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<blockquote data-quote="wkmac" data-source="post: 2806126" data-attributes="member: 2189"><p>My own reading is that what is called the "Native US population" that being the core population minus all forms of immigration has been below replacement birthrate since 1979'. Thus another reason I thought the recent comments of Bill Nye, who plays a scientist, concerning penalizing people who have to many kids because of population issues to be funny. Declining birthrates are to the point that even the <a href="https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4255510/" target="_blank"><span style="color: #ff0000"><strong>National Institutes of Health</strong></span></a> are concerned about it long term. Thus the comedy of Mr. Scientist's comments.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Had you pointed out "ONLY" the growth of El Paso over the last 60 plus years and the population growth itself, I could appreciate that. I live in an area when I came to it nearly 50 years ago didn't even have a million people and now we are over 6 million and trends are we will pass 8 million is the next 20 years. I can relate as this brings infrastructure pressures, social pressures from crowding so many people into a ever decreasing space, etc. so yeah on that I hear ya. But you made sure to highlight one thing and that is this: quoting you here,</p><p></p><p>"in 1950 El Paso had 150,000 population and <strong>80% were Anglo</strong>...........Now upwards of 800,000, and <strong>close to 80% Hispanic.</strong> "</p><p></p><p>Why the obsessive focus on race/culture? Would it be OK if El Paso was 5 million or 50 million as long as they were, your words, "Anglo"? How would you feel if El Paso was now 80% African American?</p><p></p><p>As a side note to this, I do think on a policy level there is an effort to greater concentrate populations into what is termed "mega" population centers on the idea that the more centralized we are the more efficient. This is for another thread sometime but throwing out as food for thought too.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Some of the best numbers on illegals say we have about 13 million at any given time and not all of them are Hispanic either. Out of a national population inching toward 350 million, 13 million is not a number that exactly jumps off the page at me. Even less when I know all of those are not Hispanic which seems your focus here.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Not exactly fond of trapping these folks in the same bull$chitt system we are trapped in but I'll compromise and go along with that.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Seems reasonable to me.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I don't think that. Conservatives like anyone else are a mixed bag of many flavors and tastes. I've met liberals who I thought were some of the most heartless people on the planet. Some of my favorite conservatives are Catholics who like the system of <a href="http://www.theamericanconservative.com/articles/distributism-is-the-future/" target="_blank"><span style="color: #ff0000"><strong>distributism</strong></span></a>. Great and thoughtful conversations are had there. </p><p></p><p>My only issue with some conservatives is the same I have with some liberals. Both get locked into the idea of a one size fits all and I completely disagree with that thinking. The more decentralized, the more I like it. Refreshingly there is a growing trend among political conservatives and liberals who are rethinking that centralization construct and coming to appreciate more decentralized structures which they then craft their own local lives to how they want to live and according to their local customs and values. But then most of those are also abandoning the labels of conservative and liberal too.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>No argument, keep talkin'</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I would agree but let me pose a question directly to that point and this is just one question of MANY. What if such things as international economic trade agreements like NAFTA for example were undermining their own local economies and their own ability to live, work and run their own lives? "IF" that were the case and "IF" you happen to be in their shoes, what do you think you might do to support your family and loved ones?</p><p></p><p>Sometimes the question we won't ask is "why would someone do that in the first place?" Do we honestly think these people want to leave the very area they've called home not just for generations but for centuries if not longer? Leave family, life long friends, a community, only to come here and sponge off of us for "the good life"?</p><p></p><p>This also goes back to understand how 21st century empire works as opposed to previous models.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="wkmac, post: 2806126, member: 2189"] My own reading is that what is called the "Native US population" that being the core population minus all forms of immigration has been below replacement birthrate since 1979'. Thus another reason I thought the recent comments of Bill Nye, who plays a scientist, concerning penalizing people who have to many kids because of population issues to be funny. Declining birthrates are to the point that even the [URL='https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4255510/'][COLOR=#ff0000][B]National Institutes of Health[/B][/COLOR][/URL] are concerned about it long term. Thus the comedy of Mr. Scientist's comments. Had you pointed out "ONLY" the growth of El Paso over the last 60 plus years and the population growth itself, I could appreciate that. I live in an area when I came to it nearly 50 years ago didn't even have a million people and now we are over 6 million and trends are we will pass 8 million is the next 20 years. I can relate as this brings infrastructure pressures, social pressures from crowding so many people into a ever decreasing space, etc. so yeah on that I hear ya. But you made sure to highlight one thing and that is this: quoting you here, "in 1950 El Paso had 150,000 population and [B]80% were Anglo[/B]...........Now upwards of 800,000, and [B]close to 80% Hispanic.[/B] " Why the obsessive focus on race/culture? Would it be OK if El Paso was 5 million or 50 million as long as they were, your words, "Anglo"? How would you feel if El Paso was now 80% African American? As a side note to this, I do think on a policy level there is an effort to greater concentrate populations into what is termed "mega" population centers on the idea that the more centralized we are the more efficient. This is for another thread sometime but throwing out as food for thought too. Some of the best numbers on illegals say we have about 13 million at any given time and not all of them are Hispanic either. Out of a national population inching toward 350 million, 13 million is not a number that exactly jumps off the page at me. Even less when I know all of those are not Hispanic which seems your focus here. Not exactly fond of trapping these folks in the same bull$chitt system we are trapped in but I'll compromise and go along with that. Seems reasonable to me. I don't think that. Conservatives like anyone else are a mixed bag of many flavors and tastes. I've met liberals who I thought were some of the most heartless people on the planet. Some of my favorite conservatives are Catholics who like the system of [URL='http://www.theamericanconservative.com/articles/distributism-is-the-future/'][COLOR=#ff0000][B]distributism[/B][/COLOR][/URL]. Great and thoughtful conversations are had there. My only issue with some conservatives is the same I have with some liberals. Both get locked into the idea of a one size fits all and I completely disagree with that thinking. The more decentralized, the more I like it. Refreshingly there is a growing trend among political conservatives and liberals who are rethinking that centralization construct and coming to appreciate more decentralized structures which they then craft their own local lives to how they want to live and according to their local customs and values. But then most of those are also abandoning the labels of conservative and liberal too. No argument, keep talkin' I would agree but let me pose a question directly to that point and this is just one question of MANY. What if such things as international economic trade agreements like NAFTA for example were undermining their own local economies and their own ability to live, work and run their own lives? "IF" that were the case and "IF" you happen to be in their shoes, what do you think you might do to support your family and loved ones? Sometimes the question we won't ask is "why would someone do that in the first place?" Do we honestly think these people want to leave the very area they've called home not just for generations but for centuries if not longer? Leave family, life long friends, a community, only to come here and sponge off of us for "the good life"? This also goes back to understand how 21st century empire works as opposed to previous models. [/QUOTE]
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