Waiting for Superman.

ORLY!?!

Master Loader
Great, thanks for the link.:happy-very:

Sorry, the site only allows you to watch so much of video. The timing is off too, but it isnt an issue. Theres torrent sites that you can get it, but I'd rather admin give me the ok to post it. I will try to contact someone to see if i could.

Its a great site if you wanna see shows and movies. Sorry if I upset you at all. I didnt expect that timeline freeze as well. Which is real bs! Contact me if you like I could point you in a good direction.
 
For the most part, it is. I'm sure there are rotten teachers, and they deserve to go, but going after the unions is the main goal here...teachers are a secondary concern. I notice you are retired, presumably from UPS, and presumably from a union job. You've got your pension, which is much better than the one I'll get from FedEx, so why not put your money where your mouth is, and just return that evil union pension to those nice folks at UPS. Refuse it, donate it, but don't be a hypocrite who advocates killing unions when you are suckling from the union yourself (presumably).

Show me where I said anything about destroying unions. Fact is I did not say that. My Ex wife retired from 20+ years as a teacher with a pretty good retirement. Can she thank the union? Oh hell no, because the teachers union here does not get involved with salary negotiations or pensions, they do zero in the direction of what is normally thought as union functions. The teachers union acts as a lobbyist organization and most of the teachers here are quite satisfied. So, yea it can be done without a union. FYI, I have defended the Teamsters presence at UPS in many a debate of the "evil union". I am not anti-union but I am anti-unreasonable union.

Why should I give back the pension that I have earned? We can go back and forth with examples of both good and bad union actions, but that will not change a thing. To cut to the chase, UPS makes a hefty profit and the union negotiates a return of some of those profits for the workers wages and other compensations. No one holds a gun to the head of UPS customers and they have options of where to do business. The state, any state, makes zero profit. Following the model set by the UPS/Teamsters, the state employees would be bound to work for exactly nothing...zero pay or benefits. The government holds a virtual gun to the tax payers head and there are few, if any, options for the consumer of the states services.
 

The Other Side

Well-Known Troll
Troll
NOBODY saw this movie and it was yanked from theatres after the first week. Some theatres didnt even OFFER this right wing exaggeration P.O.C.

Quotes:
"The film dismisses with a side comment the inconvenient truth that our schools are criminally underfunded. Money's not the answer, it glibly declares. Nor does it suggest that students would have better outcomes if their communities had jobs, health care, decent housing, and a living wage. Particularly dishonest is the fact that Guggenheim never mentions the tens of millions of dollars of private money that has poured into the Harlem Children's Zone, the model and superman we are relentlessly instructed to aspire to."
— Rick Ayers, Adjunct Professor in Education at the University of San Francisco[22]
Author and academic Rick Ayers lambasted the accuracy of the film, describing it as "a slick marketing piece full of half-truths and distortions."[22] In Ayers' view, the "corporate powerhouses and the ideological opponents of all things public" have employed the film to "break the teacher's unions and to privatize education", while driving teachers' wages even lower and running "schools like little corporations."[22] The film does, however, note that since 1971, inflation-adjusted per-student spending has more than doubled, "from $4,300 to more than $9,000 per student," but that over the same period, test scores have "flatlined." Ayers also critiqued the film's promotion of a greater focus on "top-down instruction driven by test scores", positing that extensive research has demonstrated that standardized testing "dumbs down the curriculum" and "reproduces inequities", while marginalizing "English language learners and those who do not grow up speaking a middle class vernacular."[22] Lastly, Ayers contends that "schools are more segregated today than before Brown v. Board of Education in 1954", and thus criticized the film for not mentioning that in his view, "black and brown students are being suspended, expelled, searched, and criminalized."[22]
Diane Ravitch, Research Professor of Education at New York University and a nonresident senior fellow at the Brookings Institution, similarly criticizes the accuracy of the film.[23] Ravitch notes that a study by Stanford University economist Margaret Raymond of 5000 charter schools found that only 17% are superior in math test performance to a matched public school, casting doubt on the film's claim that privately managed charter schools are the solution to bad public schools.[23] The film does note however that most charter schools do not outperform and that it focuses on those that do. As well, the film explicitly stated that 1 in 5 charter schools (close to the 17% statistic previously stated) were the overreaching, superior charter schools. Ravitch writes that many charter schools also perform badly, are involved in "unsavory real estate deals" and expel low-performing students before testing days to ensure high test scores.[23] The most substantial distortion in the film, according to Ravitch, is the film's claim that "70 percent of eighth-grade students cannot read at grade level", a misrepresentation of data from the National Assessment of Educational Progress.[23] Ravitch served as a board member with the NAEP and notes that "the NAEP doesn't measure performance in terms of grade-level achievement", as claimed in the film, but only as "advanced", "proficient", and "basic". The film assumes that any student below proficient is "below grade level", but this claim is not supported by the NAEP data.

**The movie was intended on being the lead dog in the fight against unions in this country. The republicans over a year ago decided to attack unions in every state as a way to win back the white house in 2012. Little by little, they have used FOX news as the mouthpiece for attacking unions everywhere, everyday. After the Nov midterms, they used their new elected powers to place the attacks on unions in effect. **

This movie BOMBED in the theatres as most right wing movies do.

Peace.
 

wkmac

Well-Known Member
Well the same thing could be said for Food Inc. (great movie) and this was no right wing hit piece by any stretch. And find a theater carrying the Pat Tillman Story.

Your remark is utter Bullschitt TOS! The educational system outside the whole union false flag nonsense is completely and totally :censored2: UP! Both political sides are waving that bloody flag around just so the lemmings won't look beyond the curtain.

Even outspoken left winger Roger Waters in The Wall completely understood the nature of social collective education and he's not alone at all on speaking out from that side of the fence. Hell, even the new schools being built look more and more like a prison and in reality that is exactly what they are. Watch a good prison movie from CoolHand Luke, Brubaker, to Shawshank and be honest and tell me how a cell block is no different in reality to the modern day educational structure. All the schools are designed to do is to churn out mindless robots for the economic production line called obedient employees that are also obedient to the state. The goal is that they never understand and question their station in life.

I believe to unionize is as fundamental in the free market as for one to make a profit but for any state protected monopoly at the point of a gun to use it's status to force others to pay their tab while denying all the free choice of doing something different, you and the rest of them can go :censored2: yourselves where the sun don't shine.

Sorry in advance mods if my words require you to work but I stand by them!
 
NOBODY saw this movie and it was yanked from theatres after the first week. Some theatres didnt even OFFER this right wing exaggeration P.O.C.

Quotes:
"The film dismisses with a side comment the inconvenient truth that our schools are criminally underfunded. Money's not the answer, it glibly declares. Nor does it suggest that students would have better outcomes if their communities had jobs, health care, decent housing, and a living wage. Particularly dishonest is the fact that Guggenheim never mentions the tens of millions of dollars of private money that has poured into the Harlem Children's Zone, the model and superman we are relentlessly instructed to aspire to."
— Rick Ayers, Adjunct Professor in Education at the University of San Francisco[22]
Author and academic Rick Ayers lambasted the accuracy of the film, describing it as "a slick marketing piece full of half-truths and distortions."[22] In Ayers' view, the "corporate powerhouses and the ideological opponents of all things public" have employed the film to "break the teacher's unions and to privatize education", while driving teachers' wages even lower and running "schools like little corporations."[22] The film does, however, note that since 1971, inflation-adjusted per-student spending has more than doubled, "from $4,300 to more than $9,000 per student," but that over the same period, test scores have "flatlined." Ayers also critiqued the film's promotion of a greater focus on "top-down instruction driven by test scores", positing that extensive research has demonstrated that standardized testing "dumbs down the curriculum" and "reproduces inequities", while marginalizing "English language learners and those who do not grow up speaking a middle class vernacular."[22] Lastly, Ayers contends that "schools are more segregated today than before Brown v. Board of Education in 1954", and thus criticized the film for not mentioning that in his view, "black and brown students are being suspended, expelled, searched, and criminalized."[22]
Diane Ravitch, Research Professor of Education at New York University and a nonresident senior fellow at the Brookings Institution, similarly criticizes the accuracy of the film.[23] Ravitch notes that a study by Stanford University economist Margaret Raymond of 5000 charter schools found that only 17% are superior in math test performance to a matched public school, casting doubt on the film's claim that privately managed charter schools are the solution to bad public schools.[23] The film does note however that most charter schools do not outperform and that it focuses on those that do. As well, the film explicitly stated that 1 in 5 charter schools (close to the 17% statistic previously stated) were the overreaching, superior charter schools. Ravitch writes that many charter schools also perform badly, are involved in "unsavory real estate deals" and expel low-performing students before testing days to ensure high test scores.[23] The most substantial distortion in the film, according to Ravitch, is the film's claim that "70 percent of eighth-grade students cannot read at grade level", a misrepresentation of data from the National Assessment of Educational Progress.[23] Ravitch served as a board member with the NAEP and notes that "the NAEP doesn't measure performance in terms of grade-level achievement", as claimed in the film, but only as "advanced", "proficient", and "basic". The film assumes that any student below proficient is "below grade level", but this claim is not supported by the NAEP data.

**The movie was intended on being the lead dog in the fight against unions in this country. The republicans over a year ago decided to attack unions in every state as a way to win back the white house in 2012. Little by little, they have used FOX news as the mouthpiece for attacking unions everywhere, everyday. After the Nov midterms, they used their new elected powers to place the attacks on unions in effect. **

This movie BOMBED in the theatres as most right wing movies do.

Peace.
Well this piece just has to be gospel, coming from an ultra-liberal "educator" in an ultra-liberal rag...the Huffington Post. Is this Rick Ayers the brother of Bill Ayers, 0's buddy?
My point is not that what he says isn't correct or that he isn't due his opinion, just pointing out that it may be as biased as he says the film is.
I do have to wonder what he thought about Micheal Moore's documentaries. Since he used the phrase " inconvenient truth"
 

MrFedEx

Engorged Member
Show me where I said anything about destroying unions. Fact is I did not say that. My Ex wife retired from 20+ years as a teacher with a pretty good retirement. Can she thank the union? Oh hell no, because the teachers union here does not get involved with salary negotiations or pensions, they do zero in the direction of what is normally thought as union functions. The teachers union acts as a lobbyist organization and most of the teachers here are quite satisfied. So, yea it can be done without a union. FYI, I have defended the Teamsters presence at UPS in many a debate of the "evil union". I am not anti-union but I am anti-unreasonable union.

Why should I give back the pension that I have earned? We can go back and forth with examples of both good and bad union actions, but that will not change a thing. To cut to the chase, UPS makes a hefty profit and the union negotiates a return of some of those profits for the workers wages and other compensations. No one holds a gun to the head of UPS customers and they have options of where to do business. The state, any state, makes zero profit. Following the model set by the UPS/Teamsters, the state employees would be bound to work for exactly nothing...zero pay or benefits. The government holds a virtual gun to the tax payers head and there are few, if any, options for the consumer of the states services.

It's pretty obvious that the GOP plan is to go after the public sector unions and then point their guns at private sector unions. The first is a much easier target than the second. I still find it interesting that both you and your spouse are direct beneficiaries of unions and their influence yet you support efforts to kill them off. That's a big part of what the Right Wing is all about, or do you even realize that? Job #1 is the defeat of Obama, Job #2 is killing unions and their support of Democrats, and Job#3 is to take us back to 1950 (good luck with that).

You've got yours already, so now it's OK to get rid of the unions. It won't affect your check.
 

wkmac

Well-Known Member
Well this piece just has to be gospel, coming from an ultra-liberal "educator" in an ultra-liberal rag...the Huffington Post. Is this Rick Ayers the brother of Bill Ayers, 0's buddy?
My point is not that what he says isn't correct or that he isn't due his opinion, just pointing out that it may be as biased as he says the film is.
I do have to wonder what he thought about Micheal Moore's documentaries. Since he used the phrase " inconvenient truth"

I believe the same director of Inconvenient Truth also wrote and directed Waiting for Superman. friend'ing right wingers!
:wink2:
 

ORLY!?!

Master Loader
I believe the same director of Inconvenient Truth also wrote and directed Waiting for Superman. friend'ing right wingers!
:wink2:

I wouldnt be surprised if it where true. Could wiki or google but the facts are out there for someone else to find out.

I found the movie sad and moving. Yet I believe this only to be an attempt to throw more money at a sinking ship. The lottery struck me as cruel, and the parents that work hard to pay for their kids schooling and willing to take them miles out of way to school promising. But that is only a fraction, tip of the iceberg, of parents in a sea of loser and non caring type parents. Those who rather get rid of their kid for a few hours, in the form of school, as a type of child day care.

To those winning the school draw reacted as if they really won a lot of money. Yet the facts presented that those schools make 99% of their intake read for a four year college. I really smell the act to inject more money into these type of schools.

The fact really left out of this movie is to why Finland is has the best school system in the world. One, smaller state ( country ), smaller population. Two they inject skills early, trade skills along side courses to ready them for college ( all selective of course ). Lastly they offer free education for all, at any time. Anyone at any age can attend thus enrich themselves. Good system, best in the world, but they sure do pay for it in the end.
 
I believe the same director of Inconvenient Truth also wrote and directed Waiting for Superman. friend'ing right wingers!
:wink2:
Hmmm, for some reason I thought " Inconvenient Truth" was from one of Moore's films. That doesn't change the fact that Ayers is a bit left if liberals. I guess it runs in the family. Thanks for straightening me out on that.
 

The Other Side

Well-Known Troll
Troll
Id like someone on this board to specifically point out where bill ayers was arrested, charged, put on trial and convicted of anything in this country...?

Lets see if anyone wants to step up to the plate and repeat something "fabricated" supplied by fox news, glen beck or the right wing.

Yes, everyone knows he belonged to a group called "the weathermen" named after a Bob Dylan lyric, but in the 60's, there was a ton of anti goverment sentiment towards our involvement in southeast asia.

Many groups formed during that period, and many of them merged, as in Bill Ayers case. Some did some pretty bad things, and some went to prison over them, but what I would like to see from our "informed" right wingers, is PROOF that Ayers did anything wrong, and sustained by a conviction.

The right wing smears Ayers and his wife, and looks beyond their college educations. Smearing both, and then its followers run around and repeat those smears without a single fact behind them.

Show us a conviction for anything related to terrorism, bombings, murder, or treason.

Im waiting.

Peace.
 

moreluck

golden ticket member
Ayers participated in a series of bombings in the late ’60s and early ’70s, whose targets included the New York City police headquarters and the Pentagon. Ayers turned himself over to authorities in 1980, and eventually became an active part in the reforming of the Chicago educational system.
Ayers’ first arrest was for a sit-in at a Chicago draft board.
Ayers called himself a “small-’c’ communist” in the ’60s, and also participated in a movement called “Smash Monogamy.”
While no one was killed by any of the bombings he was involved in, several Weather Underground members died accidentally while creating bombs.
Ayers has claimed that he “doesn’t regret” setting the bombs, and that he feels “we didn’t do enough.” He later clarified that “we didn’t do enough” did not mean “we didn’t bomb enough :censored2:,” but that the nation didn’t do enough to oppose the war. http://www.thefablife.com/2008-10-06/the-bill-ayers-scanda-list/

His first arrest came for a sit-in at a local draft board, resulting in 10 days in jail.
 

moreluck

golden ticket member
Ayers had previously been a roommate of Terry Robbins, a fellow militant who was killed in 1970 along with Ayers' girlfriend Oughton and one other member in the Greenwich Village townhouse explosion, while constructing anti-personnel bombs intended for a non-commissioned officer dance at Fort Dix, New Jersey.[11]

Later in 1969, Ayers participated in planting a bomb at a statue dedicated to police casualties in the 1886 Haymarket affair confrontation between labor supporters and the Chicago police.[12] The blast broke almost 100 windows and blew pieces of the statue onto the nearby Kennedy Expressway.[13] (The statue was rebuilt and unveiled on May 4, 1970, and blown up again by other Weathermen on October 6, 1970.[13][14] Rebuilding it yet again, the city posted a 24-hour police guard to prevent another blast, and in January 1972 it was moved to Chicago police headquarters.[15])

Ayers participated in the Days of Rage riot in Chicago in October 1969, and in December was at the "War Council" meeting in Flint, Michigan. Two major decisions came out of the "War Council." The first was to immediately begin a violent, armed struggle (e.g., bombings and armed robberies) against the state without attempting to organize or mobilize a broad swath of the public. The second was to create underground collectives in major cities throughout the country.[16] Larry Grathwohl, a Federal Bureau of Investigation informant in the Weatherman group from the fall of 1969 to the spring of 1970, stated that "Ayers, along with Bernardine Dohrn, probably had the most authority within the Weatherman".[17
 

moreluck

golden ticket member
Bernadine was a real peach too....

Dohrn was criticized for comments she made about the murders of actress Sharon Tate and retail store owners Leno and Rosemary LaBianca by the Charles Manson clan. In a speech during the December 1969 "War Council" meeting organized by the Weathermen, attended by about 400 people in Flint, Michigan, Dohrn said, "First they killed those pigs, then they ate dinner in the same room with them, then they even shoved a fork into the victim's stomach! Wild!"[13] In greeting each other, delegates to the war council often spread their fingers to signify the fork.[7]
 

bbsam

Moderator
Staff member
You won't have to worry about bbsam watching this video.....videos are for the ignorant folks who can't read.

Nah. I won't watch it because I know better. If my kids can't read, I don't have to point fingers at the school. Learning works better with parental involvement. Too many times there is none or sometimes actually parents can be a hinderance to the childs learning. Do whatever you want to fix the schools, but that isn't where the big problem lies.
 

Lue C Fur

Evil member
Nah. I won't watch it because I know better. If my kids can't read, I don't have to point fingers at the school. Learning works better with parental involvement. Too many times there is none or sometimes actually parents can be a hinderance to the childs learning. Do whatever you want to fix the schools, but that isn't where the big problem lies.

I agree with you (SHOCKER!!!) for once. Ive said this before that it starts with the parents and if your not involved with your kids lifes and school work then there is not much that a teacher and more money can do.
 

bbsam

Moderator
Staff member
I agree with you (SHOCKER!!!) for once. Ive said this before that it starts with the parents and if your not involved with your kids lifes and school work then there is not much that a teacher and more money can do.

There may be hope for you yet.:wink2::peaceful:
 
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