Cash for Clunkers...

[brett636]

Thankfully this failure of a program is over, and we can only hope that it never gets revived again. In 20 years when our children are paying a large percentage of their paycheck to payback this debt do you think they will look back and remember all the new cars people were buying with their money? I thought not...

 

[klein]

Thankfully this failure of a program is over, and we can only hope that it never gets revived again. In 20 years when our children are paying a large percentage of their paycheck to payback this debt do you think they will look back and remember all the new cars people were buying with their money? I thought not...

What makes you think 20years ?
Taxes will increase as soon as things pick up !

 

[brett636]

What makes you think 20years ?
Taxes will increase as soon as things pick up !

Taxes have already increased here, and will increase for everyone no matter what their income level when the Bush tax cuts expire. The problem is they won't be high enough to maintain the federal government's obligation to social programs such as medicare and social security, pay for the interest on the ever growing national debt, and pay for whatever new social programs come from the failure of a President that we have now. It almost makes you not want to bring children into this world. We are simply making them slaves to pay for our fiscal irresponsibility today.

 

[klein]

Taxes have already increased here, and will increase for everyone no matter what their income level when the Bush tax cuts expire. The problem is they won't be high enough to maintain the federal government's obligation to social programs such as medicare and social security, pay for the interest on the ever growing national debt, and pay for whatever new social programs come from the failure of a President that we have now. It almost makes you not want to bring children into this world. We are simply making them slaves to pay for our fiscal irresponsibility today.

Brett, I totally agree with you. Was watching CNN money earlier today.
$9 trillion is debt this year alone, someone has to pay for it.
It doesn't take a brain surgeon to figure that one out.
They compared it, with your normal family "kitchen expenses".
If you spend more then you earn, - well it will catch up to you, and you'll need to pay for it.
In this case "earn" more money, by raising taxes.
They even went as far as saying, any politician that gets elected now, and promises no new taxes, should go to jail, as a bullsh.tter and lair.
It's a tough ride ahead of you americans, by no doubt.
Things will change alright. You'll pay the taxes we pay in Canada, yet won't have the social programs we have in place.

 

[av8torntn]

Jeremy Anwyl, CEO of the automotive research group Edmunds.com, observes: "Nice party, but the hangover is awful."


http://spectator.org/archives/2009/08/28/clunkering-down


Cash for clunkers: Dumbest program ever?

http://www.cato-at-liberty.org/2009/08/21/cash-for-clunkers-dumbest-program-ever/

 

[fact check]

Is there some reason we don't want to 'jump start' the American economy?

It would seem that bringing the patient back to life (American manufacturing) would be the first order of business. After it's alive, then we can start to treat the causes.

Once the plants are closed and assets are sold off, it is difficult to begin the manufacturing process from scratch.

Why do so many of you hate America? Why are you not fully behind the measures your elected leaders have deemed necessary?

Would you feel better if we had another unnecessary war to keep the economy afloat?

 

[moreluck]

It's not about hating America. It's loving America and not wanting to see it fade away because of the Obamas, Pelosis and Reids of the world. It started to fade with Madelyn Murray Ohare and has gone downhill since.

Believe me every student says...."I hope to God I pass this test" Prayer in school exists, just silently now.

 

[klein]

Is there some reason we don't want to 'jump start' the American economy?

It would seem that bringing the patient back to life (American manufacturing) would be the first order of business. After it's alive, then we can start to treat the causes.

Once the plants are closed and assets are sold off, it is difficult to begin the manufacturing process from scratch.

Why do so many of you hate America? Why are you not fully behind the measures your elected leaders have deemed necessary?

Would you feel better if we had another unnecessary war to keep the economy afloat?

I'm pretty social as everyone knows, but cash for clunkers was a very bad decision. If it was soo good, why didn't the rest of world participate ?
The auto industry has received billions before cash for clunkers.
If you ask me, why not just replace FBI , police, and goverment vehicles with new ones ?
They would have been 100% American made.
Used government and city vehicles could have been sold at public auction.

Cash for clunkers... Toyota benefited the most!

 

[browndevil]

I'm pretty social as everyone knows, but cash for clunkers was a very bad decision. If it was soo good, why didn't the rest of world participate ?
The auto industry has received billions before cash for clunkers.
If you ask me, why not just replace FBI , police, and goverment vehicles with new ones ?
They would have been 100% American made.
Used government and city vehicles could have been sold at public auction.

Cash for clunkers... Toyota benefited the most!

Which tells you a lot. The American car companies don't make fuel effcient vehicles. They never paid attention to the cars we were buying prior to Cash for Clunkers. Which kinda explains why they are in the crapper now. Most people want to blame the unions for the demise of the car companies when it is the design engineers not doing their research.

 

[diesel96]

So it appears dealers are taking it on the chin for this program. Many dealers have yet to be reimbursed for the "clunkers"

This is a gov't run program. Can you imagine them running a health program??? Scary thought !!

Imagine the super-efficient giants like Aetna, Cigna or MetLife were running the Clunkers program, they probably wouldn’t get all bent out of shape about a few paperwork snafus, now would they? The money would just go flying out the door, with no worries about technicalities. If it turned out that a bunch of those rebate applications were fraudulent or bogus, the money paid to the swindlers would just get tacked onto next year’s premiums

and nobody would complain. Right?
If the gov't ran a healthcare plan that offered discounts, worked through existing providers, minimized the paperwork and paid every legitimate claim, would that be considered a failure? I guess it would depend on our expectations, which seem to be higher on government than on a private sector that routinely delays and denies payments to consumers—and that goes without any controversy whatsoever.

Now I heard talk of expanding the Cash program to other things cash for your new Slap-Chop, etc.

Sham-wow Vince...."linguini, fettuccini, martini, bikini.....get your slap chop

 

[klein]

Imagine the super-efficient giants like Aetna, Cigna or MetLife were running the Clunkers program, they probably wouldn’t get all bent out of shape about a few paperwork snafus, now would they? The money would just go flying out the door, with no worries about technicalities. If it turned out that a bunch of those rebate applications were fraudulent or bogus, the money paid to the swindlers would just get tacked onto next year’s premiums

and nobody would complain. Right?
If the gov't ran a healthcare plan that offered discounts, worked through existing providers, minimized the paperwork and paid every legitimate claim, would that be considered a failure? I guess it would depend on our expectations, which seem to be higher on government than on a private sector that routinely delays and denies payments to consumers—and that goes without any controversy whatsoever.

Well said Diesel !
They don't understand with one single healthcard for everyone, and almost no paperwork. It's more efficient and cheaper.
And why do you think our same drugs you get there are 50% cheaper here ? It's because our government buys it bulk and has contracts with providers. That no independent pharmacy, even Walmart could NOT compete with.
I can only wish some of you will visit Canada, and fall ill, then you'll truley see how our system works, and it's great !
You'll be amazed how modern our clinics are.. inside and out.

This is our childrens hospital. Looks like a fancy shopping mall, but it's a hospital !

Looking Back: 2006 Stollery Radiothon

 

[diesel96]

You still did not answer my question on your support of corporate welfare programs which is exactly what Cash for Clunkers is all about. Although its apparent you can't comprehend the difference between a competitive advantage(which this program is not about), and using taxpayer dollars to remove used vehicles from the market increasing prices for all used vehicles. Calling this a success is a bit early as we have yet to see how many vehicles will get repossessed in the coming months when the owners get tired of making payments on them. .

This is old fashioned stimulus of a sort that Republicans like yourself have always advocated in the past, using financial incentives to change behavior.
Now you hate it, most Republicans are haten it, because it’s become a huge hit. It worked as planned, and this cannot stand." America must fail in order for President Obama to fail." I'm surprised the tea party goons dispatched to shout down town hall forums on health care wern't showing up at your car dealers, megaphones in hand.
But there’s another reason, less spoken of, for why some people get so incensed over little old Cash for Clunkers: it helps average people, and it’s easily understood. The only lack of comprehension empowered here is your predictable excuses, accusations, and unproven prophicies.
The real irony is that this is a small scale reversal of trickle down economics..and so many people like yourself are up in arms and scared this program and others down the road invested by the recovery act monies will point us in the right direction towards the long road to recovery.
Considering all the scandals over the last few years...from Enron to the most recent financial breakdown. This program is actually refreshing, when cast against all the money given to these financial firms by the Bush Adm, funds unaccounted for in the rebuilding of Iraq...and so on and so on.
Yet, when a tiny fraction of stimulus amount went to strapped consumers this summer for their revival, The Bama Bashers on their pedestal, calling Cash for Clunkers “crackpot economics.”

 

[diesel96]

Well said Diesel !
They don't understand with one single healthcard for everyone, and almost no paperwork. It's more efficient and cheaper.
And why do you think our same drugs you get there are 50% cheaper here ? It's because our government buys it bulk and has contracts with providers. That no independent pharmacy, even Walmart could NOT compete with.
I can only wish some of you will visit Canada, and fall ill, then you'll truley see how our system works, and it's great !
You'll be amazed how modern our clinics are.. inside and out.

This is our childrens hospital. Looks like a fancy shopping mall, but it's a hospital !

YouTube - Looking Back: 2006 Stollery Radiothon

Don't want to steer this thread off course on Healthcare, but I'm sure Klein you'll be interested on following this clear thinking NY Congressman and his push for the very least, a public option. But he really believes in single payer as do you...check him out..http://weiner.house.gov/default.aspx

click on some Weiner tv videos...

 

[av8torntn]

Is there some reason we don't want to 'jump start' the American economy?

I would love for you to get on board with a plan to jump start the American economy. Let's start by reducing regulation and taxes two things that have driven jobs out of the country.

It would seem that bringing the patient back to life (American manufacturing) would be the first order of business. After it's alive, then we can start to treat the causes.

Once the plants are closed and assets are sold off, it is difficult to begin the manufacturing process from scratch.

This is a ridiculous argument. Things do not disappear just because they are sold.

Why do so many of you hate America? Why are you not fully behind the measures your elected leaders have deemed necessary?

This is an interesting question. One that I have used myself in the past. I use it just to see what type of response I get. You on the other hand follow it up with the implication that you must blindly follow the elected leaders to be American. I have to say that is just stupid. To me America is defined by it's Constitution not by it's elected leaders. Our Constitution limits government and guarantees certain individual rights. So in my view those such as yourself that that believe we should blindly follow an elected leader while he ignores the Constitution are the ones that actually hate America , which is your right.

Would you feel better if we had another unnecessary war to keep the economy afloat?

Well I do not feel like it should be the responsibility of the Government to keep the economy afloat. I believe if we had a free market the economy would be just fine without any government intervention. You on the other hand believe that the government should babysit you and the economy. Well I would say there is one almost certain way for the government to boost the economy and that is by war.

 

[brett636]

This is old fashioned stimulus of a sort that Republicans like yourself have always advocated in the past, using financial incentives to change behavior.

Where do you get this from? I support allowing the behavior of the free market to dictate to the powers that be on what direction this country should take. Its no coincidence that soon after the government purchases two car companies it creates a program to artificially increase car sales. This program is corporate welfare, do you support corporate welfare?

 

[moreluck]

There was a dealer on the news this A.M. He has only been paid for 6 deals out of 161 deals....what's the hold up ??? Did Charlie Rangel need the $$$$ to pay his taxes ????

 

[brett636]

Imagine the super-efficient giants like Aetna, Cigna or MetLife were running the Clunkers program, they probably wouldn’t get all bent out of shape about a few paperwork snafus, now would they? The money would just go flying out the door, with no worries about technicalities. If it turned out that a bunch of those rebate applications were fraudulent or bogus, the money paid to the swindlers would just get tacked onto next year’s premiums

and nobody would complain. Right?
If the gov't ran a healthcare plan that offered discounts, worked through existing providers, minimized the paperwork and paid every legitimate claim, would that be considered a failure? I guess it would depend on our expectations, which seem to be higher on government than on a private sector that routinely delays and denies payments to consumers—and that goes without any controversy whatsoever.



Sham-wow Vince...."linguini, fettuccini, martini, bikini.....get your slap chop

There are 69 pages of paperwork to fill out per clunker thats traded in. That is 69 pages of paperwork for a car trade-in program. How can you call that efficient?

 

[diesel96]

Where do you get this from? I support allowing the behavior of the free market to dictate to the powers that be on what direction this country should take. Its no coincidence that soon after the government purchases two car companies it creates a program to artificially increase car sales. This program is corporate welfare, do you support corporate welfare?

I do NOT support Corp Welfare under normal circumstances . But my blind faith in an unregulated free mrkt atmostphere is not my idea of piloting solo the direction of the country. (analogy)The free market needs a Co-Pilot, a safety net, a check and balancer, in case the lead Independent Pilot has a heart attack. And thats exactly what happen to our aircraft. The co-pilot needed to take over temperarily to land the aircraft safetly at all cost and aviod catastrophy. What's wrong with insuring the next independent lead pilot stays healthy, limits smoking, drinking and fatty foods to aviod another hiccup later on.

There are 69 pages of paperwork to fill out per clunker thats traded in. That is 69 pages of paperwork for a car trade-in program. How can you call that efficient?

Oh please, cry me a river.....so these Dealerships have to worker a little harder because this Gov't program packed consumers in their showroom....Consider it their peek season.....

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

69 pages per deal? Why couldn't it all be done electronically?

 

[Babagounj]

I see dealers lots full of cars, sold cars. Until the feds send the money they will sit there. So how is this helping the economy if all these sales were just on paper ? And what about those persons who traded in their older cars, but have not been given the new car yet, how are they getting around ?