PT Preload Supervsiors working

[konsole]

supervisors who do hourly work do so for a reason. sometimes its staffing shortages sometimes it because they do a poor job of training and holding their people accountable.

I don't disagree that there are some circumstances when the supervisors should step in and handle some packages, but if those situations are anything more then rare then something needs to be fixed. We have 5 people on our belt and everyday our supervisor is having to fill in for someone that is either 15+ minutes late, or someone that decides that 10 minutes after break is a better time to use the bathroom, or someone that "mysteriously" has to leave 30 minutes early for something. Obviously I am pointing out that terrible coworker work ethic is alot to blame and as others on here can probably agree to, not giving people a choice is often the best way of fixing their bad habits (the fix being eliminating their easy non union supervisor help). Even when we have 100% attendance and the work load isnt overburdening, the sup has gotten so use to acting like a part time hourly that he can't help him self but handle packages wherever he sees the opportunity. The process of fixing all this can start by setting an ultimatum with the sups that they are not to touch packages unless its an emergency situation. By accomplishing that my coworkers will realize that a non union member isnt readily available to cover for them or pick up their slack and they will have to be better with their attendance and work ethic, or else yes possibly face punishment. What has resulted is the sups have turned into PT preloaders that just have a few extra misc tasks. Both management and other part timers have gotten use to treating the sups as just other part time hourlies and the sups have become just another hand to handle work. If this results in some employees getting fired because they cant handle a reasonable work load because the supervisor isnt picking up their slack anymore then so be it. If the supervisor stops handling packages and workers are working hard and are still getting swamped but the management refuses to reduce their work load then let the supervisor and employee file a grievance for unsafe work conditions.

Like I said before almost all of my coworkers would rather the supervisor help because they are all thinking short term and how the supervisors help will get them through that avalanche of packages for that day. Few of them are thinking long term and how the elimination of supervisors working will mean less work can be done which means work load will have to be reduced or the work wont get done on time. My coworkers just get upset at the rediculous work load but can't relate how supervisors working is only increasing the work load.

If in the process of getting supervisors to stop working it now means the slackers are now made to do their job. Are you prepared to look those that get fired in the eye and tell them it was good for the union?

Do you think the agreement of supervisors not working and not taking away work from hourlies is a bad thing? If the hourlies are slacking and sitting idly by while supervisors handle the work then it seems as if they arent obeying the contract themselves.

 

[UnconTROLLed]

If you were fired for filing grievances that is against the law, Your statement that he shold leave it alone because the union does not care is an excellent example of what I been saying for years. YOU ARE THE UNION, If you don't care then your right, if you make it your business and get involved and get others involved, the Union can only be as strong as its membership.

I've explained the whole situation before on here, it's probably the same steward that konsole is dealing with, same building too. Being a selfish Teamster is the only way to survive at UPS. The grievance was sold out, I was told in the office that either the grievance hours be reduced by 4x or I would be targeted. IT WAS A SUPERVISOR WORKING GRIEVANCE and it was 100% legitimate for many hours of work done by a PT sup. I agreed to the reduction, the grievances was only to correct behaviour and I didn't care about the money. So, I recieved basically nothing for the grievance. Yet was targeted anyway, and harrassed so much that the DM actually fired me for sitting on the end of a bulk slide AFTER a shift near the exit door in the primary. "Working unsafely" although I wasn't even on the clock and the shift was over! THIS was not at all only management involvement; there was more to it.

I don't trust either party, personally, which is why I don't care about the contract violations anymore unless they affect me. Which is why I say, pick your battles wisely and don't stick your nose in other peoples issues.

 

[KingofBrown]

I bet you have layoffs on your shift. Don't you?

I guess I finally just got fed up with it. At first I was happy that my supervisor was helping us out get through the shift, but I've grown to be tired of it. Not that my supervisor is constantly working for the entire ~4 hours but he works for a solid 2-2.5 hours of it. One minute hes helping split the belt, the next minute hes throwing a few packages in someones truck and then the minute after that he is carrying overweights into another persons truck. A few months ago I sat down with him and the sort manager and the conclusion they gave me is that they have to cater to the abilities of the other employees. So I'm alone in my work area on this topic because all the other employees would rather he help them out so that their day is easier and they can leave as soon as possible. Not that I couldnt use his help also but I'm the only one who rejects his help offering, unless my work area has turned into a serious safety concern and there has been reasonable effort to get an hourly to help me. Just yesterday morning we were wrapping up the day and me and another hourly were moving packages from the last truck on the belt to one of the middle trucks. The supervisor stepped in and started pushing the packages up the belt (trying to be a nice guy I know), at which point I asked the supervisor in a calm and innocent manner if he would let me and the other employee take care of it. He got upset with me and said to me that its Friday and he just wanted to get out of there, and that management told him to do this, and that I should file a complaint, at which point I have filled out a grievance but havent turned it in yet. I like my supervisor hes a great guy and cares alot for his employees but hes addicted to handling packages and nobody other then me and the steward tell him to stop. I'm sure the other employees are gonna hate me for potentially preventing him from helping them but whatever, a good majority of these other employees would rather just stay home while he loaded their trucks and they collected their health insurance. If the employees around me are not capable of keeping up with their work without the supervisors help then UPS needs to understand that their workload needs to be reduced or employees who are capable of the job need to be put there. Of course he is not the only supervisor working but he is my supervisor and I feel like dealing with my supervisor is the place to start.

I know that 95% of the time I request that he stop working he will have some excuse for why he is but what's your guys' experience/thoughts and recommendations on this subject?

 

[KingofBrown]

You gotta' do something, you can go with Labor or any other agency, if your stewards don't cooperate, go to a higher level, try to exhaust your Union resources first, though. I agree on saying not to stick your nose in other peoples issues, but what you said here, it does affect you, sooner or later. I understand your situation, it's the same shoot here. I wonder if this is mostly everywhere.

I've explained the whole situation before on here, it's probably the same steward that konsole is dealing with, same building too. Being a selfish Teamster is the only way to survive at UPS. The grievance was sold out, I was told in the office that either the grievance hours be reduced by 4x or I would be targeted. IT WAS A SUPERVISOR WORKING GRIEVANCE and it was 100% legitimate for many hours of work done by a PT sup. I agreed to the reduction, the grievances was only to correct behaviour and I didn't care about the money. So, I recieved basically nothing for the grievance. Yet was targeted anyway, and harrassed so much that the DM actually fired me for sitting on the end of a bulk slide AFTER a shift near the exit door in the primary. "Working unsafely" although I wasn't even on the clock and the shift was over! THIS was not at all only management involvement; there was more to it.

I don't trust either party, personally, which is why I don't care about the contract violations anymore unless they affect me. Which is why I say, pick your battles wisely and don't stick your nose in other peoples issues.

 

[konsole]

3 excellent examples of how its gotten to be...

1. The supervisor has complained in the recent past of back pain. From what, auditing trucks?
2. He has now gotten into the habit of stretching at the beginning of the shift. What for? Is carrying around the clipboard hard on the muscles?
3. He can also be seen trying to cool himself off by fanning his shirt. I guess 60 deg. is too hot for filling out paper work?

Its not that my supervisor wants to work, hes just become addicted to it from being afraid of losing his job because the management might get upset from inadequate performance on the belt. I guess that management thinks that the union master agreement doesnt apply to supervisors at all. Even when I spoke to another coworker about this issue he said that he doesnt want to ask the supervisor to not help out because he doesnt want to see the supervisor lose his job. I'm 100% positive that he would be all for elimination of supervisors working if his job was sercure, unfortunately its not since he doesnt have the union to back him up. He has tried to bring up the issue of slacking employees with management before and all management does is say its all his fault that my coworkers work ethic stinks.

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

Unfortunately this supervisor has created a situation that he will have a very hard time correcting. I think the best thing would be for him, and for those he "supervises", to be transferred within the facility, so that he can get a fresh start.

 

[brownIEman]

3 excellent examples of how its gotten to be...

1. The supervisor has complained in the recent past of back pain. From what, auditing trucks?
2. He has now gotten into the habit of stretching at the beginning of the shift. What for? Is carrying around the clipboard hard on the muscles?
3. He can also be seen trying to cool himself off by fanning his shirt. I guess 60 deg. is too hot for filling out paper work?

Its not that my supervisor wants to work, hes just become addicted to it from being afraid of losing his job because the management might get upset from inadequate performance on the belt. I guess that management thinks that the union master agreement doesnt apply to supervisors at all. Even when I spoke to another coworker about this issue he said that he doesnt want to ask the supervisor to not help out because he doesnt want to see the supervisor lose his job. I'm 100% positive that he would be all for elimination of supervisors working if his job was sercure, unfortunately its not since he doesnt have the union to back him up. He has tried to bring up the issue of slacking employees with management before and all management does is say its all his fault that my coworkers work ethic stinks.

It is not your supervisors fault that you coworkers have poor work ethics. It is however his job to get them to do their jobs, and if they refuse, to find a way to get rid of them.

 

[Champ_Here]

I work on our local sort and I've double shifted (preload and local) at least 15 different times in the past 3 years... every single morning there's this preload sup that spends (just like your sup) almost half of the sort working. The real kicker is that nobody has ever said anything and he is typically working directly in front of a shop steward (then again, it seems our union is quite weak in this area of our state). Just like you I've never filed a grievance and probably won't. I'm not apart of their sort so I don't know if they want him working (though you and I should just file the grievances due to the violation of our contract).

 

[Champ_Here]

You gotta' do something, you can go with Labor or any other agency, if your stewards don't cooperate, go to a higher level, try to exhaust your Union resources first, though. I agree on saying not to stick your nose in other peoples issues, but what you said here, it does affect you, sooner or later. I understand your situation, it's the same shoot here. I wonder if this is mostly everywhere.

it is mostly everywhere... due to the economic recession we're experiencing, UPS is really trying to cut down on their expenditures as much as possible. They're either going to get rid of jobs or hope for employees to screw up. I've noticed that supervisors are trying to work in many centers so that their production numbers look better (it's like having a ghost working... they're not included in those production numbers because they're not supposed to be working). What they're trying to do at our center is hold us to the contract down to the t (since that's what all of our employees are doing... minus the preload sort guys) so that they can get rid of us as we screw up... Right now the big game they're playing is saying that all employees are only allowed to have 6 days taken off for the year (the contract actually says you accrue 6 sick days over a years period) and trying to call us undependable and thus getting rid of us.

 

[KingofBrown]

It's the same situation here. They've fired several fellow employees for stupid things. Some got their jobs back, some didn't. Now, I see the economy is getting better, but they're still with the same attitude. I've seen many non-common sense and made-up rules here, too, like the one you've said.

it is mostly everywhere... due to the economic recession we're experiencing, UPS is really trying to cut down on their expenditures as much as possible. They're either going to get rid of jobs or hope for employees to screw up. I've noticed that supervisors are trying to work in many centers so that their production numbers look better (it's like having a ghost working... they're not included in those production numbers because they're not supposed to be working). What they're trying to do at our center is hold us to the contract down to the t (since that's what all of our employees are doing... minus the preload sort guys) so that they can get rid of us as we screw up... Right now the big game they're playing is saying that all employees are only allowed to have 6 days taken off for the year (the contract actually says you accrue 6 sick days over a years period) and trying to call us undependable and thus getting rid of us.

 

[UPSF Peeon]

it clearly says in the contract that pt sups can work as much as they want as long as the group they are supervising is a bunch of lazy union b*t*es

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

it clearly says in the contract that pt sups can work as much as they want as long as the group they are supervising is a bunch of lazy union b*t*es

The logo may say UPS but the mindset is clearly still Overnite.

 

[Mavrick70004]

Would filing a grievance for this hurt someones chances of becoming a PT supervisor? That reason is the only one that keeps me from filing one. On one hand you just cost them money and probably got someone in trouble, but on the other hand, you saw that rules were being blatantly broken and brought it to attention of the company

 

[UnconTROLLed]

Would filing a grievance for this hurt someones chances of becoming a PT supervisor? That reason is the only one that keeps me from filing one. On one hand you just cost them money and probably got someone in trouble, but on the other hand, you saw that rules were being blatantly broken and brought it to attention of the company

You could jump in your vehicle, look your boss in the eye and run over his dog , and you could still become a PT supervisor. That is the least desirable job in the company for many reasons.....I highly doubt filing will "hurt chances", infact it'll probably get you expidited to PT supervisor, as you'll be out of their hair then.

I have literally seen hourlies ONE WEEK into the job get promoted to supervisor, I don't even think he knew how to do his job yet as an hourly!!

 

[BrownArmy]

I have literally seen hourlies ONE WEEK into the job get promoted to supervisor, I don't even think he knew how to do his job yet as an hourly!!

It's wicked funny to see a twenty-five year old newly-minted supervisor give the PCM to a group of drivers, some of whom started driving when said new-guy-supervisor was in pull-ups watching Thundercats on TV!

What is in the water they serve to new sups?

 

[Mapp]

it clearly says in the contract that pt sups can work as much as they want as long as the group they are supervising is a bunch of lazy union b*t*es

lol.
OP file the grievance. I'm sure the sup doesn't actually want to take your hours away, but he has goals to meet and the fulltime management will turn a blind eye till you start filing. Keep in mind though that if there is a "safety issue" like lack of egress, then the sup can do union work.

 

[UnconTROLLed]

It's wicked funny to see a twenty-five year old newly-minted supervisor give the PCM to a group of drivers, some of whom started driving when said new-guy-supervisor was in pull-ups watching Thundercats on TV!

What is in the water they serve to new sups?

It ain't vitamin water!

 

[BrownArmy]

It's vitamin Kool-Aid!

 

[konsole]

lol.
OP file the grievance. I'm sure the sup doesn't actually want to take your hours away, but he has goals to meet and the fulltime management will turn a blind eye till you start filing. Keep in mind though that if there is a "safety issue" like lack of egress, then the sup can do union work.

The agreement states that supervisors can work during a few situations including training an employee and demonstrating safety. They are also allowed to work if there is an "act of god" which is kinda vague but is safe to assume that means something uncontrollable, but they must make adequate effort to get another bargaining unit employee to do the work. The agreement seems to state that if there is a safety issue then other bargaining unit employees must be used first before the supervisor can step in. I don't see anywhere in "supervisors working" section of the agreement anything pertaining to allowing supervisors to work specifically when there are egress issues.

 

[IEpuke]

It is crazy to think that a young person (who might be attending college) try to develop themselves so they can advance at UPS. They could even take these skills and become successful at other companies. These "least desirable people" are often highly recruited by other companies. It is easy to take one situation and apply it to a whole group of people. Most drivers that I know are hard working dedicated professional people.....I don't let the few lazy idiots paint my whole picture of the driver group. And part time sups should be supervising not working. File the grievance...