pretty sure there is something in the contract that gives sups the right to FORCE drivers (supposed to be lower seniority drivers) to stay over and help an undermanned shift NO MATTER WHAT THE REASON IS FOR THE UNDERMANNING. This isn't meant as an attempt to pit p/ters against drivers but a question on the subject itself. Whether drivers have an opinion on the matter or not is ok but remember the very thing we are discussing is actually covered in the very contract, or "Bible", that some of you, as well as I sometimes, look to for just about everything so I find it shocking that some drivers, as well as everyone else, just ignore the parts of the contract they like and expect to have the language they like highlighted for their benefit. I believe the expression that comes into play here is..."You can't have your cake and eat it too". Just relying on undermanned crews to "suck it up" because it'll happen again and again in the future is one of the very reasons that something should be done about it. it doesn't help a bit. I could say I don't care about what happens each night we are undermanned and that management will "get what they deserve" just because we are undermanned but I do have at least a little pride in doing my job and that leads me to my point which is that even when the few people we have bust their butts we have trouble meeting air times and cut times. It just sucks. Until H.R. gets out from behind the copying machine and stops printing their business cards we aren't going to get any new hires so we need help until then. Just having drivers unload their own trucks is enough really but we can't even get that half the time. Instead a sup has to do it and the very driver that refused to help files on it. Maybe this all is just a no win situation. Remember...this is not a bashing on drivers but a legitimate question about the contract language regarding them working over. Don't turn this into something it's not.

 

[clarkie]

Personally I've never had a problem unloading my truck when I get in if needed. But when I'm getting home in time to see my kids for maybe 1 hour before they go to bed, that's about all I'm willing to do.

There is an old saying....Family first, nothing else matters.

How old are your kids, 804?

Sorry, but I don't have the answer to your question and I don't feel like searching for it right now.

And the drivers that are filing the grievances should be helping the problem. If that is a constant, then it would seem to help get some new hires in there to do the work.

 

[local804]

Now I looked at all the post and its time to add my 2 cents worth.Loacal 480 states "the ones that refuse should be written up for insubordination"
ARE YOU ON CRACK??????? are you a driver or just a suit posting as a union employee.Your job is the assignment YOU are dispatched with. You are responsible for your complete work load and your total pickup log. YOU ARE NOT REQUIRED TO UNLOAD TRUCKS WHEN YOU RETURN TO THE BUILDING.If the driver would like to, then so be it.Why should he get written up for insubordination??????That is two totally different job classifications.PLEASE............ALL UNION EMPLOYEES........READ YOUR gosh darn CONTRACTS AND DONT START THESE STUPID THREADS.
ps....60 as per dot law, maybe we could unload trucks inbetween our shower to when we go to sleep.
unreal

 

[local804]

Clarkie,
My kids are 8 and 6 if the post was directed to me(think you ment 480).Maybe the complainers can use the over 9/5 article or excessive overtime article in the contract book. See how fast they ask you to stay when your making $49.16 an hour(which is doubletime pay as per UPS contract for the 3rd and 4th day over 9/5 by any greiving overtime employee.)

 

[over9five]

"the very thing we are discussing is actually covered in the very contract,"
Is it? I took a quick look, and cant find it. Can anyone find where UPS can force you to work a second shift?
I was discussing your comment that people who refuse to work a second shift "should be written up for "insubordination"." I said you were management material because only a supervisor would say something like that. (And, Yes, it was an insult).

 

[upslocal480]

I don't speak as a union employee, management employee, or whatever labels there are out there. This comes from someone that just gives a half ass about his job.

(Message edited by upslocal480 on September 06, 2003)

 

[upslocal480]

Only an would make a insult based on a simple dissagreement about working over. Maybe you should work over on reload away form your kid with the hopes that your kids don't turn out like you. As far as the actual management comment goes...The mere fact that you ONLY regard a management job as something that is nothing other a lower group in the company that is where the crappy employees go is a good indidication of your values..or lack of. Now I move on. I could read my "gosh darn CONTRACT BOOK" if I had it here with me. Maybe people should READ THE gosh darn thread so that they might have seen one of the two or three times I stated I was simply looking for insight on what the contact itself said instead of turning this thead into something it's not. YES...we all have our own jobs to do but at they same time once job affect another...and another...and so on. If people don't pitch in and help when needed then things happen and somewhere down the line business is affected...but I guess no one really cares about that anymore. Some of you people take things Waaaaaaay to seriously here. It's unbelievable. I really wish I had my book with me so I can give more than a quick look at it but I don't. Oh well...I'll wait until the blood pressure (for whatever reason it is up) of some of drivers is down to bring it up again. LOL. This is pathetic. Can't even ask simpe question or for advice on this board. Too many attitudes come out.

 

[over9five]

"In my opionion....the ones that refuse should be written up for "insubordination". "

Your exact words. You were not "simply looking for some insight on what the contract said". No real Teamster would want their brother written up for anything!

"Only an would make a insult based on a simple dissagreement about working over. "

Isnt that exactly what you did when you stated, "I just luagh at the ones that whine and complain and threaten to come in late to drive the next day ...".

Seems to me you said all that specifically to start a little flame war, not to get any information.

 

[tieguy]

Geez whats with all the fighting on these boards?

 

[ups_vette]

over9five:
"No real Teamster would want their brother written up for anything".


I can't believe you truly believe that. If so, you're saying a borther Teamster can do no wrong.

The "brother" who is speeding and runs a red light, crashes into a minivan with mother and child inside causing their death, should not be written up?


The "brother" who falsifies records, takes an extra hour lunch and brings back packages, who is abusive to a customer, who is absent excessively for no medical reason, that "brother" should not be written up, and any Teamster who agrees with the write up is not a REAL Teamster.


Do you have no sence of right and wrong?