Does seniority determine who gets to work more hours?

[Square]

Just to update everyone on what happened tonight. My PT supervisor told me to go home after about 4 hours of work. I said I wanted to stay and that there were 3 loaders still working who had less seniority than me. He repeated his line “It’s not about seniority, it’s about performance.” Right as he said that the sort manager was walking by so he decided to ask him. The sort manager told him that seniority is more important. I told the sort manager thank you and walked away. I ended up getting about another hour worth of work. But the satisfaction of proving my PT sup wrong and seeing the look on his face was worth so much more. Thanks again guys.

You bring up a good point. Is it possible there is a misunderstanding here? The OP stated his sup told him he could not bump because it is based on performance, not seniority. Everyone here knows that is simply a silly statement, neither the union nor the contract they agree to cares a wit for performance. But what if the sup is misguided and is actually thinking of skill? If the OP is wanting to bump say a preloader or a clerk, but they are not qualified to do those jobs, they would not be able to bump.

I was trying to bump a loader who worked in my area but had less seniority than me. I was a loader for 5 years before I moved up to HVD pickoff. So it’s not like I don’t know how to load a trailer.

 

[steward71]

Just to update everyone on what happened tonight. My PT supervisor told me to go home after about 4 hours of work. I said I wanted to stay and that there were 3 loaders still working who had less seniority than me. He repeated his line “It’s not about seniority, it’s about performance.” Right as he said that the sort manager was walking by so he decided to ask him. The sort manager told him that seniority is more important. I told the sort manager thank you and walked away. I ended up getting about another hour worth of work. But the satisfaction of proving my PT sup wrong and seeing the look on his face was worth so much more. Thanks again guys.


I was trying to bump a loader who worked in my area but had less seniority than me. I was a loader for 5 years before I moved up to HVD pickoff. So it’s not like I don’t know how to load a trailer.

Your seniority does matter. The other shop steward who posted you do don't have a case is dead wrong. As LONG
AS THE JR. PERSON IS GETTING THE 3.5 AND ANTTHING AFTER IS FIAR GAME. I did call the IBT to make sure I was correct in telling you this and they did state I was correct. AS long as they are getting the 3.5 then you can bump and if you wanted to anohter job in the building that you can do you can bump that person as if the work is available.

 

[UnconTROLLed]

I don't think you would have a winning case, but you never know until you try. This would be akin to a driver filing a grievance for a lower seniority driver staying later than themselves. You are only contractually guaranteed 3.5 hours. It would not likely be considered extra work so seniority would probably not apply.

I understand what you are saying. A seniority driver back in the building at 8 hours cannot say "well i"m going back out to take work off ___ because he has less seniority"

I think the point is that we are talking about OT in the same work area. OT goes by seniority in this area...you can grieve and win when someone with less seniority gets overtime and no work was offered to high seniority people, within the immediate work area.

 

[UnconTROLLed]

You bring up a good point. Is it possible there is a misunderstanding here? The OP stated his sup told him he could not bump because it is based on performance, not seniority. Everyone here knows that is simply a silly statement, neither the union nor the contract they agree to cares a wit for performance. But what if the sup is misguided and is actually thinking of skill? If the OP is wanting to bump say a preloader or a clerk, but they are not qualified to do those jobs, they would not be able to bump.

Exactly.

 

[dqs95124]

seniorty rules. when I did preload b/friend I drove. The same thing happend. But if you push to far they will send you to unload. Work as Directed.. but if you push it w/the steward.. he will say. fine put all the loaders up for bid based on senority.. so you load your rts. and clean up..the belt based on seniorty rules and it's bread and butter after 5 hrs.. I fought it 12yrs ago on won. I was the last to punch out.

 

[UnconTROLLed]

Just to update everyone on what happened tonight. My PT supervisor told me to go home after about 4 hours of work. I said I wanted to stay and that there were 3 loaders still working who had less seniority than me. He repeated his line “It’s not about seniority, it’s about performance.” Right as he said that the sort manager was walking by so he decided to ask him. The sort manager told him that seniority is more important. I told the sort manager thank you and walked away. I ended up getting about another hour worth of work. But the satisfaction of proving my PT sup wrong and seeing the look on his face was worth so much more. Thanks again guys.


I was trying to bump a loader who worked in my area but had less seniority than me. I was a loader for 5 years before I moved up to HVD pickoff. So it’s not like I don’t know how to load a trailer.

Crap, I missed this post!

I'm glad you are squared away and maximizing your work hours via seniority.

 

[mancini]

how it works here is you have the right to stay longer if you both have the same start time if they start later than you they can stay because the company can say we don't know yet if someone will have to work ot or not.

 

[menotyou]

how it works here is you have the right to stay longer if you both have the same start time if they start later than you they can stay because the company can say we don't know yet if someone will have to work ot or not.

Could you be more coherent?

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

how it works here is you have the right to stay longer if you both have the same start time if they start later than you they can stay because the company can say we don't know yet if someone will have to work ot or not.

Could you be more coherent?

Mancinin's hub must have staggered start times. Employee A has more seniority than Employee B but starts 2 hours earlier. Employee A cannot displace B after A completes his 3.5 as B would have only worked 1.5 hrs. A would have to wait 2 more hours (unpaid) for B to complete his 3.5 before bumping him.

 

[packagemandan]

It is your right as the senior employee for extra work..does it mean you have to work harder..No...does this sound familiar, "if you want to do the work I need you to be successful"..lol.. file for the time and enjoy the money.

 

[menotyou]

Mancinin's hub must have staggered start times. Employee A has more seniority than Employee B but starts 2 hours earlier. Employee A cannot displace B after A completes his 3.5 as B would have only worked 1.5 hrs. A would have to wait 2 more hours (unpaid) for B to complete his 3.5 before bumping him.

Staggered starts are against contract.

 

[washington57]

Staggered starts are against contract.

Really? Not in JC28... we have people with 2 hours diffference in start times.

 

[steward71]

Really? Not in JC28... we have people with 2 hours diffference in start times.

They are not against the agreement. They can have staggered start times as long as it is done by the senior list.

 

[anonymous4]

Two additional questions. How can you define "immediate work area"? For example, if I am in the unload but have more seniority than people in the load, it is my right to walk to the load, hop in a truck and get my due time based on seniority if they have their 3.5, correct? Immediate work area has to mean nothing as management can shuffle you around to keep you away if for instance, you file on sups working at the end of the night in the load. What.. I have to be within x amount of feet to walk there and bump someone with less seniority? Please clarify.

Second, let's say there are 3 union employees left on the clock loading. There are 10 carts of bulk left but management wants to cut hard. They say one of you needs to go. There is no definition of how many people are required to do said task, so how can you grieve being removed when common sense dictates the work left "should" require 3 union employees. The least senior of these 3 is the one who will file on sups working, so management uses this tactic to get rid of said person, and fill that role with a sup working after they are cut.

 

[menotyou]

They are not against the agreement. They can have staggered start times as long as it is done by the senior list.

It is on Pg 179, Section 2, Art. 53.

 

[UPSGUY72]

I’m a HVD pick off on my belt with 6 years seniority. Sometimes my PT supervisor will send me home before he sends home some of the loaders (all of whom have less seniority than me). I tell him that I want to stay and that I have more seniority than most of the people working in my area. He says that it isn’t based on who has the most seniority, but who has the better performance. I tried to look in the contract but I couldn’t find anything. Does anyone know if my seniority allows me to stay later than someone who hasn’t been there as long? Or is the PT sup correct?

The SUP is wrong, However you can only bump the lowest seniority person left in the building you can not pick where you want to go. The big question is how much time are you talking about ??

Watch out what you wish for ???

 

[Buck Fifty]

Available work goes to the senior employee. This is a guaranteed win if you grieve it.

This is a 360 degree, take off from the free throw line slam dunk !

 

[brown_trousers]

Seniority trumps everything.

Does it really trump EVERYTHING? This new guy always shows up 5 minutes before me and steals the good parking spot, can i pull seniority on him for that parking spot?

 

[brown_trousers]

It is on Pg 179, Section 2, Art. 53.

Is that the NMA? or a supplement or rider? It sounds like it might be different depending on what region you are in?

 

[packageguy]

Our center. seniority is everything, so far no proplems with that