No Raises

[trplnkl]

Why would you have that attitude given that jobs are on the line? You may not realize this but this is not a Non-Union vs Union issue. This is a survival issue and something that effects us all. Not just one or the other.
Now is the time to pull together and put all our energy into gaining market share and competitor business. No Packages, no work for a lot of us. Nothing the Union alone or Management alone can do about this!!! It makes a lo of sense to me that a little willingness to sacrifice now will go a long way towards weathering this storm...and it is a storm!

But you need to realize that the drivers and preloaders jobs are hinged on one thing......VOLUME, period. Regardless of a raise or not, concessions of benefits or not, if the work is there the union employees will still be working. Making concessions will not create volume, sorry it just won't do it.
I don't disagree that it is time to pull together and do what we can to develop gains in market share. However there are two approaches to accomplish that goal. One is, of course, getting new accounts. The other is through reverting to old philosophy of making SERVICE in a SAFE manner our priority. Business can get the accounts and the rest of us service the accounts. Sounds fair to me.

 

[nhguy]

Does anyone know if the 401k match will be made for February? I haven't recieved my letter yet and haven't been able to verify what month it actually will stop. Any info would be apprciated.


REMEMBER THE BIG FISH ALWAYS EATS THE LITTLE ONES

 

[brownIEman]

No its not misleading at all. As a union employee it is up to the union and the members to decide as in this case if they would take a wage freeze.

The union employees are still receiving this february's raise while the non union employees are taking a freeze and even losing their 401k match.

Now on to the employee stock payroll deduction, while management has to except it, we as union employees have a right to file a grievance on it because we nor did the teamsters agree to any concessions. And this is a concession on our part!

Red,
You will have to explain to me how accepting the change in the DESPP would be a concession? The DESPP is a benefit the company offered to encourage employees of all levels to gain an ownership stake in the business. It was not negotiated with the teamsters, nor is it in the contract in any form, as far as I know. It was basically a gift from the company, not something fought for by the IBT. Now the company has decided to change it.

How, exactly, would something Teamsters never asked for, negotiated for, nor fought for, nor was ever put in the contract, being altered, qualify as a concession?

 

[Eby1]

But you need to realize that the drivers and preloaders jobs are hinged on one thing......VOLUME, period. Regardless of a raise or not, concessions of benefits or not, if the work is there the union employees will still be working. Making concessions will not create volume, sorry it just won't do it.
I don't disagree that it is time to pull together and do what we can to develop gains in market share. However there are two approaches to accomplish that goal. One is, of course, getting new accounts. The other is through reverting to old philosophy of making SERVICE in a SAFE manner our priority. Business can get the accounts and the rest of us service the accounts. Sounds fair to me.

For the record, we are on the same page! More than one way to skin a cat right? Bottom line we DO need more volume while also cutting cost. Much success to you in TX!

 

[UPS_UK]

The same is happening over here in the UK. All salaries are being frozen with no pay rises to anyone.

No job losses as of yet though.....

 

[sweetpea]

We keep lopping of driver's routes. How many levels of mgmnt can the man on the street support. We don't need 3 fulltime supes and a center manager to handle 41 routes. The word in today's world is be happy you have a job. I sure am. BM

3 ft sups and a manager what a waste of money I guess no one sees this-it's like the police with the blue code of coduct and Dr's keep defending each others- management runs the show but dosen't see the waste

 

[tieguy]

Now that i have seen that ups still profited 5.4 billion last year, i would vote against giving up any of my benefits. This is no time to ask for concessions from the back bone of this company!

Just think how much money ups paid out in wrongful termination grievances, sups working, not paying an employee his/her guarantee, and the list goes on. I have seen that ups will be cutting back in a lot of areas, i sure hope violating the contract will be one of these areas!

You sound like you have a pretty smug attitude about whats going on in the world. Your raise in february could have a negative result on your brothers if management folks who ignored a lot of things your members did now decide they will make you earn that raise.
The labor picture you paint is not a one sided waste of money as you state. There are many cases taken on by the company that have merit. If management decided to show as little tolerence for mistakes as your local and your members have then there could be a lot more 705ers fighting for their jobs at the panel.

Stepping away from the us versus them bullschitt that should not have been brought into this thread I think we all have to realistically look at this economy and worry about where its headed. The fact obama and pelosi are running the country does not bode well. Obamas first effort at economic stimulus was a pork laden roll of fat that had no meat to it.Your unions in their one sided vision for the country supported Obama. They will now experience more layoffs with the hope the card bill allows them easier organizing of the few people in this country that will be left with jobs.

This bill is nothing more then a way to help the unions make the organizing vote public so that the union can then intimidate and harass those oppossed to organizing into submission.

For some reason your unions believe americans should be able to privately vote for their countries leaders but do not believe those being organized should have the same privledge.

Its always been about power and the needs of the union. The members have always been the bargaining chips that are used to feed the unions needs.

And thus america finds itself. The ship is leaking and Pelosi and Obama are turning on the faucet rather then fixing the leak.

You guys should hire management to your leadership group just so someone is there to tell you when its time to put down the bong.

 

[The-UK-Guy]

and pass it to the uk guy

 

[westsideworma]

Does anyone know if the 401k match will be made for February? I haven't recieved my letter yet and haven't been able to verify what month it actually will stop. Any info would be apprciated.


REMEMBER THE BIG FISH ALWAYS EATS THE LITTLE ONES

my letter says it stopped at the end of January

 

[The-UK-Guy]

You sound like you have a pretty smug attitude about whats going on in the world. Your raise in february could have a negative result on your brothers if management folks who ignored a lot of things your members did now decide they will make you earn that raise.
The labor picture you paint is not a one sided waste of money as you state. There are many cases taken on by the company that have merit. If management decided to show as little tolerence for mistakes as your local and your members have then there could be a lot more 705ers fighting for their jobs at the panel.

Stepping away from the us versus them bullschitt that should not have been brought into this thread I think we all have to realistically look at this economy and worry about where its headed. The fact obama and pelosi are running the country does not bode well. Obamas first effort at economic stimulus was a pork laden roll of fat that had no meat to it.Your unions in their one sided vision for the country supported Obama. They will now experience more layoffs with the hope the card bill allows them easier organizing of the few people in this country that will be left with jobs.

This bill is nothing more then a way to help the unions make the organizing vote public so that the union can then intimidate and harass those oppossed to organizing into submission.

For some reason your unions believe americans should be able to privately vote for their countries leaders but do not believe those being organized should have the same privledge.

Its always been about power and the needs of the union. The members have always been the bargaining chips that are used to feed the unions needs.

And thus america finds itself. The ship is leaking and Pelosi and Obama are turning on the faucet rather then fixing the leak.

You guys should hire management to your leadership group just so someone is there to tell you when its time to put down the bong.
__________________


I take it you didnt vote for OBAMA , hes just fixing the mess bush left, be patient

 

[tieguy]

I take it you didnt vote for OBAMA , hes just fixing the mess bush left, be patient

Not an issue of Obama putting a plan in and my needing to be patient while it kicked in. Different issue entirely.

Obama presented a poorly thought out plan that had little earmarked to help the economy. Pelosi and her minions then loaded it up with all kinds of pork.

Meanwhile we are watching the economy revert back to pre Reagan days and many people are watching them fumble the ball while they lose their jobs.

Obama has had a long time to plan this stimulus package. Yet he royally screwed the pooch.

Patience should be waiting for his plan to take fruit not waiting for him to find a plan.

 

[brownmonster]

We're all in this together. I, the driver will turn in sales leads, run more stops per car because of less pieces, start later because we won't pay preloaders, etc. You, the management will cut areas making it even harder to serve the customers we have left, install failed technology turning routes upside down, give warning letters for late air after moving start time by 1/2 an hour, follow drivers around for observations, move SSI stops into other routes without a clue if it can be delivered in the promised time frame, etc. Managements job should be to provide the tools for us to serve the people that pay all of our wages. THE CUSTOMER! We have a rare opportunity to gain volume from struggling competitors but it needs to be done in the name of service and flexibility not by chasing the unrealistic numbers of some IE goon. Maybe after spying on the driver pop into some of their accounts and ask the customer "What can we do to help your driver better serve your needs?" Look to help the person below you instead of trying to impress the ones above. BM

 

[trplnkl]

You sound like you have a pretty smug attitude about whats going on in the world. Your raise in february could have a negative result on your brothers if management folks who ignored a lot of things your members did now decide they will make you earn that raise.
The labor picture you paint is not a one sided waste of money as you state. There are many cases taken on by the company that have merit. If management decided to show as little tolerence for mistakes as your local and your members have then there could be a lot more 705ers fighting for their jobs at the panel.

Stepping away from the us versus them bullschitt that should not have been brought into this thread I think we all have to realistically look at this economy and worry about where its headed. The fact obama and pelosi are running the country does not bode well. Obamas first effort at economic stimulus was a pork laden roll of fat that had no meat to it.Your unions in their one sided vision for the country supported Obama. They will now experience more layoffs with the hope the card bill allows them easier organizing of the few people in this country that will be left with jobs.

This bill is nothing more then a way to help the unions make the organizing vote public so that the union can then intimidate and harass those oppossed to organizing into submission.

For some reason your unions believe americans should be able to privately vote for their countries leaders but do not believe those being organized should have the same privledge.

Its always been about power and the needs of the union. The members have always been the bargaining chips that are used to feed the unions needs.

And thus america finds itself. The ship is leaking and Pelosi and Obama are turning on the faucet rather then fixing the leak.

You guys should hire management to your leadership group just so someone is there to tell you when its time to put down the bong.

Overall, a pretty good post Tie. However I see the check card somewhat in a different light. The harm I see in the it is that the company being organized also know how is or is not supporting the union. This could bring about scrutiny and intimidation from the company's side as well.

I think you're pretty much on target about the Obama stimulus (gag) proposal. The first run through had only 5 % that would actually help the economy the rest was nothing but pork. The biggest shame is that O&P wanted everyone to bite like a hungry big mouth bass on cheap spinner. Once again the democrats think the American public is too stupid to see through their socialistic drive.

 

[IWorkAsDirected]

We're all in this together. I, the driver will turn in sales leads, run more stops per car because of less pieces, start later because we won't pay preloaders, etc. You, the management will cut areas making it even harder to serve the customers we have left, install failed technology turning routes upside down, give warning letters for late air after moving start time by 1/2 an hour, follow drivers around for observations, move SSI stops into other routes without a clue if it can be delivered in the promised time frame, etc. Managements job should be to provide the tools for us to serve the people that pay all of our wages. THE CUSTOMER! We have a rare opportunity to gain volume from struggling competitors but it needs to be done in the name of service and flexibility not by chasing the unrealistic numbers of some IE goon. Maybe after spying on the driver pop into some of their accounts and ask the customer "What can we do to help your driver better serve your needs?" Look to help the person below you instead of trying to impress the ones above. BM

This is the best and most true statemnt I have ever read about the state of UPS right now. It is so sad that the powers that be cannot see and understand what is happening to this company. If we don't have SERVICE we don't have anything that will keep us in business.

 

[705red]

Why would you have that attitude given that jobs are on the line? You may not realize this but this is not a Non-Union vs Union issue. This is a survival issue and something that effects us all. Not just one or the other.
Now is the time to pull together and put all our energy into gaining market share and competitor business. No Packages, no work for a lot of us. Nothing the Union alone or Management alone can do about this!!! It makes a lo of sense to me that a little willingness to sacrifice now will go a long way towards weathering this storm...and it is a storm!

You want to gain business! How? Every lead we take the time to turn in goes unsold! The drivers have done their best to gain the business, maybe get the bd reps out of the starbucks and on to the customers property!

 

[705red]

Red,
You will have to explain to me how accepting the change in the DESPP would be a concession? The DESPP is a benefit the company offered to encourage employees of all levels to gain an ownership stake in the business. It was not negotiated with the teamsters, nor is it in the contract in any form, as far as I know. It was basically a gift from the company, not something fought for by the IBT. Now the company has decided to change it.

How, exactly, would something Teamsters never asked for, negotiated for, nor fought for, nor was ever put in the contract, being altered, qualify as a concession?

Your right it is a benefit! And while its not covered in the contract it is a past practice since late 1996 early 1997. It was not a gift from the company, the company pffered it up thinking that if we the union employee owned stock in ups we would not strike.

Any one that leaves their money in the new stock plan is nuts! It would be cheaper to be it directly!

 

[kingOFchester]

Your right it is a benefit! And while its not covered in the contract it is a past practice since late 1996 early 1997. It was not a gift from the company, the company pffered it up thinking that if we the union employee owned stock in ups we would not strike.

Any one that leaves their money in the new stock plan is nuts! It would be cheaper to be it directly!

How would it be cheaper? If you are still getting it for 5% off it seems to me you are still saving 5%. what am I missing? If you now how to buy stock at a 5% discount...please fill me in on that trick! I do understand that you have to hold the stock for several years, but if one was planning on buying UPS stock for the long term, then buying at 5% is still a good deal. If you are planning to buy and sell over a short period of time then the 5% means nothing....but then again it wouldn't mean anything if it was 50% off and you wanted a quick sell.

 

[kingOFchester]

Slightly off topic........looks like the pork will be flowing with the kool aid. The porkulous bill has been reached. Sad sad sad day. RR is probably rolling in his grave.

 

[705red]

You sound like you have a pretty smug attitude about whats going on in the world. Your raise in february could have a negative result on your brothers if management folks who ignored a lot of things your members did now decide they will make you earn that raise.

Wow that is the typical management thug response we are used to from power tripping sups. I'm pissed you got your whole 35 cents so i will just ride your ass until you quit! Or i can fire you. You did forget the famous line, i only have to win one of your terminations to win while you have to win them all to stay employed!

The labor picture you paint is not a one sided waste of money as you state. There are many cases taken on by the company that have merit. If management decided to show as little tolerence for mistakes as your local and your members have then there could be a lot more 705ers fighting for their jobs at the panel.

Doubt it! See now we have a sitting arbitrator who gets the tie breaking vote in a union/ups deadlock. Its worked wonders already! Not one termination at January's panel!
I have grievances filed right now with penalty pay well over $2,000 a piece for simple 9.5 grievance that ups agreed to pay, but still have not! $75 grievances and the members will walk away with two grand? Now that's a waste!

Stepping away from the us versus them bullschitt that should not have been brought into this thread I think we all have to realistically look at this economy and worry about where its headed. The fact obama and pelosi are running the country does not bode well. Obamas first effort at economic stimulus was a pork laden roll of fat that had no meat to it.Your unions in their one sided vision for the country supported Obama. They will now experience more layoffs with the hope the card bill allows them easier organizing of the few people in this country that will be left with jobs.

Tie when the employee free ast passes, im coming by you and would love for you to sign a card from me personally! Deal?

This bill is nothing more then a way to help the unions make the organizing vote public so that the union can then intimidate and harass those oppossed to organizing into submission.

Its to stop the companies who have been intimidating employees not to join, under the act it speeds up the process and the companies will no longer have 90 days to fire, suspen, and terminate union supporters!

For some reason your unions believe americans should be able to privately vote for their countries leaders but do not believe those being organized should have the same privledge.

Its always been about power and the needs of the union. The members have always been the bargaining chips that are used to feed the unions needs.

And thus america finds itself. The ship is leaking and Pelosi and Obama are turning on the faucet rather then fixing the leak.

You guys should hire management to your leadership group just so someone is there to tell you when its time to put down the bong.

Wow tie i have missed you a lot! I might not leave my computer all weekend hoping we can just have one of our famous weekend clashes again! lol

By reading your last few paragraphs im getting a sense you are not pro union!

 

[705red]

How would it be cheaper? If you are still getting it for 5% off it seems to me you are still saving 5%. what am I missing? If you now how to buy stock at a 5% discount...please fill me in on that trick! I do understand that you have to hold the stock for several years, but if one was planning on buying UPS stock for the long term, then buying at 5% is still a good deal. If you are planning to buy and sell over a short period of time then the 5% means nothing....but then again it wouldn't mean anything if it was 50% off and you wanted a quick sell.

You are now going to get the stock at a 5% discount of the closing day of the quarters price. So say the stock closes at 60 that day, take your 5%, you have now purchased the stock at $57 a share. But three's week before the stock was at $52 a share. Typically a stock rises at the end of a quarter, not always but typically. Now who bought their stock cheaper?