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US Gun Owners To Face Extradition And Foreign Prosecution
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<blockquote data-quote="wkmac" data-source="post: 538633" data-attributes="member: 2189"><p>With all due respect for Jones position on treaties, his point about violating at will also being true, there is IMO a basis on my own reading in law libraries of treaties and case law that they can have a nefarious end of circumventing constitutional protections of State power. Even tax law has been greatly effected as some of the power of taxation currently enjoyed by the gov't comes about via international treaties signed over (believe it or not) opium and alcohol dating back to the early days of the 20th century.</p><p></p><p>But all that aside, I'm not convinced all guns will be rounded up as a result of this treaty. Now on the flipside, some might argue the Heller case sealed the deal for gun rights and IMO a case "could" be made that a treaty could in fact kill this decision. I said could not that it would so don't go bouncing off walls just yet. Politicians are like Pavlov's dog as their incapable of any real deep processed thought. They act only upon hearing the bell and typically that act can be predicted. It's another reason we get so much bad law and the well connected seem to prosper at the expense of most of us!</p><p></p><p>As for gun registration, we already have that and have had that for years. You fill out a form 4473 everytime you buy one. Now there are ways to circumvent to some extent but the vast majority of gun transactions are done to the letter in this manner and therefore, there is a paper trail to every gun from manufacturer to end user. Gun commits crime (calm down, having fun) gun obtained by police, police trace serial number from maker to store to owner and slap on the cuffs. Even my homocide cop neighbor when the Mexican guns thing first came to light said, "trace the numbers" and charge whoever with accessory at the very least. He worked with FBI and Interpol and he told me that he believes there is even meat in RICO that could be used since RICO is now being used against the gangs. If gangs are being charged under RICO with conspiracy, then charge whoever helps them with conspiracy as well.</p><p></p><p>The reason a treaty is coming up IMO is 2 fold. The hidden is, "somebody wants something" whatever that something is. That treaty is going to give someone or something some form of advantage and I don't think that advantage is taking all our guns or locking up all gun owners. Consider this, they lock up all gun owners in America and the entire American system collapses in a day. Yep, you heard me, a day! No workers, no business owners, no doctors, no electrical generating workers, no water company workers, "NO UPS DRIVERS" do I need to go on to make that point?</p><p>They be dumb but they not be that dumb.<img src="/community/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/FeltTip/happy-very.png" class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":happy-very:" title="Happy Very :happy-very:" data-shortname=":happy-very:" /></p><p></p><p>Now the overt reason is purely for the entertainment value of us voting rubes out here in the real world. The politicians can use this legislation to show the home rubes I mean home folks that they are concerned about the Mexican violence and are doing something about it. Also they use "crisis" like this to convince the rest of us that we are not safe, we are at great risk and they are here to protect us and keep us safe. Without them we would surely die.</p><p></p><p>I say again, trace the numbers on the weapons to their sources and you can prove beyond doubt that these guns are being bought via local gun stores and then shipped south. Tracing the numbers is your strongest ally so why would the US gov't resist doing so?</p><p></p><p>It's funny how some people will bet the farm gov't is lying about Iraq and yet will bet the farm they don't lie elsewhere. If they fabricated a complete lie to justify Vietnam (this they have admitted in the Gulf of Tonkin incident) then what's to stop a lie with Iraq or a lie concerning guns in Mexico?</p><p></p><p>Trust is earned not given just because you win a beauty contest!</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="wkmac, post: 538633, member: 2189"] With all due respect for Jones position on treaties, his point about violating at will also being true, there is IMO a basis on my own reading in law libraries of treaties and case law that they can have a nefarious end of circumventing constitutional protections of State power. Even tax law has been greatly effected as some of the power of taxation currently enjoyed by the gov't comes about via international treaties signed over (believe it or not) opium and alcohol dating back to the early days of the 20th century. But all that aside, I'm not convinced all guns will be rounded up as a result of this treaty. Now on the flipside, some might argue the Heller case sealed the deal for gun rights and IMO a case "could" be made that a treaty could in fact kill this decision. I said could not that it would so don't go bouncing off walls just yet. Politicians are like Pavlov's dog as their incapable of any real deep processed thought. They act only upon hearing the bell and typically that act can be predicted. It's another reason we get so much bad law and the well connected seem to prosper at the expense of most of us! As for gun registration, we already have that and have had that for years. You fill out a form 4473 everytime you buy one. Now there are ways to circumvent to some extent but the vast majority of gun transactions are done to the letter in this manner and therefore, there is a paper trail to every gun from manufacturer to end user. Gun commits crime (calm down, having fun) gun obtained by police, police trace serial number from maker to store to owner and slap on the cuffs. Even my homocide cop neighbor when the Mexican guns thing first came to light said, "trace the numbers" and charge whoever with accessory at the very least. He worked with FBI and Interpol and he told me that he believes there is even meat in RICO that could be used since RICO is now being used against the gangs. If gangs are being charged under RICO with conspiracy, then charge whoever helps them with conspiracy as well. The reason a treaty is coming up IMO is 2 fold. The hidden is, "somebody wants something" whatever that something is. That treaty is going to give someone or something some form of advantage and I don't think that advantage is taking all our guns or locking up all gun owners. Consider this, they lock up all gun owners in America and the entire American system collapses in a day. Yep, you heard me, a day! No workers, no business owners, no doctors, no electrical generating workers, no water company workers, "NO UPS DRIVERS" do I need to go on to make that point? They be dumb but they not be that dumb.:happy-very: Now the overt reason is purely for the entertainment value of us voting rubes out here in the real world. The politicians can use this legislation to show the home rubes I mean home folks that they are concerned about the Mexican violence and are doing something about it. Also they use "crisis" like this to convince the rest of us that we are not safe, we are at great risk and they are here to protect us and keep us safe. Without them we would surely die. I say again, trace the numbers on the weapons to their sources and you can prove beyond doubt that these guns are being bought via local gun stores and then shipped south. Tracing the numbers is your strongest ally so why would the US gov't resist doing so? It's funny how some people will bet the farm gov't is lying about Iraq and yet will bet the farm they don't lie elsewhere. If they fabricated a complete lie to justify Vietnam (this they have admitted in the Gulf of Tonkin incident) then what's to stop a lie with Iraq or a lie concerning guns in Mexico? Trust is earned not given just because you win a beauty contest! [/QUOTE]
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