IS and IBM Consulting Deal

Discussion in 'UPS Information Technology' started by alwaysaware, Jul 19, 2007.

  1. alwaysaware

    alwaysaware New Member

    Has anyone heard about recent negotiations with IBM Consulting to come in and start 'evaluating' UPS applications? Very hush hush. Deal has already been cut and IBM is on-site.

    Strange - with over 4,000 people in IS, there has to be some bright minds who posess UPS knowledge and valuable insight. Once again we are going to pay top dollar (wasted dollars) for inept non-UPS people who come in off the street, have to be trained about what it is we do, they lack technical skills too, but they are given the keys to the store to run around wasting time and money. Haven't we been through this folly several times before and been severly burned to the tune of several millions of $$$$$? Guess when the CIO says jump - one of his people asks without blinking 'when can I come down'.

    Can't travel, can't get a new PC, Can't get promoted, but here come the IBM robots at a prmium price.

    I smell outsourcing........:confused:1
  2. AmYisroelChai

    AmYisroelChai New Member

    Since such a deal would have an impact on both IBM's and UPS' bottom line, wouldn't you think that this deal would have to be made public?
    "hush hush"? I don't think so?

    However, outsourcing to IBM is a grand idea and should have been done years ago. UPS may pay IBM cash but rids itself of the "headache" of overpaying employees with stock, benefits, salaries, vacation, etc.

    Ask Dave Barnes how he spells relief, C-H-A-N-N-A-I.
  3. alwaysaware

    alwaysaware New Member

    Hush Hush means -they are still 'behind closed doors' talks going on, but IBM is on-site and the deal is closed. Also, one person is still asking 'When can I come down Dave??' Until the answert comes - it's all on the QT....

    So what's your recommendation for 4,000 IS folks??? Give em the boot ??? Thanks, so long, goodbye????

    Also - I have to ask C-H-A-N-N-A-I ???? What is that ???

    Maybe Barnes should go, along with Eskewwwwww and Davis....
  4. AmYisroelChai

    AmYisroelChai New Member

    So what's your recommendation for 4,000 IS folks??? Give em the boot ???

    That's a good question. What do you think UPS should do with 4000 IS folks?

    Channai used to be called Madras (remember the shirts). India.
  5. alwaysaware

    alwaysaware New Member

    We did the outsource from India routine. Was a pack of failures. Nothing will be done till the 'fat man' says so.....

    What to do with 4000+ IS folk ?? How about getting them involved in working out real business issues, have them stop fighting useless fires created by an outsourced vendor who left us with garbage yet made them super rich. How about telling those who work for one screaming, ranting PF Manager to pay no attention to his useless gambles and DB-CIO butt kissing...

    And lets put accountability where it belongs: In the hands of UPS Partners and not in the the pockets and paychecks of worthless IBM theives and robots... Their job, as on-site IBM consultant does so well, is to to extract money out of UPS's hands and put it into their's (IBM's)....
  6. rups

    rups New Member

    there has to be some bright minds who posess UPS knowledge and valuable insight.

    UPS IS is loaded with bright minds sharing their knowledge and insights with the organization. These people need to be identified, rewarded and given the resources needed to grow the business.

    Their job, as on-site IBM consultant does so well, is to to extract money out of UPS's hands and put it into their's (IBM's)

    I'm not so sure about this one. The UPS mindset that "consultants are evil" shows company norm that is outdated and unfortunate for UPSers who want to get the stock moving again.

    Consultants should be hired to provide a unique and specialized skill set to fill a temporary need. That skill set will often require a premium price often but at the same time, UPS is saved the expenses mentioned earlier - stock, benefits, salaries, vacation, etc.

    Out of curiosity, do you perform your own dental work? I would guess no because you most likely engage the temporary services of a person with a specialized skill set that requires a premium price - your dentist.

    Maybe we use consultants for their specialized services a little more than we realize... medical services, auto repair, cafeteria services, day care, dry cleaning, etc.

    Consulting is nothing new and has many advantages when used correctly. It's up to UPSers to learn how to strategically hire and utilize consultants as business partners.
  7. AmYisroelChai

    AmYisroelChai New Member

    RUPS. Maybe you never heard this, but most of us have ... A consultant is someone who borrows your watch to tell you what time it is.
  8. rups

    rups New Member

    Content to blame someone else with stereotypes and catch phrases... this is the attitude that keeps the shares below $80.

    Great people talk about ideas.
    Average people talk about things.
    Small people talk about other people.
  9. UPS is the expert on Logistics and has (or maybe is) an outsourced vendor for IBM.

    IBM is a leader in providing IT Services of all kinds.

    There is, and has been, a long, fruitful relationship between IBM and UPS senior executives across many UPS functions.

    IBM forays into logistics have been viewed with suspicion by UPS.

    If we think company to company, and not just IT, there are some real partnering opportunities here, that with benefit shareholders of both companies.

    It has nothing to do with UPS IT people being moved to IBM.

    Go UPS!
  10. AmYisroelChai

    AmYisroelChai New Member

    RUPS? Did you just dis yourself (with stereotypes and catch phrases)?
  11. ups79

    ups79 Active Member

    It might be that our CEO sits on the board of IBM, but I doubt it.
  12. UPS_plus_IBM

    UPS_plus_IBM Guest

    No doubt that we have some top minds in Mahwah, but lets be honest: we are a transportation company that relies on technology, not a technology company. I welcome an IT company with real IT expertise, we need it. Just ask the thousands of customers who had the myriad of problems with WorldShip 9.0...

    Its just like we tell our customers: "Let UPS, the transportation experts, take care of your supply chain" ... "Let technology experts take care of your IT group."
  13. alwaysaware

    alwaysaware New Member

    Trust Me - no demonizing or consultant bashing here.
    What I am pointing out is another extravagent example of IS being hijacked. We sometimes use consultants for a specific expertise. We also use consultants for supplemental staf to do work a UPS IS employee is capable of doing - we have IS consultants with us who have been at UPS for more than 10 years - that's absurd.

    What we have here is one large portfolio manager not placing faith and trust in his people. Instead, he knows better - or more importantly - dave told him what's better and he takes it upon himself to do dave's bidding without question.

    We are losing good people and IBM is using this to their advantage to get back in to do more damage. Is sad when we give away a project and don't keep track or have the vendor be accounatable.

    Welsome to IS...
  14. brownhornet07

    brownhornet07 New Member

    and just how many people has that one portfolio lost in the last year? Maybe the consultants are a sign that there aren't many people left to step up and take their place, cause the portfolio is considered bad news?
  15. brownblood

    brownblood New Member

    Interesting discussion. While this is just talk…or rumor, it highligfts an interesting paradox of dissolving the TSG department while still needing a great deal of IT support.

    I mean, who else can support DOS based systems. The Geeks from Best Buy??
  16. Maybe if the board would get a clue and tell Barnes to move IS out of the the NY/NJ area it might not be that likely.

    The fact is that UPS can't afford to pay people the NY/NJ Salaries and compete with all the huge number of companies that compete with IT talent in that area.

    MOVE THE IS ORGANIZATION OUT OF NEW JERSEY YOU FOOLS.... We can get 3X the talent at 1/2 the labor cost in the midwest, SDF and ATL compared to what we find/pay in NJ market. We are paying IT amatures 50% MORE salary in NJ, compared to what we get experts for in other UPS locations.

    If the IS group stays in NJ, then its doomed to be a dinosaur.

    Having the group up there, makes outsourcing the whole thing to IBM probably seem CHEAP!

    Not to mention the fact that the IS group is soooo far removed from the rest of the company up there in the NJ pink palace that they don't have a clue what is going on in the rest of the company, and the board has no idea how much they love to just burn our hard earned MIP money in their fireplaces to keep warm.

    I say move NJ, Louisville, and Maryland all to ATL where they can all get together and part of ONE-UPS. :)

    But thats crazy talk, and makes too much common sense for it to happen at UPS.
  17. rups

    rups New Member

    alwaysaware - you bring up a good point about in-house career consultants.

    if a consultant can't deliver on a specific temporary business need and train a UPSer within a given time frame, there's no way a contract should be renewed.

    some encouraging news - i've seen a more rigorous hiring process as of late in my workgroup for consultants. the next step i would hope for is an even more rigorous knowledge transfer process when a consultant leaves as well.
  18. Anonymously

    Anonymously Guest

    alwaysaware---not to pin u down but, that large Portfolio Mgr you speak of, did he recently break both arms? ... and be careful, he may be lurking around as user "NEWYORKER"...funny how he put a positive spin on getting rid of all the consultants in Ramsey, yet he spends his time in Asia looking for ways to outsource work.
  19. alwaysaware

    alwaysaware New Member

    Not to hard to figure out what Portfolio we are talking about here. Unfortunately, that trip to Asia and elsewhere could of very well been a cover up for other 'business'.

    To Anonymous Cowrod (What is a Cowrod???) - Atlanta is way too expensive fo an IS site - Yes NY/NJ is expensive - but does UPS dump thousands of people, and their families either out on the street or out in the middle of nowhere ??? Tough one - too bad it's not being thought out very well. But - have no fear, IBM is here.... I think not.....

    Can't get a promotion, can't meet the needs of the business, but we can burn lots money giving IBM a shot at what UPS Partners are far more qualified to do.

    Something has got to happen to stop this kind of insanity....
  20. alwaysaware

    alwaysaware New Member

    IBM has entered the building.
    Last edited: Jul 28, 2007