(link)UPS laid off nearly 50 air workers on Christmas Eve with no warning (link)

air_dr

Well-Known Member
Siredline010, thank you for contiuning to keep us updated, even as you continue to take what, I believe, are largely unfair beatings every time you post something on here.

As my user name suggests, I am an air driver and I work in the upper Midwest. Yesterday I got into a conversation with one of the on car sups who I have come to regard as an honest stright shooter. We met for something unrelated, but I just couldn't pass the opportunity to ask him about the future of Article 40 employees in our area and shared with him what I have come to know about the goings on in NY. He said the information was new to him and I believe he was sincere. Given what I have read here and what I was told yesterday, I have no idea what the future holds for me. I was once laid off as an air driver, and while it didn't happen on X-mas Eve, it did take place exactly on my 5th anniversary with the company, not only by date, but, even by day of the week. I had the impression the change was intended to be long term. For me, it came to pass that after 2 months I was back air driving again. This was back in 2005.

Having said what I just have, I absolutely cannot see my self taking personally a lay off and pay cut from the company. Even if it happens on Christmas Eve. And I would encourage those of you who believe the company treated you unjustly, to reconsider your feelings and possibly redirect your actions. I see employment, and especially employment under a union contract as a rule bound activity, sort of like a game of chess, or, better yet, as a sport like wrestling. If someone knocks you off your two feet and holds you to the ground - and it happens in a wrestling match two people agree to undertake, everything described (along with some minor bumps amd bruises) is part of the game. Very different from a situation where someone assaults you on the street. So long as you compete within the agreed upon rules, even if your opponent is a friend, you ought to do your best to "take him down." There is nothing dishonorable to being competitive, using your strengths, and exploiting your oponents weaknesses.

Back to UPS. We live in a capitalist system, and that is something for which I, at least, am thankful. The driving ideology behind American commerce is NOT "From each according to his ability, to each according to his need." Any organization ultimately keeps any particular individual on board in a particular role because that person contributes more to the organization than they cost. If UPS management has determined that the work air drivers do can be done at lower cost while still following the rules of the contract, I can only respect the changes they would make.

Now if the contract is being violated, that is where we must keep the comapny accountable. That will rquire all of us to keep watch and have a clear understanding of the rules. Instead of getting angry or hurt, let us all be students of our contract, and work with our union representatives in filing grievances when we observe our contract being violated.
 

tieguy

Banned
Siredline010, thank you for contiuning to keep us updated, even as you continue to take what, I believe, are largely unfair beatings every time you post something on here.

As my user name suggests, I am an air driver and I work in the upper Midwest. Yesterday I got into a conversation with one of the on car sups who I have come to regard as an honest stright shooter. We met for something unrelated, but I just couldn't pass the opportunity to ask him about the future of Article 40 employees in our area and shared with him what I have come to know about the goings on in NY. He said the information was new to him and I believe he was sincere. Given what I have read here and what I was told yesterday, I have no idea what the future holds for me. I was once laid off as an air driver, and while it didn't happen on X-mas Eve, it did take place exactly on my 5th anniversary with the company, not only by date, but, even by day of the week. I had the impression the change was intended to be long term. For me, it came to pass that after 2 months I was back air driving again. This was back in 2005.

Having said what I just have, I absolutely cannot see my self taking personally a lay off and pay cut from the company. Even if it happens on Christmas Eve. And I would encourage those of you who believe the company treated you unjustly, to reconsider your feelings and possibly redirect your actions. I see employment, and especially employment under a union contract as a rule bound activity, sort of like a game of chess, or, better yet, as a sport like wrestling. If someone knocks you off your two feet and holds you to the ground - and it happens in a wrestling match two people agree to undertake, everything described (along with some minor bumps amd bruises) is part of the game. Very different from a situation where someone assaults you on the street. So long as you compete within the agreed upon rules, even if your opponent is a friend, you ought to do your best to "take him down." There is nothing dishonorable to being competitive, using your strengths, and exploiting your oponents weaknesses.

Back to UPS. We live in a capitalist system, and that is something for which I, at least, am thankful. The driving ideology behind American commerce is NOT "From each according to his ability, to each according to his need." Any organization ultimately keeps any particular individual on board in a particular role because that person contributes more to the organization than they cost. If UPS management has determined that the work air drivers do can be done at lower cost while still following the rules of the contract, I can only respect the changes they would make.

Now if the contract is being violated, that is where we must keep the comapny accountable. That will rquire all of us to keep watch and have a clear understanding of the rules. Instead of getting angry or hurt, let us all be students of our contract, and work with our union representatives in filing grievances when we observe our contract being violated.

I hate to see anyone lose their jobs

but when I see stories like this one I cant help but wonder if this is not partially the end result of belonging to a local that prides itself on being antaganistic towards the company.
 

siredline09

Well-Known Member
Yup, that is pretty cold-hearted !

They didn't even have the decency to wait until after xmas, nevermind New Years, but gave them the news on xmas eve, that their service is no longer needed !
How do you think those 50 spent their xmas ?

Ever think of that ?

Plus, you need to count in the pride effect it has on people. Saying they are a driver for UPS (the largest shipping company), and they have pride in their job, and think they can make a career out of it.
Then everything just comes crashing down, as if scrooge came suddenly for a nasty visit, and brought the worst nightmare xmas, for those drivers.

Yea I was laid off Friday on that EVE so was my Air Coworkers which was most of the 50 Drivers that were laid off and over the phone was anger confusion and disrespect was coming from there voices on the day after christmas.
 

siredline09

Well-Known Member
Siredline010, thank you for contiuning to keep us updated, even as you continue to take what, I believe, are largely unfair beatings every time you post something on here.

As my user name suggests, I am an air driver and I work in the upper Midwest. Yesterday I got into a conversation with one of the on car sups who I have come to regard as an honest stright shooter. We met for something unrelated, but I just couldn't pass the opportunity to ask him about the future of Article 40 employees in our area and shared with him what I have come to know about the goings on in NY. He said the information was new to him and I believe he was sincere. Given what I have read here and what I was told yesterday, I have no idea what the future holds for me. I was once laid off as an air driver, and while it didn't happen on X-mas Eve, it did take place exactly on my 5th anniversary with the company, not only by date, but, even by day of the week. I had the impression the change was intended to be long term. For me, it came to pass that after 2 months I was back air driving again. This was back in 2005.

Having said what I just have, I absolutely cannot see my self taking personally a lay off and pay cut from the company. Even if it happens on Christmas Eve. And I would encourage those of you who believe the company treated you unjustly, to reconsider your feelings and possibly redirect your actions. I see employment, and especially employment under a union contract as a rule bound activity, sort of like a game of chess, or, better yet, as a sport like wrestling. If someone knocks you off your two feet and holds you to the ground - and it happens in a wrestling match two people agree to undertake, everything described (along with some minor bumps amd bruises) is part of the game. Very different from a situation where someone assaults you on the street. So long as you compete within the agreed upon rules, even if your opponent is a friend, you ought to do your best to "take him down." There is nothing dishonorable to being competitive, using your strengths, and exploiting your oponents weaknesses.

Back to UPS. We live in a capitalist system, and that is something for which I, at least, am thankful. The driving ideology behind American commerce is NOT "From each according to his ability, to each according to his need." Any organization ultimately keeps any particular individual on board in a particular role because that person contributes more to the organization than they cost. If UPS management has determined that the work air drivers do can be done at lower cost while still following the rules of the contract, I can only respect the changes they would make.

Now if the contract is being violated, that is where we must keep the comapny accountable. That will rquire all of us to keep watch and have a clear understanding of the rules. Instead of getting angry or hurt, let us all be students of our contract, and work with our union representatives in filing grievances when we observe our contract being violated.

No Problem Air_Dr, I hope you air guys where ever you are, are not touched by corporate. So far the air drivers in NYC are only working Saturdays because if we dont its basically saying i quit the company but hey at least we keep benefits but also there was talk about having us do preload at a pay of 16 an hour and POSSIBLY make air top rate all over again after 6 months, now i'm not sure if that is true or not but I hope at least they off full time positions but i think that is unlikely since there is a ton of guys in NYC even preloaders with Heavy seniority. alot of the Air drivers had over 15 years that got laid off, now also the air walkers here haven't been touched, so far hopefully they dont.
 

siredline09

Well-Known Member
Would you rather that they had never worked at all?
This happens all the time in software development ... Finish a project and on to something else.
My man you are definitely an idiot ! I hope they lay you off so you can say that again and think how dumb you were to say that!
 

UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)

Well-Known Member
My man you are definitely an idiot ! I hope they lay you off so you can say that again and think how dumb you were to say that!

The example given by Hoax, while accurate, does not apply to this thread. He is talking about employees working on a time-definite project who know that their employment ends when the project ends. Peak helpers also fit this description. You and 49 of your co-workers do not.
 

Catatonic

Nine Lives
My man you are definitely an idiot ! I hope they lay you off so you can say that again and think how dumb you were to say that!

I empathize with your situation and my response was to Klein and not to you. I can see where if you thought I was responding to you that my response would be very callous and it would have been. I thought klein was talking about a seasonal hire. Sorry to be confused about that and I hope things work out for you. Getting laid off of a permanent job is a tough situation to deal with ... again, my apology.
 
Last edited:

klein

Für Meno :)
I empathize with your situation and my response was to Klein and not to you. I can see where if you thought I was responding to you that my response would be very callous and it would have been. I thought klein was talking about a seasonal hire. Sorry to be confused about that and I hope things work out for you. Getting laid off of a permanent job is a tough situation to deal with ... again, my apology.

Dammit, blame the innocent again... blame Klein.
I stook up for siredline, and I knew he was fulltime permanent.

Obviosly, Hoax, you didn't know that, and thought he was just a seasonal.
Besides that, got trashed for not having any work ethic.

Oh well, all is ok. I'm used to it.
 

Catatonic

Nine Lives
Dammit, blame the innocent again... blame Klein.
I stook up for siredline, and I knew he was fulltime permanent.

Obviosly, Hoax, you didn't know that, and thought he was just a seasonal.
Besides that, got trashed for not having any work ethic.

Oh well, all is ok. I'm used to it.

Well, how about that, you're not always wrong! :wink2:
 

grgrcr88

No It's not green grocer!
How can you blame him, if he just got canned ? You think he's happy ?
And to hear what Hoax had to say ? (lucky that he had a job) ? - mistakenly I must add.

Absolutely 100% he should be upset and angry that he has been laid off. At the company, not at the poeple on this board, we had nothing to do with it and have no way to help him other than try to share our experiences and ideas. He came on here not wanting to hear anything from anyone aparently and name called and badmouthed people that could possibly give him some advise.
 

Catatonic

Nine Lives
Absolutely 100% he should be upset and angry that he has been laid off. At the company, not at the poeple on this board, we had nothing to do with it and have no way to help him other than try to share our experiences and ideas. He came on here not wanting to hear anything from anyone aparently and name called and badmouthed people that could possibly give him some advise.

Did you notice who you are responding to? :happy-very:
 
Top