Question on seniority, breaks, Sups working and the 3.5 guaranteed hours.

[BryantheLion]

They're pretty simple questions actually, I'd just like to make sure of their answers though.

I was hired during the peak and became permanent. Will my seniority date be January 1st since I was hired during the "freeze" period?

For breaks, yesterday we had the PT Sup tell everyone that we're working through break. Could I have taken my break anyway? Also, lets say I work 5 hours for the day and work through break..do I get paid those 5 hours or would it be 5 hours and 10 minutes? If I took my break, would I get paid 5 hours or 4 hours and 50 minutes? Just a bit confused on how that works.

The 3.5 guaranteed hours. If I go in to work and they send me home after an hour, am I entitled to to 3.5 or can I at least tell them that I don't wanna go home until I at least complete my 3.5?

Are PT Sups allowed to do any work at all? Break jams, get the slide down, scan and load, move irregs etc? I've been noticing a few new PT Sups around my PD helping out, probably about 2-3 of them that I never saw before and I started thinking if they were possibly taking my work while I'm being sent home. (This wasn't the first time I was sent home as soon as I arrived). I can't say for sure that they were working that Monday, but how can I ever tell or what can I do about it?

Thanks in advance.

 

[zgirl86]

You make seniority on your 31st day. Once you make seniority, your seniority date is the first date you worked at UPS. For example, if your first day of working at UPS was August 1st and you make seniority on September 15th, your seniority date is August 1st.

You cannot be forced to work through your break. The contract stipulates that break is to be given after the first hour, and before the start of the fourth hour. Technically, if you're only working 3.5 hours a day, I guess management wouldn't have to give you a break. However, if you are working 5 hours a day as you said, then yes, they must give you a break before the start of the fourth hour.

You are GUARANTEED 3.5 hours of work a day - meaning they have to pay you for your guaranteed 3.5 hours, even if they only use you for an hour and send you home - unless of course you accept time off available (which is without pay).

No member of management (PT sup, on car sup, dispatcher, center manager, etc.) or any non-union employee should touch a package - whether it be breaking a jam, taping boxes, loading cars, splitting the belt, pulling boxes from the belt, etc. Their job is strictly to supervise. If they are having to work, then they need to hire more employees.

As for them sending you home and then doing the work themselves, well I would file a grievance on this and ask for back pay for the hours they worked and you were sent home. Find one or two people who can verify that the sup was working that day and have them sign a statement to attach to your grievance.

 

[BryantheLion]

Thanks a lot for the information. Answered everything I needed to know. Just one more thing, where exactly in the contract does it talk about the breaks or the guaranteed 3.5? I've looked at the PT Employee section and couldn't find it. I skimmed nearly through everything, but focused more on what's relevant to me.

 

[zgirl86]

My mistake - break must not start before the end of the first hour and must be completed by the end of the third hour (Article 49 Section 3).

Article 22 last paragraph of Section 5 talks about the 3-1/2 hour guarantee.

 

[what_egress]

I was recently rehired after peak and I am still in my 30 days probation. I work on the local sort in the evening and this past week they changed my start time to 6:30 and are sending me home before 9 resulting in less than 3.5 hours worked. When I arrive at work there is a pt sup loading the trailer with another hourly employee who then unloads the package cars when I arrive. My question is since I am still in the 30 day probation can I say something about the pt sup working and me being sent home early without 3.5 hours?

 

[PT Car Washer]

Yes you can say something. But remember until you get your 30 days in they can release you for any reason or no reason.

 

[what_egress]

Thanks for the reply. I will take your advice and get my 30 days in before saying something.

 

[RandomDrone]

This is interesting because PT sups work with packages all the time at my hub. I don't personally blame them because they are trying to make things go smoother and are under many of the same pressures as the hourlies. I was under the impression that breaking jams and such was allowed, but loading was not. PT sups do both constantly and most people don't grieve it because they just want some relief from the amount of volume coming in.

 

[PT Car Washer]

This is interesting because PT sups work with packages all the time at my hub. I don't personally blame them because they are trying to make things go smoother and are under many of the same pressures as the hourlies. I was under the impression that breaking jams and such was allowed, but loading was not. PT sups do both constantly and most people don't grieve it because they just want some relief from the amount of volume coming in.

You are correct when you say most PTers appreciate the extra help a PT sup provides. Until you remember UPS could just hire another Union employee to do that job. UPS says they can not hire enough PT help at the negotiated wages. So UPS hires PT sups at twice the Union rate to do our Union jobs. Sups are not to do any Union work.

 

[RandomDrone]

You are correct when you say most PTers appreciate the extra help a PT sup provides. Until you remember UPS could just hire another Union employee to do that job. UPS says they can not hire enough PT help at the negotiated wages. So UPS hires PT sups at twice the Union rate to do our Union jobs. Sups are not to do any Union work.

I completely agree. My point (which was badly articulated) is that in the heat of the moment most people are glad if a sup comes in to help them. If you are backed up and need climbing gear to get out of the trailer you just want the day to end. Intentional or not, this leads to sups doing more union work and less people grieving.

Over time, this will break the union because most people don't care enough to stir the pot and grieve and a high amount of flow and not enough workers leads to the sups jumping in to save things.

 

[PT Car Washer]

I completely agree. My point (which was badly articulated) is that in the heat of the moment most people are glad if a sup comes in to help them. If you are backed up and need climbing gear to get out of the trailer you just want the day to end. Intentional or not, this leads to sups doing more union work and less people grieving.

Over time, this will break the union because most people don't care enough to stir the pot and grieve and a high amount of flow and not enough workers leads to the sups jumping in to save things.

You just said it all. I believe that is the plan. A lot of times I will be walking by sups working for what? 5 or 10 minutes? File for what?

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

You just said it all. I believe that is the plan. A lot of times I will be walking by sups working for what? 5 or 10 minutes? File for what?

The sad reality is that most PTers can't wait to get out of there and couldn't care less who is helping them get done. Most don't even know about or care enough to demand their 3.5 guarantee.

 

[EmraldArcher]

You cannot be forced to work through your break.

So if my full time supervisors tells me I'm working through break and I take it anyway I'm not going to get fired for failing to work as directed?

 

[upschuck]

So if my full time supervisors tells me I'm working through break and I take it anyway I'm not going to get fired for failing to work as directed?

No no no no no. They can't fire you for abiding by the contract.

 

[PT Car Washer]

So if my full time supervisors tells me I'm working through break and I take it anyway I'm not going to get fired for failing to work as directed?

You may want to be careful how you phrase your refusal and have a steward nearby to document everything.

 

[30 to life]

No no no no no. They can't fire you for abiding by the contract.

They can fire you for not working as directed. Always work as directed then file the grievance. Make sure you write down the time it happens and who is involved.

 

[EmraldArcher]

No no no no no. They can't fire you for abiding by the contract.

You really believe this? They can fire you for whatever they want.

It doesn't mean you won't get your job back but telling someone they can't be fired just because the contract says they're right is not doing anyone any good.

What is the penalty to the company if they force you to work through break? You file a grievance, big deal. There is no monetary penalty and that's the only thing that gets them to stop violating the contract.

 

[upschuck]

I have never seen anyone fired for something like this, taking your break when contract says. Your BA would have a field day.

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

It is always best to work as directed and then file the grievance.

 

[upschuck]

I know people that have been fired for "working as directed".