My VERY simple safety idea that will never work

Discussion in 'UPS Discussions' started by Mike23, Aug 18, 2009.

  1. Mike23

    Mike23 Guest

    So, I was thinking today while waiting for my medication for strep throat (nice day off due to that) about how unsafe and how many injuries occur at UPS. I've decided, instead that on top of a 'safety committee' they also need first responders.

    Of course, not ACTUAL first responders (unless people are certified in it) but just your basic first aid people. After a few injuries I've been part of (both witnessed and literally been part of) I came to realize that UPS management has 0 clue about what to do when someone's hurt. Heck, our depot doesn't even have ice packs (the simplest common sense thing next to band aids!).

    Why not, at least on each shift, have 2-3 people certified in 1st aid and make it KNOWN that they're certified. Post their picture and give them a little band to wear on their arm or something that's reflective so people know who to go to when help is needed.

    I remember reading a little while ago about a driver who saved a managers life by performing CPR because the manager was having a stroke. Well, what if that guy wasn't right there when the manager had a stroke? What if he was on the other side of the building? He would never know about it and that manager would be dead. With the little band someone yells for a first aider he's quickly located (due to the little band) and precious time is saved trying to locate someone to perform proper CPR.

    It's not just for CPR though, think of the amount of sprains, breaks, cuts that UPS employees suffer every year. I know drivers would not be able to help fellow drivers on road (obviously) but inside the building before hitting the road I'm sure they could (or at least a preload first aider could). It would also help in giving the employees more of a neutral footing. How many times do you hear, 'well, it costs the company $$$ if you go see a doctor about this. Just give it a few days and see how it is' (our center manager's favorite saying).

    Lets face it, our center manager's DO NOT have our best interest at heart. They have their own best interest at heart. If you put a first aider on the same footing as the center manager though (by upper echelon of UPS management viewing a first aider as competent instead of all drivers as incompetent in first aid) then suddenly you have a work place that not only attempt to be safe...bahaha, ok, I almost said it with a straight face, but also responds quickly to first aid situations.

    I for one have 0 idea who has a certified first aid certificate in my building. If something serious happened I have an expired 1st aid certificate but I'm also willing to retake the course if UPS would view me as a driver with a brain instead of, 'you're not a doctor, you have no idea what you're talking about!'.

    If a driver has one of these bands, think of the amount of POSITIVE publicity UPS would get if they saved someone's life on road. This is a hit or miss though since you may end up getting somebody with a paper cut requesting first aid from you and it could get to the point where you couldn't delivery packages, so maybe not such a good idea? I know, we're also not paramedics which is the other argument but the positive publicity would be amazing and show the public that, 'we do care' even though all the drivers know that UPS doesn't care.

    If it hasn't already happened, why is it I can see, sometime in the future, a preloader slipping off the line, falling, breaking something then being told to just relax and left alone while work's being completed while the paramedics take their time getting there (since they know it's only a broken leg no rush). No one checks up on the preloader, he slips into shock and dies before paramedics arrive over a broken leg. Anyone with basic 1st aid knows shock is a pretty dangerious followup after a hazard and I KNOW UPS management wouldn't check up on the poor fellow.

    I am by no means requesting UPS pay for or allow me to take time off for the course. It's my perocative and only mine. Just recognize it for what it is, something that means I AM more knowledgeable then some UPS managers. I've heard they all take it but never once have seen it properly followed by them in multiple situations.
  2. over9five

    over9five Moderator Staff Member


    If UPS was to certify First Aid people, they would then become liable for their actions. What if a First Aid person made an injury worse while trying to help?

    This is why ALL our first aid kits are clearly labeled "For self usage only" or something like that.
  3. over9five

    over9five Moderator Staff Member

    Did anyone else wonder where this statement was gonna go?!?!?!

    j/k Mike!!!
  4. Jaws

    Jaws New Member

  5. Tiny Panda

    Tiny Panda Member

    We have certified firstaiders in our building and fire wardens, trouble is the certification only lasts 12 months and UPS arent too hot on updating the training. I was a fire warden back in 2004 but the training was never updated so it lapsed and we had none till about 3 months ago.
  6. Mike23

    Mike23 Guest

    There's 0 liability in this. First aiders can't be sued or charged for attempting to help someone even if they royally screw up. It's been attempted in the past (everyone remember the dude the cut the woman's bra off and did CPR and she tried to sue after he saved her life?) and failed every time.

    And thanks for picking on me, as if I didn't feel sick enough now I get mocked! :( ;) :D Apparently there's a law in Canada to HAVE the first aiders

    I THINK this is likely for the Americans (which is 99% of BC)

    So, if it's law, why not ID them? Have employees part of keeping things safe instead of having supervisors who are pimply faced 19 year olds who'll faint at the first sight of blood?
    Lasted edited by : Aug 18, 2009
  7. dannyboy

    dannyboy From the promised LAND

    UPS is not worried about the dude getting sued, they are worried about UPS getting sued.

    And while they would probably not have to pay (although you never can tell), defending lawsuits is expensive.

    We actually have several drivers that have had EMT training. One still volunteers on the rescue squad during his off hours.

    A couple of years ago, he stopped to help in a grinder of an accident. Person had a severe injury to the upper leg/torso. Would have bled out had it not been for him stopping and putting pressure on the wound till help got there.

    UPS gave him hell for that. They did not suspend or give him a warning letter, but they sure hauled him into the office.

    He did get the last laugh though.

    Liberty mutual has an award that they hand out each year for people that did the right thing and saved a life. He was one of the five people they gave that award to that year. Had a big presentation at the center.

    Always to the right thing, and it will work its way out.

    But back to your thought, they are to provide a basic med kit that has to be stocked. Anything past a band-aid or icepack, they will not do. And you have to administer that to yourself.

    All because of liability.

  8. klein

    klein Für Meno :)

    Another safety feature for you MIke, that will never work.

    Never handle over 70lbs by yourself !
  9. Monkey Butt

    Monkey Butt Dark Prince of Double Standards Staff Member

    I had assumed as much based on many of his previous posts. :wink2:

    BLACKBOX Life is a Highway...

    What next is this guy going to think about? On site Gynecologists?
  11. Mike23

    Mike23 Guest

    Hey, all I'm saying is that they're MANDATORY according to law. If you don't send them in public then at least have them identifiable in the building. Common sense, is it not? Why keep them hiding? There's 0 point to it. You can't sue someone who's IDed as a first aider at work because you HAVE to have them at work, it's the law! Do you think Joe Preload could or would sue UPS over someone trying to help him with an injury when they're required to do so? Good luck with that.
  12. Scuba_Steve

    Scuba_Steve Member

    Your idea is an excellent one.

    We in fact DO HAVE first responders who have been basic training in many office buildings. The names and phone numbers of people for each floor/area are published and part of the emergency plan.

    It needs to be expanded to the operation areas as well.

    Would it be 'fair' to make this totally voluntary, and not subject to union rules? Maybe if the company agreed to allow for some on the clock training time maybe in exchange for committing to being a designated first responder?
  13. Scuba_Steve

    Scuba_Steve Member

    Well, there is the concept of 'good samaritian' protections in the law.

    However, we all know in this day and age get a few ambulance chasing lawyers involved and anything is possible.
  14. trplnkl

    trplnkl 555

    And I bet the center manager was standing there grinnin like a possum and waiting to shake his hand.
  15. Brown_Eyed_Girl

    Brown_Eyed_Girl New Member

    I think that most of us (more seasoned in life or have kids) would know how to treat/immobilize sprains, cuts and breaks, but can people recognize the signs of a heart attack, diabetic shock or a stroke?
  16. dannyboy

    dannyboy From the promised LAND

    Mike, it might be manditory north of the border, but not in the states.

    As far as first responders, they are trained to deal with Hazmat issues, not health crisis.

    Dont get me wrong, the idea has merit, just not going to happen with a sue happy nation, with scumbag lawyers that will sue just knowing they will get a settlement to go away.

  17. over9five

    over9five Moderator Staff Member

    Good story.

    Back in the day (way back), I was an EMT, and it was illegal for an EMT to drive past an accident and not give aid. In class, they even suggested NOT putting EMT stickers on your car just in case someone saw you drive by an accident.

    Any current EMTs know if this is still true?
  18. Mike23

    Mike23 Guest

    There's nothing in the US stating that they need certain amount of personnel in the work place to know first aid? I'm not trying to be argumentative (for once) but Canada AND the UK have this law and usually when we have it the US has it also?

    I'm not too sure how it is in the states with all the sueing. I would think though that a workplace first aider would be safe from this? Isn't it some states that adopted the good Samaritan act? Would it not fall under this also?

    I can't seem to find anything on workplace first aid in the US. Maybe everyone's right and it's just sue happy...Geez, now I'm scared to go to the US. I'd be paranoid about getting sued for bumping into someone.
  19. dannyboy

    dannyboy From the promised LAND

    The problem with something like this is that someone that has watched House or Mash thinks they know what to do. And end up doing more damage than good.

    I remember not that long ago some teens riding around in the back of the pick up. One boy was streaking/truck surfing, or what ever they call it. Fell out of the back of the truck. He had bad injuries, especially to the neck. Some of the kids tried to help by putting on his shorts, and actually made the injury more severe, severe enough to have killed him.

    Every day there are accidents that injure or kill people in the states. Doctors and nurses drive by, not willing to assist for fear of the possibility of getting sued.

    Same for the docs at the hospital. They will run all sorts of tests, many that are not needed in reality, but because a lawyer can make a case that you could have run those tests to further the healthcare of the patient, they are run anyway.

    There is a whole industry among lawyers that feed on this type of conduct, which is one of the reasons our healthcare costs are so high, including liability insurance for doctors.

  20. doogapf

    doogapf New Member

    (straight from Red Cross training this year)


    Face - check subject for facial expressions, victims will have one side not functioning

    Arms - have subject hold arms out straight in front like Frankenstein, victims will not be able to keep one arm out like the other

    Speech - victims may have slurred speech, unclear or confused speech

    Time - VERY IMPORTANT to mark the time of the stroke/incident, share with medical professionals.

    Remember this information because it may happen when you least expect it... my dad had a stroke back in 2002, and lucky enough he was with his coworkers (who took him into the hospital). He's doing fine now thank god, his left side at about 95% of his previous functioning.

    Like my dad said shortly after, "different strokes for different folks." :happy2: