Reply to thread

Message

<blockquote data-quote="BrownFlush" data-source="post: 5936367" data-attributes="member: 65823">You list yet another Roman passage where Paul contrasts justification by grace against justification by works. As has been shown, you make the Calvin conclusion there are no conditional works which we must perform in order to be justified. Many passages that teach the necessity of man&#039;s obedience. Among these are Matt. 7:21, Heb. 5:9, 2 Thess. 1:7-9, James 2:24, and Acts 2:38.Jesus clearly teaches that obtaining everlasting life involves human labor (John 6:27-29). In this very Roman letter which so strongly emphasizes justification by grace (not alone), Paul shows the importance of obedience when he observes that the very purpose of gospel preaching was to produce obedience (Rom. 1:5; 16:25-26).You and Calvin think if human work is involved in obtaining salvation, how can the salvation be of grace? The answer is that the works we perform do not earn the salvation which we receive. The very opportunity to obey God is a gift of grace. God requires that we meet certain conditions, but when we have met those conditions we still do not deserve to stand justified before God. Even after meeting His conditions for forgiveness, we still deserve to be punished rather than forgiven; yet, by His grace He forgives us so that we are just in His sight.You think if we have to meet conditions to receive our salvation, then our salvation is not a gift of grace. Not true.You just got a call the you won a brand new jeep. Come on down to the show room and get it!What conditions did you have to meet in order to get your free jeep?Get up, find your car keys, go to the garage, start your car, drive to the showroom, get out, etc.Was the jeep still free?</blockquote>

[QUOTE="BrownFlush, post: 5936367, member: 65823"] You list yet another Roman passage where Paul contrasts justification by grace against justification by works. As has been shown, you make the Calvin conclusion there are no conditional works which we must perform in order to be justified. Many passages that teach the necessity of man's obedience. Among these are Matt. 7:21, Heb. 5:9, 2 Thess. 1:7-9, James 2:24, and Acts 2:38. Jesus clearly teaches that obtaining everlasting life involves human labor (John 6:27-29). In this very Roman letter which so strongly emphasizes justification by grace (not alone), Paul shows the importance of obedience when he observes that the very purpose of gospel preaching was to produce obedience (Rom. 1:5; 16:25-26). You and Calvin think if human work is involved in obtaining salvation, how can the salvation be of grace? The answer is that the works we perform do not earn the salvation which we receive. The very opportunity to obey God is a gift of grace. God requires that we meet certain conditions, but when we have met those conditions we still do not deserve to stand justified before God. Even after meeting His conditions for forgiveness, we still deserve to be punished rather than forgiven; yet, by His grace He forgives us so that we are just in His sight. You think if we have to meet conditions to receive our salvation, then our salvation is not a gift of grace. Not true. You just got a call the you won a brand new jeep. Come on down to the show room and get it! What conditions did you have to meet in order to get your free jeep? Get up, find your car keys, go to the garage, start your car, drive to the showroom, get out, etc. Was the jeep still free? [/QUOTE]

Verification