Feeder Work Question

[gandydancer]

You have to give the customers more credit for understanding the logistics games then you have here.

He has figured out that he can use UPS freight to skip zones and save money .

We can not make him use UPS ground drivers at a higher premium.

He could also decide to use a non-union freight carrier to drop ship into other zones or other carriers. At least he is using our freight guys and our ground network in those zones to sort and deliver those packages.

Dunno what makes you think "zone skip" is some sort of rocket science that I don't grasp. UPS can price its services any way it wants. Specifically, it can offer runs by UPS feeder drivers in an equvalent-to "zone skipping" price contract at the same price as UPS Freight runs, if it wants to. No, it won't make as much money as it can with cheaper drivers, and at the margin there are some accounts where at the price it can get the business it will lose a little money using Feeder and make a little money using Freight, but that's an argument for giving EVERY kind of freight run to Freight, or owner-operators, and shutting down the in-house feeder operation. Or for cutting people out of the interior operation, say, in reverse order of their wages (counter-seniority) since THAT would be cheaper for the company, and it could afford to bid lower. Etc. One point of a union is to restrict management from doing things that lower its costs at the expense of its workforce, in this case subcontracting at the expense of feeder drivers.

 

[705red]

In this case the customer did dictate that his packages would move by freight and he therefore did dictate that the freight manager would be scheduling his work. Concepts like zone skip are taught in every business school in the country. The international needs to start sending some of you folks to business school so you actually understand what is going on in the real world.

call bs! If he is using ups small package you dam straight we can make him use small package feeder drivers. Who schedules the pick up? Do you expect us to believe that he ships boxes through ups but schedules freight to pick it up.

Interesting answer Red. So customer ABC says he is going to skip zones and use ups freight to do so. And we tell him what? No? Do it the way we tell you or go somewhere else? Not a very smart answer.

You are purposely diverting our work to freight! We dont have feeder drivers solo or sleeper teams that can move that work?

If this customer wants to use ups freight to move his packages have him strap each package down on a skid and pallet jack it onto several hundred freight trailers.

These are small packages and should be moved by ups not freight, and if your local allows this than you need to vote their sorry rear ends out.

Now tie before you say that we have to make money i will agree, but when i have fellow workers laid off and our work is being diverted i say shut ups down! Strike them for it!

 

[RockyRogue]

when i have fellow workers laid off and our work is being diverted i say shut ups down! Strike them for it!

Way wrong answer in this economy, Red. -Rocky

 

[705red]

What would be your answer rock? People are laid off, might not have medical benefits for their family, not making their regular wage and their job is being bid out to cheaper labor labor, what would someone of you experience with 2 6 month stints working ptime do? Now think about it through a husband/fathers eyes not some kid thats going through college still trying to find himself!

 

[RockyRogue]

What would be your answer rock? People are laid off, might not have medical benefits for their family, not making their regular wage and their job is being bid out to cheaper labor labor, what would someone of you experience with 2 6 month stints working ptime do? Now think about it through a husband/fathers eyes not some kid thats going through college still trying to find himself!

I never said it was right, Red. I DID say I thought talking strike was a bad idea in this economy. If you go out on strike, how many more of your union brothers and sisters will be out of a job, potentially permanently? Think carefully before you talk strike. I have nothing but the highest respect for those automotive workers that staged those sitdown strikes in the 30's and 40's. What you're talking about might put a quarter million people out of work. That's unconscionable. -Rocky

 

[cachsux]

Think carefully before you talk strike. I have nothing but the highest respect for those automotive workers that staged those sitdown strikes in the 30's and 40's. -Rocky

Of course back then you would have Jitterbugged your way across their line. Or was it the Can-Can? I not 100% sure on the dances of the era.

 

[av8torntn]

Update for those of you interested. I have been trying to get one of my customers to stop using DHL all year. Monday they told me they were finally done with the DHL thing and my two trailers would be at least four. I told supervision and they asked me to find out what they needed. The customer told me what times they would like their additional pulls and I relayed the info. I show up today to make my first pull. My first trailer with about 1500 packages on it turned into a trailer with 125 packages. I was shocked and asked what happened. They told me that our sales rep came out and told them they needed to start putting these packages on UPSF trailers. I started out thinking by next week we could get one route back to worry that now I have lost enough pickups on my route for it to be cut as well. Why is a UPS sales rep trying to get our customers to not use UPS? Anyhow my three largest pickups can now be picked up in a package car. Things are not looking good here.

 

[705red]

Might as well start pushing for our customers to use fedex, you have my word that i will not turn in another sales lead until this gets handled properly.

 

[gandydancer]

Of course back then you would have Jitterbugged your way across their line. Or was it the Can-Can? I not 100% sure on the dances of the era.

Can-Can is Gay 90's French stage show. Jitterbug is 40's American partner dancing.

 

[tieguy]

Might as well start pushing for our customers to use fedex, you have my word that i will not turn in another sales lead until this gets handled properly.

Might as well tell them to use fdx instead of UPS Freight?

How many sales leads have you submitted in the last year Red?

Av8 there has to be a logical explanation. Anyone else you can talk to like your dispatch manager. If its going freight then there has to be a freight need or reason.

 

[trickpony1]

Might as well tell them to use fdx instead of UPS Freight?

How many sales leads have you submitted in the last year Red?

Av8 there has to be a logical explanation. Anyone else you can talk to like your dispatch manager. If its going freight then there has to be a freight need or reason.

.....or it's cheaper for the comapny to run the freight by USPS or;
the company doesn't want the hassle of training and putting on more feeder runs or;
the company is trying to eventually get rid of the feeder department and use UPSF exclusively.

 

[av8torntn]

Av8 there has to be a logical explanation. Anyone else you can talk to like your dispatch manager. If its going freight then there has to be a freight need or reason.

OK I'm not trying to be difficult here and I am grateful for yours and everyone elses responses. I posted before the answer my supervision gave me. I left out what the dispatch manager said to avoid any drama on here. Look since you asked, the dispatch manager told me that he did not care if we all sat at home. He is know for his attitude problem with all drivers. My supervision blamed IE which is their standard answer for a unpopular policy change.

After reading your posts it seems to me that you are saying that if UPS can get a customer to say they want a lower rate then they can subcontract out the work however they see fit. Am I correct in what you are saying the view of UPS is?

On a lighter note you should see the technology UPS is installing in these warehouses to do this. It is very impressive.

 

[av8torntn]

Might as well start pushing for our customers to use fedex, you have my word that i will not turn in another sales lead until this gets handled properly.

It's not like I submitted a lead. I did all the work myself. I was relentless for almost a year. In the end I caused the loss of at least one job at UPS.

 

[over9five]

In the end I caused the loss of at least one job at UPS.

Now that's a scary story, Av8. I'd make sure everyone hears it.

 

[av8torntn]

Av8 there has to be a logical explanation. Anyone else you can talk to like your dispatch manager. If its going freight then there has to be a freight need or reason.

Ok now they are blaming UPS supply chain solutions. If we were not losing jobs out of this the system they are putting in place would be impressive. I earlier watched the packages come down the line and they have a monitor tell the guy which skid to put it on. The system can tell if there is not going to be enough packages to bypass the UPS feeder network and they stage it for our trailer. So it looks to me that if this becomes widely used we will lose feeder jobs, and hub jobs. So today it looks like I will only have about six hours of work. Last month I was getting about ten hours a day.

 

[tieguy]

After reading your posts it seems to me that you are saying that if UPS can get a customer to say they want a lower rate then they can subcontract out the work however they see fit. Am I correct in what you are saying the view of UPS is?

On a lighter note you should see the technology UPS is installing in these warehouses to do this. It is very impressive.

I'm sorry to hear your management team can't give you better answers.

Our concept behind logistics is to capture the entire shipping process if the customers want that. In some cases we warehouse,take the orders, pack it, ship it , move it, sort it and deliver it.

It depends on what the customer wants from us. In this case it sounds like they have asked for help in either designing their warehouse or in actually warehousing their merchandise for them.

We negotiate with them and offer them a a portfolio of different services they can choose from.

If they say they need a warehouse design service to optomize their systems then we want to be able to offer that service. We have logistics groups who do just that.

If they say they need a freight service same thing.

Ultimately we want them to move their freight by our freight company and their small packages through our small package system.

the bottom line is they will decide what they need and we either give it to them or they talk to the others guys.

Customer makes the final decision on how his mercandise moves.

 

[tieguy]

Ok now they are blaming UPS supply chain solutions. If we were not losing jobs out of this the system they are putting in place would be impressive. I earlier watched the packages come down the line and they have a monitor tell the guy which skid to put it on. The system can tell if there is not going to be enough packages to bypass the UPS feeder network and they stage it for our trailer. So it looks to me that if this becomes widely used we will lose feeder jobs, and hub jobs. So today it looks like I will only have about six hours of work. Last month I was getting about ten hours a day.

Couple of questions I would ask. Is the new system fully operational.

What kind of merchandise do they ship and how do they ship it. Is it bulk going to stores or outlets. Or all individual orders going to private addresses. Is there a need to ship it freight to reduce handles?

 

[705red]

Since this thread was started i have made phone calls to stewards at every building here in the chicago area. Cach is on the look out as is many of our buildings that have extra sorts. Good luck to you in your fight to stop our work from being sub contracted.

 

[av8torntn]

Couple of questions I would ask. Is the new system fully operational.

What kind of merchandise do they ship and how do they ship it. Is it bulk going to stores or outlets. Or all individual orders going to private addresses. Is there a need to ship it freight to reduce handles?

1) I am not sure. It does look fully operational but there have been tech types there making sure it works. Now we are becoming just like FedEx where the customer has to put packages on multiple trailers. Makes me look like a complete idiot when I got them to switch by telling them they could just put everything on one trailer. They were having a problem mixing the priority with the ground for fedex and getting way to many complaints. Then throw in the DHL guy always asleep in their break room with me constantly in their ear telling them we could do better.

2) Small packages like curling irons. Now this has spread to four customers on my route alone in just one month. I had a famous film and camera company, and a computer company also.

3) Both

4) Obvisiously from the UPS point of view. Again we have customers that build loads to other hubs and our drivers pick them up and take them the probem I have now is having drivers being laid off and runs cut just so UPSF can get some work.

 

[IDoLessWorkThanMost]

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I wonder if like Tie said, the UPSF services were too good to pass up tailored to their business situation and needs.