In general, how disciplined are drivers?

[22.34life]

it used to happen all the time,a driver sheets up a package nsn because it is the hardest thing to disprove.they are not saying the receiver is moved from the address only that they cant locate the address.it does happen alot less now because c/m instructs clerks to send nsn packages back out to the same address if the address matchs in e2dc.i am a pm clerk and here are some of the tricks i have seen,sheeting up package need suite then service crossing it nsn which is no such number to a clerk but could go either way if questioned about it.he would do this because he did not want to deliver it for whatever reason sheets it need suite even though he doesnt ,knows the clerk will read his service cross as no such number,the address matchs and the package gets postcarded.whatever label is wrong is the one they deliver to,pal wrong take it there,main label wrong take it there.i have seen pals from other packages peeled off and stuck over main label so the main label cant be seen.packages that are addressed to an apt complex and the driver brings them back need apt.i have seen apt numbers scratched off ,labels torn off.name it and i have probably seen it done to avoid delivering a package,i dont blame most of the drivers that do this though,they dont do it because they want to its just to survive.

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

i dont blame most of the drivers that do this though,they dont do it because they want to its just to survive.

Rationalize it any way you want but these drivers are simply being lazy.

 

[QKRSTKR]

it used to happen all the time,a driver sheets up a package nsn because it is the hardest thing to disprove.they are not saying the receiver is moved from the address only that they cant locate the address.it does happen alot less now because c/m instructs clerks to send nsn packages back out to the same address if the address matchs in e2dc.i am a pm clerk and here are some of the tricks i have seen,sheeting up package need suite then service crossing it nsn which is no such number to a clerk but could go either way if questioned about it.he would do this because he did not want to deliver it for whatever reason sheets it need suite even though he doesnt ,knows the clerk will read his service cross as no such number,the address matchs and the package gets postcarded.whatever label is wrong is the one they deliver to,pal wrong take it there,main label wrong take it there.i have seen pals from other packages peeled off and stuck over main label so the main label cant be seen.packages that are addressed to an apt complex and the driver brings them back need apt.i have seen apt numbers scratched off ,labels torn off.name it and i have probably seen it done to avoid delivering a package,i dont blame most of the drivers that do this though,they dont do it because they want to its just to survive.

sometimes a pkg may have a apt. but its wrong. It ll say apt 1 but the nums go 100 -200 -300. so is it 101,102,103,201,301? etc. So its not always a driver trying to get away with something, If a apt add has no apt on it but I know it has a directory inside the apt building, I go in and find it. Swing driver wont.

But to answer your ? yes some drivers do things they shouldnt and if i was cust. i would be mad too.

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

I had one the other day for 89 Waterhouse St. There is no 89 Waterhouse so I called the number on the pkg, left a message with both the center number and my cell number. Consignee called back later that day, turns out is was 98 Waterhouse St, did an ADC in DIAD, customer happy, one less pkg for PM clerk to work on.

Steve would argue that this is doing the clerks job and bringing the pkg back is the "acceptable" thing to do but I contend that this is simply good customer service and it took less than 5 minutes in all.

 

[grgrcr88]

I had one the other day for 89 Waterhouse St. There is no 89 Waterhouse so I called the number on the pkg, left a message with both the center number and my cell number. Consignee called back later that day, turns out is was 98 Waterhouse St, did an ADC in DIAD, customer happy, one less pkg for PM clerk to work on.

Steve would argue that this is doing the clerks job and bringing the pkg back is the "acceptable" thing to do but I contend that this is simply good customer service and it took less than 5 minutes in all.

So if 100 drivers do the same thing, thats 500 minutes, now you have eliminated 2-3 clerks jobs. Is that acceptable? What about their families? I doubt they would think thats acceptable. You people that think you can do things better your own way should step back and see that your not the only person on the planet. Everything you do will have an affect on someone else. The reason for the way things are done may not be evident to you at the time, or maybe never, but that does not make it OK for you to change the rules to suit you. It's the same thing for people that work off the clock. "Oh it's only 5 minutes prior to start time while I go thru my air!" Well take that times every driver doing it and you have eliminated more than a few full time, good paying jobs!!

Wake up and smell the coffee, rules are there foer a reason, you do not get to pick which ones you like or dislike!!

 

[UPSGUY72]

I've been a small package customer service rep (tampa call center) for over a year now, working from tracking up to the international preferred team. A consistent call when I worked in the domestic part was an irate customer saying they tracked their package and there was a "No such #" or some similar scan indicating the driver was unable to locate it. They swear up and down the address is correct, and that the driver in their area is sub-par and is lazy. I never believed it, but just out of curiosity, does it happen where a driver will just use the diad to simulate an attempt and just bypass a delivery to save time / effort, or is it just rude customers lying?

The problem is that usually something is wrong with the label to start.

1. Wrong ending (st, rd, ave, pl, etc) They might live at 12 Main RD but the label says 12 Main ST.
2. Bad zip
3. Wrong city (you would surprised at how many people think there address is in one city when it is actually in another)
4. No Apt #, bad apt number
5. No suite number and no company name just a name to a building with 5 or more businesses
6. Bad spelling or creative address writting. ( 12 east streeten, Can come up as 12 eastern when it is suppose to be 12 east st)
ETC...

The Diad has GPS on it along with are packages car these days. They know where and when a driver scans a package.

Some customer can't be please and other will lye to get better service.

 

[southgeorgiaupser]

Right on UpstateNYUPSer!! i am a PDS and i get so dang sick and tired of drivers using EDD as an excuse to be lazy P.O.Ss!! Yes, EDD is just a TOOL and guide to help u be more efficient and at our joband therfore serve our customers even better than we have done in the past ...and not a reason to not serve them and be lazy. I agree there are issues with PAS such as flipped labels. We all know by now that it is not a perfect system by no means but i can't find one driver that would honestly really want to go back to the days before EDD!

 

[brownmonster]

So if 100 drivers do the same thing, thats 500 minutes, now you have eliminated 2-3 clerks jobs. Is that acceptable? What about their families? I doubt they would think thats acceptable. You people that think you can do things better your own way should step back and see that your not the only person on the planet. Everything you do will have an affect on someone else. The reason for the way things are done may not be evident to you at the time, or maybe never, but that does not make it OK for you to change the rules to suit you. It's the same thing for people that work off the clock. "Oh it's only 5 minutes prior to start time while I go thru my air!" Well take that times every driver doing it and you have eliminated more than a few full time, good paying jobs!

Wake up and smell the coffee, rules are there foer a reason, you do not get to pick which ones you like or dislike!!

Not going out of your way to give service costs us customers and jobs. Maybe that's why we keep losing volume. You worry about a clerk losing a job yet laugh at mgmnt cuts. Yawn.

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

So if 100 drivers do the same thing, thats 500 minutes, now you have eliminated 2-3 clerks jobs. Is that acceptable? What about their families? I doubt they would think thats acceptable. You people that think you can do things better your own way should step back and see that your not the only person on the planet. Everything you do will have an affect on someone else. The reason for the way things are done may not be evident to you at the time, or maybe never, but that does not make it OK for you to change the rules to suit you. It's the same thing for people that work off the clock. "Oh it's only 5 minutes prior to start time while I go thru my air!" Well take that times every driver doing it and you have eliminated more than a few full time, good paying jobs!!

Wake up and smell the coffee, rules are there foer a reason, you do not get to pick which ones you like or dislike!!

I know exactly how the system works. I also know that our customers expect the best from us, which is why I carry my cell phone and have a phone book in my PC. I will not apologize for taking care of the customer and if that is not acceptable to you that is just too bad.

Let me give you another example. One of our larger shippers moved off of my area to an adjacent area several years ago. I still get returns for them which have been sent to their old address. My old preloader would catch these and get them to the right driver but my new preloader blindly loads by the PAL. I am less than a mile from their new address when I start my pickups so rather than bring the pkgs back I simply do the ADC in the DIAD and deliver them. One day I had 6 40lb pkgs for them. The last thing I would want to do is to have to take those off the PC, have the clerk ADC them, have the preload run them back through EDD so that they can be delivered the following day when it would take me less than 5 minutes to run them off.

If UPS did not want us to do ADC's on the road then why is that function in the DIAD?

 

[dilligaf]

Arrow:

I have personally looked at 1000's of these and what you say can happen but....

This happens rarely and is generally NOT how these "flips" occur.

When a customer sends a package without a valid address, the system will do its best to figure out what they meant. This pass is incredibly accurate. As you say, sometimes (rarely) it gets it wrong. It depends on the street number, zip, city, etc. that they send and if there are multiple choices.

If its ambiguous as in the case you mention (meaning that it could be one of two or more choices), the system does not guess. It sends it to a person to figure out. In the case of a package with PLD, this generally happens before the package gets to the preload. That "pre corrections" person may pick the wrong address. They are supposed to use other tools that help determine.

If the package was not sent with PLD, a data capture operator keys in the address.

The two biggest ways these flips happen is that these people pick or enter the wrong address.

The third way it generally happens is that someone put in an address alias incorrectly.

I realize that from a drivers perspective they all look the same and all have the same impact. In ALL cases however, the cause is not sending a "valid" address to UPS. If the shipper send a validated address, the system never makes a mistake (actually, I did see it happen once long, long ago but that was corrected).

P-Man

P-man, I would add that if the street ranges within the centers system is not 100% accurate it will also cause a flip. We have one particular street that this happens with . The cnee uses 390 abc st. This is a n and s street but the cnee does not put in the s. PAS automatically flips it to n even though the street range for n does not go that high. If the street ranges were correct then it should automatically flip to s.

 

[stevetheupsguy]

I argee I have called my times to find out the correct address, I hate when it turns out to be the a help line to the shipping company, not much help.

I think most drivers want to find the address and get it off, not all but most. The cover guys have it tougher no doubt and I dont really blame them.

But when UPS goes out of its way, like with telling us to delate the 1st attempt (which then makes us look worse on paper) I also see why some have giving up on trying and just take it back in for an address correction.


The job is hard enough without UPS trying to make up look bad.

Anyway that is my 2 cents.

If you think what the "paper" says in the morning makes YOU look bad, then you are still a part of the matrix. You get paid by the hour to do the job the way it is prescribed. Why have a bad feeling about anything? Didn't you do your job?

Yeah it seems like corporate's only intentions lately are making a driver look bad on paper.

Can't be done.

It is what it is and it was like this over 30 years ago when I drove ... like Sober says, "Let management worry about the numbers, it's not your problem."

+1

You get paid by the hour and not by the stop. Why should you care if you get "credit" for the stop? I don't understand. They can tell me to void all 150 stops for all I care...

+1

it used to happen all the time,a driver sheets up a package nsn because it is the hardest thing to disprove.they are not saying the receiver is moved from the address only that they cant locate the address.it does happen alot less now because c/m instructs clerks to send nsn packages back out to the same address if the address matchs in e2dc.i am a pm clerk and here are some of the tricks i have seen,sheeting up package need suite then service crossing it nsn which is no such number to a clerk but could go either way if questioned about it.he would do this because he did not want to deliver it for whatever reason sheets it need suite even though he doesnt ,knows the clerk will read his service cross as no such number,the address matchs and the package gets postcarded.whatever label is wrong is the one they deliver to,pal wrong take it there,main label wrong take it there.i have seen pals from other packages peeled off and stuck over main label so the main label cant be seen.packages that are addressed to an apt complex and the driver brings them back need apt.i have seen apt numbers scratched off ,labels torn off.name it and i have probably seen it done to avoid delivering a package,i dont blame most of the drivers that do this though,they dont do it because they want to its just to survive.

If you don't work according to the methods, you will not survive. This is all that matters, the methods.

Rationalize it any way you want but these drivers are simply being lazy.

Anyone that doesn't do the job according to Upstate's methods, is lazy. It's a shame we cannot all be on par with the Wizard of UPS.

I had one the other day for 89 Waterhouse St. There is no 89 Waterhouse so I called the number on the pkg, left a message with both the center number and my cell number. Consignee called back later that day, turns out is was 98 Waterhouse St, did an ADC in DIAD, customer happy, one less pkg for PM clerk to work on.

Steve would argue that this is doing the clerks job and bringing the pkg back is the [-]"acceptable"[/-] The right thing to do, but I contend that this is simply good customer service and it took less than 5 minutes in all.

5 minutes that you took away from another hourly's scheduled task.

So if 100 drivers do the same thing, thats 500 minutes, now you have eliminated 2-3 clerks jobs. Is that acceptable? What about their families? I doubt they would think thats acceptable. You people that think you can do things better your own way should step back and see that your not the only person on the planet. Everything you do will have an affect on someone else. The reason for the way things are done may not be evident to you at the time, or maybe never, but that does not make it OK for you to change the rules to suit you. It's the same thing for people that work off the clock. "Oh it's only 5 minutes prior to start time while I go thru my air!" Well take that times every driver doing it and you have eliminated more than a few full time, good paying jobs!!

Wake up and smell the coffee, rules are there foer a reason, you do not get to pick which ones you like or dislike!!

Totally agree!!!

Another side to this equation, as far as Upstate is concerned, is that if you're not a "favored" customer, or a buddy's "hot" girlfriend, he probably wouldn't do this for you. So much for "customer service".

I know exactly how the system works. I also know that our customers expect the best from us, which is why I carry my cell phone and have a phone book in my PC. I will not apologize for taking care of [-]the[/-] SOME customer's and if that is not acceptable to you that is just too bad.

Let me give you another example. One of our larger shippers moved off of my area to an adjacent area several years ago. I still get returns for them which have been sent to their old address. My old preloader would catch these and get them to the right driver but my new preloader blindly loads by the PAL, I mean works as directed. I am less than a mile from their new address when I start my pickups so rather than bring the pkgs back, as I'm supposed to, I simply do the ADC in the DIAD and deliver them. One day I had 6 40lb pkgs for them. The last thing I would want to do is to have to take those off the PC, (because that may make me late for my rendezvous at home with all my "friends" at the Brown Cafe), have the clerk ADC them, have the preload run them back through EDD so that they can be delivered the following day when it would take me less than 5 minutes to run them off.
And get my welcome/Good Job, pat on the back from my manager/handler.
If UPS did not want us to do ADC's on the road then why is that function in the DIAD?

There, fixed it for you, again.

BTW there are other function's in the DIAD as well. NSN, NR, MISSED and a slew of others that are there for you to use. Whoops, I'm forgetting myself again. You work as you see fit, not as directed. Good luck with that!

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

As I said above, I will not apologize for taking care of the customer.

 

[22.34life]

sometimes a pkg may have a apt. but its wrong. It ll say apt 1 but the nums go 100 -200 -300. so is it 101,102,103,201,301? etc. So its not always a driver trying to get away with something, If a apt add has no apt on it but I know it has a directory inside the apt building, I go in and find it. Swing driver wont.

But to answer your ? yes some drivers do things they shouldnt and if i was cust. i would be mad too.

if the package is addressed to twin oaks apt with no ones name on it it obviously goes to the leasing office.

 

[22.34life]

I had one the other day for 89 Waterhouse St. There is no 89 Waterhouse so I called the number on the pkg, left a message with both the center number and my cell number. Consignee called back later that day, turns out is was 98 Waterhouse St, did an ADC in DIAD, customer happy, one less pkg for PM clerk to work on.

Steve would argue that this is doing the clerks job and bringing the pkg back is the "acceptable" thing to do but I contend that this is simply good customer service and it took less than 5 minutes in all.

ups gets $13 for every address correction,so if the address was wrong thats $13 you screwed the company out of.

 

[rocket man]

GO back to your phone get off this site .You dont have a clue what goes on out there people have no numbers on house or mail box we are not paid to guess. KIids at a house or apt they dont no there there last name or the name of there parents. People who dont know there own zip codes and when i say kids 16 year olds (ah im not sure if this is number 39 19 main) IN your post you say we are trying to save time to by not doing a stop that just means one more for tommrow. Put no such number its covering our butt. so go answer your phone and feel sorry for the customer who has to go to will call and pickup there package because they would not spend 5 dollars to put a number on there house condo apt teach what a zip code is. iI HOPE A DRIVER DELIVERS TO your house your not home while you are answering your phones not n 1 not in 2 not in 3 see ya.

 

[Overpaid Union Thug]

Arrow:

I have personally looked at 1000's of these and what you say can happen but....

This happens rarely and is generally NOT how these "flips" occur.

When a customer sends a package without a valid address, the system will do its best to figure out what they meant. This pass is incredibly accurate. As you say, sometimes (rarely) it gets it wrong. It depends on the street number, zip, city, etc. that they send and if there are multiple choices.

If its ambiguous as in the case you mention (meaning that it could be one of two or more choices), the system does not guess. It sends it to a person to figure out. In the case of a package with PLD, this generally happens before the package gets to the preload. That "pre corrections" person may pick the wrong address. They are supposed to use other tools that help determine.

If the package was not sent with PLD, a data capture operator keys in the address.

The two biggest ways these flips happen is that these people pick or enter the wrong address.

The third way it generally happens is that someone put in an address alias incorrectly.

I realize that from a drivers perspective they all look the same and all have the same impact. In ALL cases however, the cause is not sending a "valid" address to UPS. If the shipper send a validated address, the system never makes a mistake (actually, I did see it happen once long, long ago but that was corrected).

P-Man

It is not "RARE" in our center. Happens just about every day. Either way......for anyone to say that blaming the faults in the system is just a cop out is way off base.

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

ups gets $13 for every address correction,so if the address was wrong thats $13 you screwed the company out of.

Clueless, we get $10 for an ADC whether it is done at the center or through the DIAD.

 

[dilligaf]

Clueless, we get $10 for an ADC whether it is done at the center or through the DIAD.

You are correct Dave. I will make the attempt at the actual location, to show that I was there, but will AC or redirect at a later time. In fact Friday I had one of each. I knew where the AC needed to go and recv an ODS telling me to take to the correct address. The AC had already been done by our clerk. That is why I sheeted it NSN. This particular customer has had a new addr. for more than 2 years and still recieves pkgs addressed to the old address.

The other one I had was a closed business but I knew where her husband work and delivered it to him later in the day. Again, I wanted to show that I had actually been to the original address to CMA!!

 

[pretzel_man]

It is not "RARE" in our center. Happens just about every day. Either way......for anyone to say that blaming the faults in the system is just a cop out is way off base.

Arrow:

I mentioned four different scenarios:
1) Bad Alias
2) Incorrect pre-Correctoin
3) Incorrect data Capture
4) System Flip

I said that to the driver all four look the same.

Did you actually look at the data flow? Without physically doing that, how can you know that the cause is #4 (as you say).

From my experience, #4 above happens much less often than the other 3. Much, much less.

BTW, the first three are system problems caused by people. The last is a true system issue. What do you know that says item 4 is the biggest issue?

P-Man

 

[stevetheupsguy]

[-]Clueless, [/-] We get $10 for an ADC whether it is done at the center or through the DIAD.

There, I fixed it for you again. Why do you find it so pleasing to call people names? Were you picked on as a child? Was that really necessary?

Arrow:

I mentioned four different scenarios:
1) Bad Alias
2) Incorrect pre-Correctoin
3) Incorrect data Capture
4) System Flip

I said that to the driver all four look the same.

Did you actually look at the data flow? Without physically doing that, how can you know that the cause is #4 (as you say).

From my experience, #4 above happens much less often than the other 3. Much, much less.

BTW, the first three are system problems caused by people. The last is a true system issue. What do you know that says item 4 is the biggest issue?

P-Man

Would #4 be the glitch that dilli spoke about? The one where you have one street that is ne on one side and se on the other?