Central States Pension Reduction Plan Letter announces Cuts - October 2015

[gonein2011]

About the same ... just delayed the inevitability of it.
Carey did however increase the chances of UPS turning their it's back to it's Teamster employees.

As a driver, I doubt you try to pet a dog that has bitten you in the past.

Or do you mean because of the 1997 strike?

 

[Catatonic]

Or do you mean because of the 1997 strike?

That's what I was referring to but I am open to expansion of what I meant.
Some of my best observations are after the posting.

 

[gonein2011]

What happens when we turn 65? The way I understood the language is that UPS only promised to pay any pension shortages until then, after that we would be stuck with the Central States reductions. I am talking about those who retired after 2008.

No, until you turn 65 UPS is footing the whole bill anyway. After 65 is when CS starts kicking in their share. If there are cuts (which we are sure there will be now) UPS will make up the difference. Only for employees that retired after Jan. 1, 2008.

 

[gonein2011]

http://www.ibtupspensionfund.ups.com/IBT_QA.htm

Hope this helps.

 

[gonein2011]

That's what I was referring to but I am open to expansion of what I meant.
Some of my best observations are after the posting.

Me too , me too.

 

[gonein2011]

Here's another question, I'm 59 years old, been retired since 2011 in the UPS/IBT fund. I had many more years in CSPF. The word is my pension will be cut 40%. As of now UPS is paying it all anyway and will until I turn 65. Will UPS have to make up the 40% now or when I turn 65?

 

[Mugarolla]

Here's another question, I'm 59 years old, been retired since 2011 in the UPS/IBT fund. I had many more years in CSPF. The word is my pension will be cut 40%. As of now UPS is paying it all anyway and will until I turn 65. Will UPS have to make up the 40% now or when I turn 65?

There is no 40% to make up until you start collecting your portion, reduced by 40%, when you turn 65.

CSPF is saying that your pension will be reduced by 40%, at least their portion, when you turn 65.

Far different than anyone who retired before 2008. Their whole pension is under CSPF and will be reduced upon final ruling.

 

[Bubblehead]

Um...

Ask Dave or Sam, about the pittance you receive.

See what I mean???
http://www.tdu.org/corruption_report_slams_ohio_conference

 

[Dracula]

The market goes down....I lose money.

The market goes up......I make money.

You never heard of this?

Yeah, I seem to have heard this somewhere before.

But you're missing the point altogether.

If you have $100,000 the day before the 2008 crash, and the next day, you lose half of that value, you have $50,000. Even if you don't plan on using that money for decades, that $50,000 you lost is gone forever. Sure, in the following years you might make it up, but you will NEVER see the lost $50,000 again. That money will never again gain any interest for your retirement accounts. The potential compounding interest that $50,000 would have gained, on top of the $50,000 you still have, is gone forever. You lost that $50,000 and all of the money it will have ever earned.

The same concept applies if you lose half of your 401k in a divorce. You might make that loss up, but that half is gone forever, never to be seen again.

Now, you can chalk it up to "the market", and that's fine, as far as it goes. But let's not pretend our stock market system is a level playing field for all participants, or that it follows the "free market rules". It doesn't. It is a rigged game for huge players, and Main Street players are just vying for the leftover scraps. If the free market were run on neutral laws and rules, there would have been no bailouts. All of the banks that took ridiculous risks would have died a natural, deserved death. Wall Street banks play with house money, and you and I play with our savings. When Wall Street loses, their losses are socialized, and every taxpayer is on the hook. When you and I lose, we work until we die, if we're still lucky enough to have a job.

That's why a company or union pension is a good way to retire for working people. But when Wall Street has all of the money, they control the government and make all of the rules. So they can rig the system where it's okay to under fund pensions and have the big ratings companies, like Moody's and S&P can tell big pensions that Mortgage Securities are AAA rated and safe investments for them, as required by law. Even when they know those securities are built on a house of cards.

Wow, big surprise, then, in 2008, those securities came crumbling down, dragging pensions funds of all types and stripes down to the crapper. Well, at least the banks that made those securities and the credit agencies that stamped them AAA were prosecuted to the fullest extent of...oh wait, we're still waiting on that one. And one of great ironies of the housing crash, was Moody's, downgrading states and cities all across the country, because their finances were falling apart, in large part because of their AAA rated investments were taking a big dump.

 

[Dracula]

See what I mean???
http://www.tdu.org/corruption_report_slams_ohio_conference

Well, like Upstate says, a lot of networking happens on golf courses, in Las Vegas, at union paid parties, in extra per diem payments, and probably in line at the bank, when they are cashing union checks.

But hey, it's only a pittance of the money our pension doesn't have, so let's give these poor guys a break.

 

[realbrown1]

Yeah, I seem to have heard this somewhere before.

But you're missing the point altogether.

If you have $100,000 the day before the 2008 crash, and the next day, you lose half of that value, you have $50,000. Even if you don't plan on using that money for decades, that $50,000 you lost is gone forever. Sure, in the following years you might make it up, but you will NEVER see the lost $50,000 again. That money will never again gain any interest for your retirement accounts. The potential compounding interest that $50,000 would have gained, on top of the $50,000 you still have, is gone forever. You lost that $50,000 and all of the money it will have ever earned.

The same concept applies if you lose half of your 401k in a divorce. You might make that loss up, but that half is gone forever, never to be seen again.

Now, you can chalk it up to "the market", and that's fine, as far as it goes. But let's not pretend our stock market system is a level playing field for all participants, or that it follows the "free market rules". It doesn't. It is a rigged game for huge players, and Main Street players are just vying for the leftover scraps. If the free market were run on neutral laws and rules, there would have been no bailouts. All of the banks that took ridiculous risks would have died a natural, deserved death. Wall Street banks play with house money, and you and I play with our savings. When Wall Street loses, their losses are socialized, and every taxpayer is on the hook. When you and I lose, we work until we die, if we're still lucky enough to have a job.

That's why a company or union pension is a good way to retire for working people. But when Wall Street has all of the money, they control the government and make all of the rules. So they can rig the system where it's okay to under fund pensions and have the big ratings companies, like Moody's and S&P can tell big pensions that Mortgage Securities are AAA rated and safe investments for them, as required by law. Even when they know those securities are built on a house of cards.

Wow, big surprise, then, in 2008, those securities came crumbling down, dragging pensions funds of all types and stripes down to the crapper. Well, at least the banks that made those securities and the credit agencies that stamped them AAA were prosecuted to the fullest extent of...oh wait, we're still waiting on that one. And one of great ironies of the housing crash, was Moody's, downgrading states and cities all across the country, because their finances were falling apart, in large part because of their AAA rated investments were taking a big dump.

Do you understand math?

I own 100 shares of stock a $5 per share for $500.

Market crashes, loses half of it's value to $250.

3 years later the stock is at $6 per share.

I made up my loses and earned $100.

Simple math.

 

[Catatonic]

Yeah, I seem to have heard this somewhere before.

But you're missing the point altogether.

If you have $100,000 the day before the 2008 crash, and the next day, you lose half of that value, you have $50,000. Even if you don't plan on using that money for decades, that $50,000 you lost is gone forever. Sure, in the following years you might make it up, but you will NEVER see the lost $50,000 again. That money will never again gain any interest for your retirement accounts. The potential compounding interest that $50,000 would have gained, on top of the $50,000 you still have, is gone forever. You lost that $50,000 and all of the money it will have ever earned.

The same concept applies if you lose half of your 401k in a divorce. You might make that loss up, but that half is gone forever, never to be seen again.

Now, you can chalk it up to "the market", and that's fine, as far as it goes. But let's not pretend our stock market system is a level playing field for all participants, or that it follows the "free market rules". It doesn't. It is a rigged game for huge players, and Main Street players are just vying for the leftover scraps. If the free market were run on neutral laws and rules, there would have been no bailouts. All of the banks that took ridiculous risks would have died a natural, deserved death. Wall Street banks play with house money, and you and I play with our savings. When Wall Street loses, their losses are socialized, and every taxpayer is on the hook. When you and I lose, we work until we die, if we're still lucky enough to have a job.

That's why a company or union pension is a good way to retire for working people. But when Wall Street has all of the money, they control the government and make all of the rules. So they can rig the system where it's okay to under fund pensions and have the big ratings companies, like Moody's and S&P can tell big pensions that Mortgage Securities are AAA rated and safe investments for them, as required by law. Even when they know those securities are built on a house of cards.

Wow, big surprise, then, in 2008, those securities came crumbling down, dragging pensions funds of all types and stripes down to the crapper. Well, at least the banks that made those securities and the credit agencies that stamped them AAA were prosecuted to the fullest extent of...oh wait, we're still waiting on that one. And one of great ironies of the housing crash, was Moody's, downgrading states and cities all across the country, because their finances were falling apart, in large part because of their AAA rated investments were taking a big dump.

Nice thesis!

 

[Ms.PacMan]

Do you understand math?

I own 100 shares of stock a $5 per share for $500.

Market crashes, loses half of it's value to $250.

3 years later the stock is at $6 per share.

I made up my loses and earned $100.

Simple math.

Exactly, because you still own every share at whatever price.

 

[realbrown1]

Exactly, because you still own every share at whatever price.

See, you get it.

Why do others say we can NEVER make that money back?

 

[gonein2011]

Yeah, I seem to have heard this somewhere before.

But you're missing the point altogether.

If you have $100,000 the day before the 2008 crash, and the next day, you lose half of that value, you have $50,000. Even if you don't plan on using that money for decades, that $50,000 you lost is gone forever. Sure, in the following years you might make it up, but you will NEVER see the lost $50,000 again. That money will never again gain any interest for your retirement accounts. The potential compounding interest that $50,000 would have gained, on top of the $50,000 you still have, is gone forever. You lost that $50,000 and all of the money it will have ever earned.

The same concept applies if you lose half of your 401k in a divorce. You might make that loss up, but that half is gone forever, never to be seen again.

Now, you can chalk it up to "the market", and that's fine, as far as it goes. But let's not pretend our stock market system is a level playing field for all participants, or that it follows the "free market rules". It doesn't. It is a rigged game for huge players, and Main Street players are just vying for the leftover scraps. If the free market were run on neutral laws and rules, there would have been no bailouts. All of the banks that took ridiculous risks would have died a natural, deserved death. Wall Street banks play with house money, and you and I play with our savings. When Wall Street loses, their losses are socialized, and every taxpayer is on the hook. When you and I lose, we work until we die, if we're still lucky enough to have a job.

That's why a company or union pension is a good way to retire for working people. But when Wall Street has all of the money, they control the government and make all of the rules. So they can rig the system where it's okay to under fund pensions and have the big ratings companies, like Moody's and S&P can tell big pensions that Mortgage Securities are AAA rated and safe investments for them, as required by law. Even when they know those securities are built on a house of cards.

Wow, big surprise, then, in 2008, those securities came crumbling down, dragging pensions funds of all types and stripes down to the crapper. Well, at least the banks that made those securities and the credit agencies that stamped them AAA were prosecuted to the fullest extent of...oh wait, we're still waiting on that one. And one of great ironies of the housing crash, was Moody's, downgrading states and cities all across the country, because their finances were falling apart, in large part because of their AAA rated investments were taking a big dump.

Buy low, sell high.

 

[realbrown1]

See what I mean???
http://www.tdu.org/corruption_report_slams_ohio_conference

More corupt teamster officials.

Maybe it's time to dump all the EXPERIENCED officers into retirement.

Hope they are all in the CENTRAL STATES PENSION FUND.

 

[CoolArrow]

Do you understand math?

I own 100 shares of stock a $5 per share for $500.

Market crashes, loses half of it's value to $250.

3 years later the stock is at $6 per share.

I made up my loses and earned $100.

Simple math.

You only lose money if you cash out when the value is down but most of the time after a crash stocks will regain their true value fairly quickly so the loss was only on paper.

 

[Catatonic]

Ran across this in a Google search containing "Teamster".
It is a summary of the Omnibus 2014 Pension cutback:

http://www.pensionrights.org/issues...QhJTz_Gv2TePL4Biuozjg-1rXOGm_4gb0IaAoTg8P8HAQ

 

[5habits100]

I'd miss my wife and kids and raise you two dogs and three cats and my own toilets.

Nice glasses and fitbit

 

[Lead Belly]

Nice glasses and fitbit

Those aren't my sunglasses those are the dogs. The Fitbit don't work to good.