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Message: <blockquote data-quote="dudebro" data-source="post: 3800023" data-attributes="member: 11234">Don't forget the fact that if you were working and contributing to the market between 2009 and 2014, you bought at 6700 and less than 5 years later that money DOUBLED.  So, you can point to 2008 as if the market always does that, it doesn't.  I could sit here and point to 2009, and it doesn't always go UP 30% either.  On average, you get the 7%.  And for what you pay in, a 401k on the worst day of the market is more money back than the defined benefit plans.</blockquote>