Home
Forums
New posts
Search forums
What's new
New posts
Latest activity
Members
Current visitors
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
New posts
Search forums
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Home
Forums
Brown Cafe UPS Forum
UPS Union Issues
How dare UPS layoff workers after profitting $5.8 BILLION in 2010?
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="air_dr" data-source="post: 805567" data-attributes="member: 29929"><p>PT Stewie, thank you for your posts, quoted above. I believe they contain some real wisdom and many who have contributed to this thread would do well to reread them. </p><p> </p><p>You know, when a conversation goes deeper into certain subjects, depending on who I am hanging around with in a particular moment, I have felt like either a leftist socialist Marxist or a right-wing, libertarian, free market captalist. God help me. And God help our polarized and messed up world.</p><p> </p><p>Amid all of the passion on this thread, from you and others, 804brown, you make a good point with your quote "a society can be judged by the way it treats its prisoners." (I think "prisoners" may actually be "most vulnerable members," but the point is the same.) However, even though I consider myself a loyal Teamster, I have a problem with the title of this thread "How dare UPS layoff workers after profitting $5.8 BILLION in 2010?" and many of the other things you have said.</p><p> </p><p>It appears to me that you completely fail to distinguish between actual contract violations for which the company should most certainly be called on, and lawful, legitimate, and I would argue even ethical changes to operations that cause a certain amount of suffering to certain individuals (FT clerks at present, for example). One quality that successful people and organizations possess is the ability to adapt to a changing world and reinvent themselves.</p><p> </p><p>Cities, once upon a time, employed lamp lighters to light gas powered street lights. Not even the wealthiest communities have kept on the payroll a bunch of lamp lighters with nothing to do because "we are so rich, have so much, and, at least the decent among us, will feel better knowing we didn't lay off and bring suffering upon some poor soul of far humbler means." If this seems a bit far fetched consider...</p><p> </p><p>As another example: the railroads. Once upon a time, there was not just a need for engineers and conductors, but also firemen (to shover the coal) and brakemen (to set brakes). With technological development, on modern diesel-electric trains, those people are simply uneeded. Freight trains of the past operated with five man crews. Today its two. The Brotherhood of Railway Firemen tried, and for a time put up a successful resistance, but it prooved to be a loosing battle. Union person though I am, certain unrealistic labor arrangements, I believe, made some lean times (60s, 70s) for the railroads even leaner, but with reasonable changes, today, the industry is once again not only strong, but growing and hiring people for well paying jobs.</p><p> </p><p>If UPS concludes they can accomplish something without a particular job, I see nothing unethical about eliminating that position, even if the company had made 580 billion. In fact, they have a duty to the shareholder to eliminate that job. (Though I am not happy to see someone out of work.)</p><p> </p><p>You say you want to expose UPS' behavior to the general public. I say go for it. Take aim at harassment and other mistreatment. Grieve actual contract violoations. But don't bog yourself down lamenting what most objective people (myself included) will view as progress, even if it comes with some pain. Pick your battles wisely!</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="air_dr, post: 805567, member: 29929"] PT Stewie, thank you for your posts, quoted above. I believe they contain some real wisdom and many who have contributed to this thread would do well to reread them. You know, when a conversation goes deeper into certain subjects, depending on who I am hanging around with in a particular moment, I have felt like either a leftist socialist Marxist or a right-wing, libertarian, free market captalist. God help me. And God help our polarized and messed up world. Amid all of the passion on this thread, from you and others, 804brown, you make a good point with your quote "a society can be judged by the way it treats its prisoners." (I think "prisoners" may actually be "most vulnerable members," but the point is the same.) However, even though I consider myself a loyal Teamster, I have a problem with the title of this thread "How dare UPS layoff workers after profitting $5.8 BILLION in 2010?" and many of the other things you have said. It appears to me that you completely fail to distinguish between actual contract violations for which the company should most certainly be called on, and lawful, legitimate, and I would argue even ethical changes to operations that cause a certain amount of suffering to certain individuals (FT clerks at present, for example). One quality that successful people and organizations possess is the ability to adapt to a changing world and reinvent themselves. Cities, once upon a time, employed lamp lighters to light gas powered street lights. Not even the wealthiest communities have kept on the payroll a bunch of lamp lighters with nothing to do because "we are so rich, have so much, and, at least the decent among us, will feel better knowing we didn't lay off and bring suffering upon some poor soul of far humbler means." If this seems a bit far fetched consider... As another example: the railroads. Once upon a time, there was not just a need for engineers and conductors, but also firemen (to shover the coal) and brakemen (to set brakes). With technological development, on modern diesel-electric trains, those people are simply uneeded. Freight trains of the past operated with five man crews. Today its two. The Brotherhood of Railway Firemen tried, and for a time put up a successful resistance, but it prooved to be a loosing battle. Union person though I am, certain unrealistic labor arrangements, I believe, made some lean times (60s, 70s) for the railroads even leaner, but with reasonable changes, today, the industry is once again not only strong, but growing and hiring people for well paying jobs. If UPS concludes they can accomplish something without a particular job, I see nothing unethical about eliminating that position, even if the company had made 580 billion. In fact, they have a duty to the shareholder to eliminate that job. (Though I am not happy to see someone out of work.) You say you want to expose UPS' behavior to the general public. I say go for it. Take aim at harassment and other mistreatment. Grieve actual contract violoations. But don't bog yourself down lamenting what most objective people (myself included) will view as progress, even if it comes with some pain. Pick your battles wisely! [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Home
Forums
Brown Cafe UPS Forum
UPS Union Issues
How dare UPS layoff workers after profitting $5.8 BILLION in 2010?
Top