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<blockquote data-quote="wkmac" data-source="post: 271275" data-attributes="member: 2189"><p>You know Big, that's a pretty good observation but as to exactly how true it is could be open to some debate. The republicans during the Clinton years howled much the same against Clinton's military strikes on Iraq (wag the dog!) and especially the Balkans that was about democratizing a region just as Iraq is about. You say the Iraqi's suffered human rights abuses and it's our duty to stop that. A sidenote in Saudi Arabia is where the Islamic courts sentenced a <strong>"<img src="/community/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/group1/censored2.gif" class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":censored2:" title="Censored2 :censored2:" data-shortname=":censored2:" /><img src="/community/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/group1/censored2.gif" class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":censored2:" title="Censored2 :censored2:" data-shortname=":censored2:" /><img src="/community/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/group1/censored2.gif" class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":censored2:" title="Censored2 :censored2:" data-shortname=":censored2:" /><img src="/community/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/group1/censored2.gif" class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":censored2:" title="Censored2 :censored2:" data-shortname=":censored2:" />E"</strong> (important if you understand Sunni verses Shia) women to 200 lashes and 6 months in jail basically because she got gang raped! The root crime was bing in the presence of men who were not her family or husband. There's your ally in the war on Terror! </p><p> </p><p>Back to the point. Well the same human rights abuses were happening in the Balkans as well so if it's our duty now in Iraq, then it was also our duty then so to be critical of President Clinton would equate IMO on the same level of being criitical of Bush. You see Big, <strong><u>we're</u></strong> sold a bill of goods by the politicians but they both play the same political game so then they hoodwink <strong><u>us</u></strong> in by playing on<strong><u> our</u></strong> political bias'. However, I do think overall it's a pretty good point that you made. </p><p> </p><p>That's said let's flip the coin to the other side and look at what we have. When the republicans didn't have the WH and even more so didn't have the catbird seat in Congress, what was their mantra that attracted folks to them in the first place and they openly proclaimed?</p><p> </p><p>Let's see:</p><p> </p><p>1)Limited gov't (in some cases very limited)</p><p> </p><p>2)Local and/or state control on things like education and ending unfunded State and local mandates (this was the reason Zell Miller wanted to abolish the 17th amendment and give the State legislatures a voice back in Washington, I know because as my Senator I spoke with him one on one about it and cheered his efforts)</p><p> </p><p>3)Fiscal responsibility that incorporates cutting taxes along with cutting spending (see items 1 as a means to achieving item #3)</p><p> </p><p>4)They even advocated a more non-agression foreign policy that rebuffed the idea of nation building and being the world's policeman (Bush in the 2000' debates used those exact words in condemning the very thing he does now. Read the debates as I've posted direct links to them in the past)</p><p> </p><p>You want to sit there and slam the democrats or liberals as you call them and you have good cause to do so. But what really makes me laugh is to see you and others slam the opposing party for doing something that your party does in point fact and you even cheer and defend the effort. Sometimes under what IMO is a misguided form of Patriotism that you've created in order to justify them doing what you outright condemn others for doing.</p><p> </p><p>Well what is a Sheeple in the first place? </p><p><a href="http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/sheeple" target="_blank">http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/sheeple</a></p><p> </p><p>So in a nutshell, it's someone who accepts unquestioningly that something is true. Even under the light of facts you still won't consider a moment to question or check further to see how true it is or at least you and others comes across that way. </p><p> </p><p>I think this happens to <strong><u>everyone</u></strong> as we begin to trust a source or point of view over time and this sets us up sometimes innocently to be caught in this trap. Before <strong><u>we</u></strong> go accusing others of being sheeple it may be best that <strong><u>we</u></strong> take a good look in the mirror to see <strong><u>we</u></strong> haven't fallen into the same trap but just not realized it yet. It's easy to have happen.</p><p> </p><p>Did you ever for a moment think that in Washington that they see all of us a sheeple? They think we're so stupid that when someone gives a speech that they need to also present an opposing view as they know we're to lazy to go check the facts ourselves. Then the big media put a talking head to intrepret those speeches and tell us what they said. You'd think we spoke a foreign language and they act the intrepreter. Are we really this stupid?</p><p> </p><p>I got news for you, that is exactly how they see us and we give them nothing to ever consider otherwise and that is the really tragic part IMO.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="wkmac, post: 271275, member: 2189"] You know Big, that's a pretty good observation but as to exactly how true it is could be open to some debate. The republicans during the Clinton years howled much the same against Clinton's military strikes on Iraq (wag the dog!) and especially the Balkans that was about democratizing a region just as Iraq is about. You say the Iraqi's suffered human rights abuses and it's our duty to stop that. A sidenote in Saudi Arabia is where the Islamic courts sentenced a [B]":censored::censored::censored::censored:E"[/B] (important if you understand Sunni verses Shia) women to 200 lashes and 6 months in jail basically because she got gang raped! The root crime was bing in the presence of men who were not her family or husband. There's your ally in the war on Terror! Back to the point. Well the same human rights abuses were happening in the Balkans as well so if it's our duty now in Iraq, then it was also our duty then so to be critical of President Clinton would equate IMO on the same level of being criitical of Bush. You see Big, [B][U]we're[/U][/B] sold a bill of goods by the politicians but they both play the same political game so then they hoodwink [B][U]us[/U][/B] in by playing on[B][U] our[/U][/B] political bias'. However, I do think overall it's a pretty good point that you made. That's said let's flip the coin to the other side and look at what we have. When the republicans didn't have the WH and even more so didn't have the catbird seat in Congress, what was their mantra that attracted folks to them in the first place and they openly proclaimed? Let's see: 1)Limited gov't (in some cases very limited) 2)Local and/or state control on things like education and ending unfunded State and local mandates (this was the reason Zell Miller wanted to abolish the 17th amendment and give the State legislatures a voice back in Washington, I know because as my Senator I spoke with him one on one about it and cheered his efforts) 3)Fiscal responsibility that incorporates cutting taxes along with cutting spending (see items 1 as a means to achieving item #3) 4)They even advocated a more non-agression foreign policy that rebuffed the idea of nation building and being the world's policeman (Bush in the 2000' debates used those exact words in condemning the very thing he does now. Read the debates as I've posted direct links to them in the past) You want to sit there and slam the democrats or liberals as you call them and you have good cause to do so. But what really makes me laugh is to see you and others slam the opposing party for doing something that your party does in point fact and you even cheer and defend the effort. Sometimes under what IMO is a misguided form of Patriotism that you've created in order to justify them doing what you outright condemn others for doing. Well what is a Sheeple in the first place? [URL]http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/sheeple[/URL] So in a nutshell, it's someone who accepts unquestioningly that something is true. Even under the light of facts you still won't consider a moment to question or check further to see how true it is or at least you and others comes across that way. I think this happens to [B][U]everyone[/U][/B] as we begin to trust a source or point of view over time and this sets us up sometimes innocently to be caught in this trap. Before [B][U]we[/U][/B] go accusing others of being sheeple it may be best that [B][U]we[/U][/B] take a good look in the mirror to see [B][U]we[/U][/B] haven't fallen into the same trap but just not realized it yet. It's easy to have happen. Did you ever for a moment think that in Washington that they see all of us a sheeple? They think we're so stupid that when someone gives a speech that they need to also present an opposing view as they know we're to lazy to go check the facts ourselves. Then the big media put a talking head to intrepret those speeches and tell us what they said. You'd think we spoke a foreign language and they act the intrepreter. Are we really this stupid? I got news for you, that is exactly how they see us and we give them nothing to ever consider otherwise and that is the really tragic part IMO. [/QUOTE]
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