PAS - how do we fix it.
- Thread starter tieguy
- Start date
Brownnblue
Well-Known Member
I'd be happy if I could just have that "final tuneup meeting" I was promised when PAS was implemented in our center; it has been nine months now.
tieguy
Banned
Hello Tie....Tie are you there? I feel just like I used to when we had TLAs, we talk but nobody listens.
Good dialogue going. I think we can all learn something just by listening.
satellitedriver
Moderator
Have preload memorize load charts and read both labels before placing pkgs in a car. Trust and listen to a driver when they tell you this is the wrong way to load their route (given that the driver really cares and isn't just throwing work at their fellow drivers). Micromanagement and one size fits all planning is a plan to fail. Give center managers the power to manage their center.Each and every one has problems that can only be dealt with on a local level. It is like giving everyone the same size stretch uniform and saying "Now make it fit". The worst part I see is the dumbing down of the system and taking the human brain out of the equation.
Your question was "How do we fix it?" That is the wrong question.
"Why did we implement a flawed system nationwide without proper planning and research?" PAS and EDD could be a great tool if properly used, but not as a dogmatic rule. I personally run my route in the most efficient way I can and ignore the trace. On any given day, I can defend my reasoning for running the route the way I did.
Given time the bugs will be worked out, but in the mean time do not treat drivers like they know less than they do.
Your question was "How do we fix it?" That is the wrong question.
"Why did we implement a flawed system nationwide without proper planning and research?" PAS and EDD could be a great tool if properly used, but not as a dogmatic rule. I personally run my route in the most efficient way I can and ignore the trace. On any given day, I can defend my reasoning for running the route the way I did.
Given time the bugs will be worked out, but in the mean time do not treat drivers like they know less than they do.
canon
Well-Known Member
I said it in another thread, but I'll say it again. UPS basically took decades of IE dept data, on-road supervisor observation, and driver experience and threw it out the window in favor of someone sitting at a desk looking at a map. (Usually with no on-road experience to boot.)
I just found out today they "worked" on my area. Now it's worse. Six miles into another drivers area for one stop. I questioned the sup relooping things, and it's being done to accomodate another driver whose route was screwed up when PAS first went into effect. My question was, and still is, why don't they get driver input BEFORE they reloop something?
They've eliminated stop density in some areas to follow "baseline" mapping. All that did for me on my last route was put me in 4 zipcodes instead of one. There were literally subdivisions that were shared by 3 and 4 drivers, each doing maybe 10-15 stops.
Splits are pulled random... you don't know what stops you'll have from day to day. No biggie to me, but the customers hate it. They used to know when "their" driver was going to show up. As a customer who periodically ships expensive camera equipment requiring a signature, I can no longer use UPS simply because it's too difficult for my wife to plan to be here. Don't worry, Brown is still my carrier of choice when I'm not looking for convenience.
I told myself all the way home I wan't going to discuss PAS anymore after I found out they threw another wrench in my spokes, then here's a request to for input. If I really thought it might be taken seriously, I would say the best thing you could do is to talk to the drivers. We both know that isn't going to happen, so I'm going to take your advice Tie and make the best of it. No more "begging" UPS to fix things in an effort to save the company money (or as you call it, whining). I've asked for the same things for almost 2 years, and been told over and over, "Yes we know, we're going to fix it. Just do the best you can today."
Now they made it worse. I'm done with it. Period. I just flat don't care anymore, and before anyone passes judgement on me understand I've fought toe to toe with management. I've asked nicely. I spent 2 hours off the clock hand drawing 5 pages of maps with number breaks, street order with pickups, and notes to assist efficient looping... not once but twice. Both times the papers were just thrown away. I ripped the dispatcher a new one right in front of a center manager and district manager (was hoping the timing would help) and still nothing... even tho the district manager agreed that I was right. He actually came to my truck to see what I was talking about. (You can get away with a lot when you're right... I don't cuss so that helps too.) At the center manager's request, I call in every time something is wrong... but it never gets fixed on a permanent basis.
I get the message UPS, you just don't care. It's all about self-preservation in the land of discipline for our bosses... as long as nobody is getting in trouble then nothing is wrong. Even if it means costing UPS money. (Like what? I'm glad you asked... how about when a driver might under dispatch, a driver sup will have them run bogus pickups to add miles or stops. "Sweep the drop boxes or UPS store instead of just getting off the clock? Sure boss, as long as you don't get in trouble that's what counts." Never mind that the regular driver will still have to make the normally scheduled pickup too. I don't blame them because corporate will chew their butt for a driver being under dispatched, even tho it may be the result of low pickup volume or a few less miles than normal. How about this UPS: Reward people for making smart business decisions instead of waiting for someone to trip so you can run up and kick them? Gee what a novel idea.)
Just today I found out UPS will be forking out $600 to pay a claim on lost packages that were misaddressed by PAS. I told management about it months ago, in one ear and out the other. I've told them over and over the same things... and even warned them that i'm going to stop saying a word about anything that is broke with PAS. We've crossed that line today and that's how it's going to be from now on Mr Tie: Everything is just freakin' peachy Boss.
How do we fix it... that's rich. Try listening. Sorry for my foul mood, it's just not funny anymore. After 100 years, UPS can't load my truck and thinks it takes an hour and a half less to deliver than it really does when I'm using the methods they insist I use.
How do we fix it... like you care. I'm right there with you now.
rushfan
Well-Known Member
Cannon:
I thought I was the only one to draw on a map that was 5 pages. I did it twice, and each time it was "lost". When the request is made again, I won't do it. I'll run my route how I think it should be ran one day, and tell them to print out my delivery records. That will show them how to input it in the PAS system. The only thing that is saving my attitude, is we have a new management team. Only time will tell.
I wonder if Mike is going to fix the problems at each center as he makes his UPS 100 year tour of the nation. I'd gladly have him ride along with me, and show him how "efficient" our no left turn delivery plan is going.
I thought I was the only one to draw on a map that was 5 pages. I did it twice, and each time it was "lost". When the request is made again, I won't do it. I'll run my route how I think it should be ran one day, and tell them to print out my delivery records. That will show them how to input it in the PAS system. The only thing that is saving my attitude, is we have a new management team. Only time will tell.
I wonder if Mike is going to fix the problems at each center as he makes his UPS 100 year tour of the nation. I'd gladly have him ride along with me, and show him how "efficient" our no left turn delivery plan is going.
Last edited:
tieguy
Banned
Let me try saying this a different way since I can see you're really frustrated with the day you had. You put too much importance behind my being on this site. It really is irrelevant for me to say I care or don't care because I can't fix anything in your building.
But I can keep my ears open for when I pick up a package center in the future
A lot of good information here. A couple of drivers who took some initiative and fixed their loops. A lot of positive responses where people have some good fixes to fine tune the system. It does appear it works better in some buildings then others.
I can't tell you how to remove yourself from the frustration. Clearly giving up and saying you don't care won't help your own personal sense of pride. But you do have to try to find a way to keep your head about you. If your present management team is gufunked then wait for the next crew that rolls in and try them to see if they have the sense to listen.
trickpony1
Well-Known Member
canon-
I can tell you how to remove yourself from the frustration. Follow this sequence:
love-> hate-> indifference.
"Love" is the positive feelings and energies you felt and exerted when you were first hired. You thought you died and went to heaven.
"Hate" is the negative feelings and energies you felt and exerted when you hit the brick wall of trying to deal with these people.
"Indifference" is the lack of feelings and energies you feel or exert. Indifference doesn't stress a person nearly as bad as the other two emotions. It appears you are in the "hate" stage of the sequence.......how's it working for ya? The sooner you work through to the indifference stage of the sequence the better off you will be. You also may not die early from stress related heart disease.
Personal sense of pride? Any one who gauges their self-worth on how well they did their job that day is setting themselves up for disappointment because, as we know, more and more will be expected, once again leading to the frustration you are currently experiencing. The company loves it when drivers walk out in the evening physically exhausted as well as emotionally torn up inside. How's that working for ya?
I can tell you how to remove yourself from the frustration. Follow this sequence:
love-> hate-> indifference.
"Love" is the positive feelings and energies you felt and exerted when you were first hired. You thought you died and went to heaven.
"Hate" is the negative feelings and energies you felt and exerted when you hit the brick wall of trying to deal with these people.
"Indifference" is the lack of feelings and energies you feel or exert. Indifference doesn't stress a person nearly as bad as the other two emotions. It appears you are in the "hate" stage of the sequence.......how's it working for ya? The sooner you work through to the indifference stage of the sequence the better off you will be. You also may not die early from stress related heart disease.
Personal sense of pride? Any one who gauges their self-worth on how well they did their job that day is setting themselves up for disappointment because, as we know, more and more will be expected, once again leading to the frustration you are currently experiencing. The company loves it when drivers walk out in the evening physically exhausted as well as emotionally torn up inside. How's that working for ya?
Brown and Out
Member
Great post Canon. The sooner you see they don't care anymore, the better off you'll be. Reading your post tells me you've got some smarts. Don't you get it.... that's it!! They don't want you to care. Quit beating yourself up. Just like everything else, there's more to all this than we'll ever know.
canon
Well-Known Member
lol, thanks for the laugh... i needed that before work today.
It's not that I value your presence here, but your own sense of indiffernce reflects the very same core response I get from my management team. When you get your center, sit them down and tell them about your experience driving when they kept changing the preloader. Tell them you know it's broke, but to get over it and make the best of it like you do here. Then tell them to stop whining and sober up.
lol
The current pacakages per hour and flow PROHIBIT preloaders from reading EVERY label to cross check...
PAS was to speed up things... Four maybe five years ago peak at our center would be volume about 1600% and prelaod would come in at 3:00AM... TODAY we had 2100% and our start time was 4:20... So five additional feeders and a hour twenty less time... Also back then we had 2.5 package cars per preloader... Now its three to four package cars and maybe a trailer thrown in for fun...
(peak this year was 2800%)
What? These are done by the on road sup most of the time around 7:00am and tend to be the same stops EVERY DAY... Some preloaders will not load some addresses and stack under the belt just waiting for the add cut... When the add cut does not show up at 7:00 then they know it will be in the next batch around 8:00... This happens like clock work...
Week before Christmas I refused to load ANY 8000 section and stashed it under the belt they all had the "A" and then around 7:30 the add/cut pulled from another car would come down for the 8000 section and that was also stacked under the belt. Finally around 8:30 I bulked out the package car and left all the 8000s under the belt... There was NO ROOM... Finally after a week they stopped sending the add cut...
Now other package cars have shelves that NEVER in the last three years have packages for "that section..." Every day I know I will not get any 3000 pacakges and I know the 7000 will take up the entire shelf... Rear Door Rights will go in the Rear Door Left because I need a walk way and there are never any RDR or RDLs... I know to place 5000 and 6000 bulk in the FL3 and RDR...
If I get work pulled off it does not throw anything off as it means I can stack RDCs or RDRs on that shelf.... It means I will have a walkway through the package car...
After three years it is scary what a preloader know and what they refuse to put in the system...
1
tieguy
Banned
You keep trying to call it indifference . I think its bringing a positive attitude with you.
Delivered
Well-Known Member
That's funny my mgt team says that it doesn't have any flaws. Step 1 Admit there is a problem.
oldster
Member
Of course DPS has flaws. There are the enigmatic "flips". The RDO (Route delivery order - where the DPS sup can fine tune shelves, bulk and accomodate special needs like SSI) does not save when you create a new plan.
I am not an expert on the DPS system. I am, however, very experienced in loop principles and controlled dispatch. The DPS system is very powerful set of tools that automates most of the dispatch planning.
It can be good or bad depending on the initial quality of the implementation and the ability of the DPS sup to keep it updated. If a center team tries to cut corners during the planning phase and does not use driver input, they will pay the price for long time. Usually at some point the really messed up loops get the driver input, weeks or months later and finally start to worked out.
The On-Road team should never make add/cut decisions at 7:00 - 8:00 AM. If the routes are that far off, the wrong plan was probably used. Every route should have pre-planned add/cut ranges in the 10-15 stop range. If possible they should be PM (residential) and minimum number of packages.
A good DPS sup will make the first add/cut decisions before the preload starts based on their experience looking at the forcast stops. Every effort should be made to avoid moving work late in the sort.
I rode with a driver who had an incredible trace. He looped his own area and not only had almost no left hand turns, but 75-85% of his residential deliveries were delivered on the right- hand side of the street.
DPS is a very powerful set of tools, but they don't replace common sense and area knowlege. My own opinion is that the DPS sup should be the most knowlegable, experienced Sup in the center. He should be they person that is being groomed to be a center manager in the next 1-2 years.
I am not an expert on the DPS system. I am, however, very experienced in loop principles and controlled dispatch. The DPS system is very powerful set of tools that automates most of the dispatch planning.
It can be good or bad depending on the initial quality of the implementation and the ability of the DPS sup to keep it updated. If a center team tries to cut corners during the planning phase and does not use driver input, they will pay the price for long time. Usually at some point the really messed up loops get the driver input, weeks or months later and finally start to worked out.
The On-Road team should never make add/cut decisions at 7:00 - 8:00 AM. If the routes are that far off, the wrong plan was probably used. Every route should have pre-planned add/cut ranges in the 10-15 stop range. If possible they should be PM (residential) and minimum number of packages.
A good DPS sup will make the first add/cut decisions before the preload starts based on their experience looking at the forcast stops. Every effort should be made to avoid moving work late in the sort.
I rode with a driver who had an incredible trace. He looped his own area and not only had almost no left hand turns, but 75-85% of his residential deliveries were delivered on the right- hand side of the street.
DPS is a very powerful set of tools, but they don't replace common sense and area knowlege. My own opinion is that the DPS sup should be the most knowlegable, experienced Sup in the center. He should be they person that is being groomed to be a center manager in the next 1-2 years.
Delivered
Well-Known Member
We Hold Frequent Evaluations With Our Employees
About Their Performance. Reviews of each person's
performance enable us to arrive at a mutual understanding
about progress toward meeting goals and objectives.
We hold formal evaluations periodically. However, there
is no substitute for daily and weekly feedback on each
person's performance.
We follow up on the results of all evaluations to ensure the
continued development of our people.
We Have Meaningful Discussions With Our People.
Cooperation and teamwork among all our people are
necessary for the continued success of our business. To
foster this spirit, we seek to develop meaningful businesslike
relationships and better communications by having regular
and frequent planned individual and group discussions.
I wonder where this came from??? The UPS policy handbook??? Funny no one seems to follow it anymore
About Their Performance. Reviews of each person's
performance enable us to arrive at a mutual understanding
about progress toward meeting goals and objectives.
We hold formal evaluations periodically. However, there
is no substitute for daily and weekly feedback on each
person's performance.
We follow up on the results of all evaluations to ensure the
continued development of our people.
We Have Meaningful Discussions With Our People.
Cooperation and teamwork among all our people are
necessary for the continued success of our business. To
foster this spirit, we seek to develop meaningful businesslike
relationships and better communications by having regular
and frequent planned individual and group discussions.
I wonder where this came from??? The UPS policy handbook??? Funny no one seems to follow it anymore
brown bomber
brown bomber
hey friends...perhaps the best thing to do would be to get the routes re-time studied, by somebody who understands UPS...my route was last time studied 4 yrs. ago..112 stops...was 9.2 hrs
yesterday 135 stops was 8.5 hrs...I give up
yet we still have drivers running 2.5 to 3.5 hrs. early..HOW ??
I guess I'll just try for the DAILY DOUBLE..under 8 & an hour late
yesterday 135 stops was 8.5 hrs...I give up
yet we still have drivers running 2.5 to 3.5 hrs. early..HOW ??
I guess I'll just try for the DAILY DOUBLE..under 8 & an hour late
canon
Well-Known Member
Once again, you're mistaken. What you see is the remnants of a positive attitude. I fall for it every time. UPS holds that football for me and I think this time it's going to be different. How stupid of me.
But I always try to have a positive attitude... just not when it comes to PAS issues.
oldster
Member
If your building has implemented PAS, you need new time studies. When the implementation team re-draws the loops, they mathmatically re-apportion the allowances. There is really no other way to do it. But those allowances are considered temporary. New time studies will create new unit averages for the allowances. Theoretically, some drivers will gain planned time and some will lose time. But if your studies are already many years old, its hard to predict what might happen. Increasing stop density tends to decrease allowances, but increased traffic congestion tends to increase them. New construction (malls, office complexes, condos, apartment buildings) can have a large impact on allowances.
There is a corporate plan that started in 2005 to have all centers restudied within the next five years. I estimate this will cost more than 45 million.
I know I might take some flak, but well trained people updating the unit allowances will go a long way toward getting a center back in balance. The time studies really do work when done right.
There is a corporate plan that started in 2005 to have all centers restudied within the next five years. I estimate this will cost more than 45 million.
I know I might take some flak, but well trained people updating the unit allowances will go a long way toward getting a center back in balance. The time studies really do work when done right.
