Discussion in 'Current Events' started by wkmac, Apr 23, 2009.
Shepard is simply stating 2 +2 = 4, no matter how much Big Brother tries to tell us it equals 5.
Notice when you hear pro-torture proponents argue their case, the word torture is substituted with "enhanced interrogations"......I'm mean really, lets call a spade......a spade......it's f***ing torture......Kudos to Shep
From George Orwell's Notes on Nationalism (well worth reading in it's entirety):
What's wrong with this picture....I watched Shep and liked it just like wkmac & D.
That's just weird !!
I'm willing to bet that what struck you about Shep's comments was where he adamantly and correctly stated, "This is America!" IMO, what Shep said was something we forgot as a result of the shock from 9/11. God, 200 plus years ago, IMO gave us a gift that he doesn't often do across the span of time and even though we have our warts, the foundation and principles of that wonderful gift is still there. Question is, will we reach back out for it again or will we reject this gift and choose a path more the norm of human history?
Good observation D. What really bugs me about gov't and this is a non-partisan issue IMO but all gov't leaders and even non-gov't leaders across society all have speech specialist and PR people/lawyers working for them. Their job is to parse words and craft words for these people to use in public.
My question is this, when did straight up truth ever need such things?
Think about it!
Speaking of torture, President Obama may be showing his political moxy and I'm impressed. First, President Obama releases photos concerning torture abuse allegations but then the next day (today) we see he opposes a "Truth Commission" on this issue.
The first article poses this question in response to it all.
Has President Obama learned the Washington game of building a demand before launching the product line? Once done, he can clearly have the high road in saying he's giving the people what they want. Why do I see Rahm and Wag the Dog all in this? IMO, this is classic Clintonism. Pretty smart if that proves to be the case.
Also, the Truth Commission is more a Congressional device and would show the Congress as being the provider to the power of truth. President Obama's plan may be to circumvent that focus and position the WH in the eyes of the people as being the harbinger of truth and therefore the people would look to the Presidency for all things. I see the Unitary Executive theory didn't die when Bush left Washington. Again, so much for change!
If this is the case, the man has done his homework and just might score a touchdown with a gimmick play that catches everyone by surprise.
Can we water board him?! Please?
I'd volunteer to be waterboarded, for the charity of my choice.
Waterboarding isn't torture. I've had quite a few soldiers, several Sailors, and a Marine personally tell me that they've been waterboarded as part of their training. So, I guess its a training technique to keep our special ops troops from drowning from panic and torture at the same time? LOL! It's not a surprise that most of the people in this country that consider torture are leftists. These are the same people that thinks that raising your voice to a terrorist is torture. Wake up people! We've been doing these things for years. It's not like we are cutting fingers off or skinning these people alive.
Oh by the way.....terrorists don't fall under the Geneva Convention and therefore aren't protected by the same rules that apply to lawful prisoners of war.
I understand what you're saying, because they're not an "army", persay. It's hard for people to see this view, though. Terrorists are like gang members. You can bomb/beat the smack out of them, but they'll keep coming back at you. You can never let your guard down. This is what must be combatted, so how do you win against people that think this way?
Appease them I guess. That seems to be the road we are headed down now.
I think this is the greatest question of all. How do you make peace, with someone that doesn't want peace?
This is the single most important question that some people on the left need to be asking themselves.
You can waterboard me as a test if you like, after all if Im an enemy now I will know the exact amount of time I have to put up with it, and I KNOW I wont be killed. Wow thats scary. Its not like we are going to cut off their heads or their genitals.
I dont see it as torture, sorry. I see it as a last resort to get info that saves OUR lives. But it will no longer work, so.....................
Well, hey....liberals have always been willing to weaken their own country to prove a point.
What we need to do is invade Muslim countries. Doing so will win their hearts and minds.
We need to use our military for everything but defending our actual borders. It is better that we defend other countries borders instead.
We need to allow immigration from countries whose populations have a known hatred for us. Then, we should do our very best not to check on said immigrants.
Finally, we need to support a country, to the tune of billions of dollars of aid a year, that will not let a significant portion of people under their control to have complete self determination. Or allow these same people to return to the land of their birth.
Damn, we are already doing all these things I suggested. Why aren't the terrorists stopping?
Oh wait, terrorists only kill for the thrill of it, they never have reasons. I guess what we really must do, since the majority of them seem to be of this religious persuasion, is take out all the Muslims. It may be our only hope.
Jones, your Orwell post started me thinking about wkmac's thread (Interesting Thoughts To Ponder on this Most Special of Days!) were I took umbrage at what I viewed as a slight at Catholicism in particular, but more importantly, Western civilization in general.
In Orwell's statement about nationalism, I think one can find what might be the fatal flaw of our civilization. It is not our culture, per se, but our actions that suggest we believe that no one is entitled to it but ourselves.
Our heritage of liberal democracy, human rights, and the rule of law are not fundamental flaws but universal strengths. The problem is, we frequently act as if these concepts really only apply to ourselves. Hence, we find no problems in exploiting another non Western country's labor and environment in ways we find totally unacceptable for ourselves.
Our culture will continue to be the world's scapegoat until we address this reality.
Sometimes I feel like I'm in a college lecture, when you guys get to posting. Love to hear all of the different ideas.
Well, on here you get many different points of view. In most colleges you mostly hear liberal points of view.
Separate names with a comma.