Economic recovery package before Congress"would provide massive fiscal stimulus."

[wkmac]

Ah come on Jones, she's making headway in realizing gov't really doesn't work so cut her some slack. I mean you have to crawl before you walk. When reality of gov't sets in, then we'll work on her about searching for facts and where to find them!



If I remember correct, at the time I think it was 60 Minutes who did a story on this and they pointed out that the property was disposed of at auction. The funny part was watching some of the, let me see how do I put this, ah non-attached property items that were sold individually. The auctioneer would stumble for words and of course everyone would then laugh and he finally gave in and just said, "what'll you give for this!"



BTW: The Mustang Ranch is back as of a USA Today piece in August 2007'. It also gives a bit of history of the Mustang Ranch and you might want to send that urban legends link to USA Today because in the article nearly 2 years ago, they pretty much said the same thing as Moreluck did.

By 1990, the IRS had seized the ranch, putting the federal government in the unique position of running a brothel.
The government failed and the ranch was padlocked for the first time. The IRS auctioned off beds, the bidets -- even the room numbers -- to recover some of Conforte's tax debt.
The brothel was sold for $1.49 million to a shell company overseen by Conforte and his attorney, Peter Perry. Conforte returned briefly to run the ranch, then fled to Brazil in 1991.
The IRS got its final say in 1997 when it filed a $16 million tax lien, followed in July 1999 by indictments of Conforte and principals in his shell company on charges including racketeering and money laundering. Millions of dollars allegedly were wired to Conforte in Brazil.
Four years later, the brothel's new owner, the federal Bureau of Land Management, put the brothel up for grabs on eBay.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/topstories/2007-08-11-398857697_x.htm

If it's any consolation to Moreluck, she's saying nothing that major national new media outlets themselves aren't saying even nearly 20 years later. I think where the humor of this gets into the way of the truth is that typically the IRS by law does try and keep a business going when it has been seized because the idea first is to get the money owed but also they don't won't to compound the situation by putting people out of work. The cost for example of the lost tax revenue from displaced workers may outweigh the gains from the back taxes, that kinda thing. Even your urban legends link admits the plan was to continue the operation which complies with IRS regs. but it did become such a joke a judge intervened to say in this situation the benefits to the gov't would be best served by shutting the doors. No amount of money is considered with gov't ever looking bad or inept! See TARP and Stimulus plan for proof of that!
We'll spend your money to bury "OUR" Sins and yes this is exactly how I see all this gov't action.

More's point however is factually wrong in that the gov't didn't really fail at running the business and then to conclude this with how can they run the nation is not techinically correct. But I contend the gov't still couldn't run a whorehouse because IMHO Washington DC is nothing but a big whorehouse and do any of us truly believe it's being run in the best interest of the citizens no matter which side of the political isle we sit?

In that sense, IMO More's point has some validity to it after all!

JMO

UH OH! We kinda, maybe disagreed again. This relationship may be in trouble. Should we seek counseling? A second honeymoon cruise? Romantic dinner and wine?


Always leave em with a laugh!

 

[wkmac]

I haven't read all 79 posts in this thread and maybe some one has already mentioned it but I will mention it any way.......

I think we (US citizens) are in for a big surprise when this bill passes.

"Why?", you ask. Because it is not uncommon for our trusted senators and representative to attach other bills to the end of bills like this and "sliding" them through to be approved. How many of the voting senators and representatives do you think read all 1000 pages of this stimulus bill?

I've been told a bill got tacked on to the end allowing our medical records to be public information and accessible on the internet.

I do know that one of the states that allows triple trailers had that language tacked on to the end of some obscure bill and then slid it through knowing the voting partys probably won't read the entire language. I just guessing but the company probably whispered in the ear of the author of the triples bill and made him an offer he couldn't refuse.

Excellent point Trick! The devil is always in the details and I've heard the same thing about the medical records too. May be time to hit Google and see what's really up with this.

 

[wkmac]

Here you go Trick!

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601039&refer=columnist_mccaughey&sid=aLzfDxfbwhzs

http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=87322

BTW: This is not a new idea by any stretch. Newt Gingrich was on record in 2005' advocating for this.

http://www.medicalinformaticsinsider.com/2005/11/15/newt-gingrich-argues-for-universally-computerized-medical-record/

And Newt had an ally that might surprise a number of you.

http://fora.tv/2005/07/21/Bipartisan_Health_Care_Reform_with_Hillary_Clinton_and_Newt_Gingrich#chapter_02

For some of you I hope this opens some eyes as that often all is not as it seems when it comes to Washington DC!

 

[wkmac]

Did you ever once entertain the idea for example if there were no legal tender laws and that individual citizens or even communities could establish means of commerce transactions among themselves? Yeah, it's radical but it sure would be hard if not impossible to create nationwide economic bubbles and clearly not ones of global proportion.

And speaking of the radical idea of what some might call private money consider this somewhat humorous dialogue or Q&A that discusses the idea of State Money verse Private Money


http://www.lewrockwell.com/north/north687.html

From 2003', a voice ignored then that many now understand had he been listened too, may have avoided the 2008' economic collaspe and the nightmare that is to come.

http://www.fame.org/HTM/Ron%20Paul%20Introduces%20HR2779%20The%20Honest%20Money%20Act%20-%20REPEAL%20OF%20LEGAL%20TENDER%20LAWS.htm

And what was this nutjob saying before the Congress in 2003' when EVERYONE ELSE laughed and said "let the goodtimes roll"?

http://www.lewrockwell.com/paul/paul128.html

Tooner said in another post that people aren't smart enough. That may be true for most but if you have the courage to read and look deep for the facts and face reality, this doesn't have to be true. And BTW Tooner I disagree with your point although looking at the mess we're in, it sure seems to validate itself. Your attitude IMO comes across literally sevile to the master State and one that in the end cowers to authoriterianism and despotism. The State had the truth before them years ago and yet they blindly proceeded down a disasterous path anyway. If I can't trust them on the little things that are open to public eyes, how can I then trust them on things not open to public eyes.

Gov't is like children IMO. You dare not allow them to run willy nilly but it's the little things from them that gain your trust to where you allow them outside your eyes to explore the larger world. If they can't earn your trust on the little things you see, how can you honestly trust them on things you can't!

 

[Jagger]

Paul Bagala Proposes That Republicans Should Refuse Stimulus Money

​

If Republican politicians are so deeply opposed to President Obama's economic recovery plan, they should refuse to take the money. After all, if you think all that federal spending is damaging, there are easy ways to reduce it: Don't take federal money.

--Paul Bagala​

http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/02/16/begala.carolina/index.html

 

[drewed]

So Chrysler is asking for another 5 billion or it will close its doors and even if it does its going to cut 3000 jobs....Their plans are due out in the next week on how theyre going to return to profitability, there hasnt been a auto csar yet but depending greatly on what theyre willing to do, I dont think they should get the money.

 

[diesel96]

Watched Obama there talking about Lincoln. I mean unlike the puppet of the last eight years he can put a sentence together. He's eloquent, he's unflappable, cool and calm.
Do you think he's going to solve this economic problem? Well, he can't personally solve anything. I mean, he needs a partner in the American people. So far people approve 60%-40% in favor of.
Can we call it upon ourselves to do what we need to do to dig ourselves out of this mess, because there really isn't a shovel big enough?
I mean this is a mess, and I don't think they're telling us really how bad it is. I think that's why [Treasury Secretary Timothy] Geithner was so vague the other day when he presented his plan, because I think he just didn't want to say it's even worse, because I think there would be more of a panic than there is.
Heck, most economists don't think that this stimulus plan, as it's passed, is nearly big enough.
Yes, people and politicians disagree. Scientists don't disagree on evolution. There's a consensus among scientists, just as there's a consensus really among economists now that the government has to spend a lot of money. Idealologists are definetly not scientist.
Obama, going around the country, that's what he needs to do -- put pressure on this Obstructionist Party, where there are very few moderates. They just don't get it, that we have moved on from their old ways....
You know, the people, are on Barack's page. And, you know, I think we need one more election to get rid of some of these mossbacks who just don't get it. I mean they're taking their marching orders from Limbaugh and other talking heads. Effectively the head of the Republican Party right now.
He's the one who said I'm rooting for Obama to fail. So if you're rooting for the American president to fail, you might be with the terrorists. (sound familiar) Remember, they said he was with the terrorists and palling around with terrorists.
Yes, I would say that's probably what Osama bin Laden is rooting for -- Obama to fail.
So I'm just saying Rush followers and [Osama] are on the same page

 

[drewed]

I dont know, I think some parts are worse then we know and some parts are better.....Used car sells are up, so people are getting credit extended and are out buying stuff but there are still a lot of forclosures out there and up coming.....I think Obama thought it was a smaller issue then it actually is.

 

[Sammie]

Watched Obama there talking about Lincoln. I mean unlike the puppet of the last eight years he can put a sentence together. He's eloquent, he's unflappable, cool and calm.
Do you think he's going to solve this economic problem? Well, he can't personally solve anything. I mean, he needs a partner in the American people. So far people approve 60%-40% in favor of.
Can we call it upon ourselves to do what we need to do to dig ourselves out of this mess, because there really isn't a shovel big enough?
I mean this is a mess, and I don't think they're telling us really how bad it is.

Too early to tell. And everybody is expecting the worst. What startled me is that $1 trillion will supposedly save only 3 - 4 million jobs. Personally, I'd like to see the two party system give each other a break but that will never happen. It's getting absurd. This is what the Dems wanted and if it fails, they'll be hung out to dry. And the Republicans don't want to be the bad guys either, as they will also be heaped with blame if it doesn't work because they supposedly blocked what the Dems wanted to accomplish, despite the Dems now dominating the 3 seats of power...

Anybody heard about a back up plan?

 

[Sammie]

Public Service Announcement:

Due to the recent economic crises, stock market crash, budget cuts, rising unemployment, unstable world conditions, the cost of insurance, electricity, petroleum, and taxes of all kinds, we regret to advise you that the 'Light at the End of the Tunnel' has been turned off.

We apologize for the inconvenience.

 

[av8torntn]

Watched Obama there talking about Lincoln. I mean unlike the puppet of the last eight years he can put a sentence together. He's eloquent, he's unflappable, cool and calm.

Wow I hate that I missed that. I saw the president speak today when he signed this massive spending bill. He is such a horrible speaker all I could think was could they not enroll this guy in a local community college for a night public speaking class. He cannot string three words together without an uh or a hard pause because he forget the script. I am pretty sure he has the time since he has already been on vacation after a month on the job. Wait that is untrue I came up with a great idea for a place to eat. I could make plates as an exact replica of his ears. If you could finish all the food on the plate your meal would be free. I think his ear goes from the top of his head to below his chin. I am waiting for him to start flapping them and fly away. This guy may not be very smart but he sure is funny to look at.

 

[av8torntn]

Interesting interview with an economist.

http://business.theatlantic.com/2009/02/an_interview_with_robert_barro.php

 

[trplnkl]

That was an interesting interview. Much of what they were talking about is like Greek to me, but I'm just a truck driver.

I have to disagree with you though about O's speaking abilities. I think he is a very good speaker overall. However, that is nothing more than being able to regurgitate words. The problem I have is my ability to believe the words. When he does the stammering thing, I think he is trying to make sure he doesn't say the things that are really rushing through his head.

 

[1989]

Watched Obama there talking about Lincoln. I mean unlike the puppet of the last eight years he can put a sentence together. He's eloquent, he's unflappable, cool and calm.
Do you think he's going to solve this economic problem? Well, he can't personally solve anything. I mean, he needs a partner in the American people. So far people approve 60%-40% in favor of.
Can we call it upon ourselves to do what we need to do to dig ourselves out of this mess, because there really isn't a shovel big enough?
I mean this is a mess, and I don't think they're telling us really how bad it is. I think that's why [Treasury Secretary Timothy] Geithner was so vague the other day when he presented his plan, because I think he just didn't want to say it's even worse, because I think there would be more of a panic than there is.
Heck, most economists don't think that this stimulus plan, as it's passed, is nearly big enough.
Yes, people and politicians disagree. Scientists don't disagree on evolution. There's a consensus among scientists, just as there's a consensus really among economists now that the government has to spend a lot of money. Idealologists are definetly not scientist.
Obama, going around the country, that's what he needs to do -- put pressure on this Obstructionist Party, where there are very few moderates. They just don't get it, that we have moved on from their old ways....
You know, the people, are on Barack's page. And, you know, I think we need one more election to get rid of some of these mossbacks who just don't get it. I mean they're taking their marching orders from Limbaugh and other talking heads. Effectively the head of the Republican Party right now.
He's the one who said I'm rooting for Obama to fail. So if you're rooting for the American president to fail, you might be with the terrorists. (sound familiar) Remember, they said he was with the terrorists and palling around with terrorists.
Yes, I would say that's probably what Osama bin Laden is rooting for -- Obama to fail.
So I'm just saying Rush followers and [Osama] are on the same page

A smart man that does stupid things. Makes me ask myself if he is really smart after all.

 

[Jagger]

When it was first realized the nation was facing an economic crisis, the media had an opportunity to stage a serious, substantive debate about economic policy,However, with economists accounting for a mere 5 percent of guest appearances during discussions of the recovery package, that debate more closely resembled a political side show.

--Erica Knuti

Media Matters - Substantive Policy Takes Back Seat to Raw Politics​

What was the most ridiculous lie the media spread about the Economic Recovery Act? My vote is for the lie about money going to protect the mouse.

 

[moreluck]

Nobody read the 1400 pages before signing it.....oh wait !! That's the truth.

 

[Jagger]

FAILING TO FEATURE ECONOMISTS DURING RECOVERY DEBATE
​

A Media Matters study of Sunday talk shows and cable news programs from January 25 through February 8 found that economists made up only 25 guest appearances out of 460 - only 5 percent - during the 139 ½ hours of programming in which the recovery package was discussed.

Media Matters - Lack of demand: Cable channels, Sunday shows leave economists on the sidelines in recovery debate

 

[chev]

Paul Bagala Proposes That Republicans Should Refuse Stimulus Money
​

If Republican politicians are so deeply opposed to President Obama's economic recovery plan, they should refuse to take the money. After all, if you think all that federal spending is damaging, there are easy ways to reduce it: Don't take federal money.

--Paul Bagala​

That's a damned good idea. That way the states won't be on the hook with strings attached. Let the economy recover the way it was designed to do. Instead we will allow that doom and gloom boob of a president destroy our children's future by taxing the piss out of them. But that is nothing new for an "I got mine" society.

Watched Obama there talking about Lincoln. I mean unlike the puppet of the last eight years he can put a sentence together. He's eloquent, he's unflappable, cool and calm.

Teleprompters tend to have that effect.

Again we were lied to about transparency. Where were the 5 days we were promised to read the "anal rape" bill? Another lie of many to come.
Hope you sheep are happy. By the time Chairman MaObama is done with you, you wont have enough wool to cover your ass.

 

[av8torntn]

What was the most ridiculous lie the media spread about the Economic Recovery Act? .

Well they keep calling it an economic recovery act. That is absurd.

 

[Jones]

A smart man that does stupid things. Makes me ask myself if he is really smart after all.

Don't take this as an endorsement of the current administration, but if you think Obama is stupid you really need to get a grip. He's living in a big white house on Pennsylvania avenue, while you and I are driving trucks for a living. Think about it.