From a VP job to flipping burgers and handing out free samples: Here's a cautionary tale of what can

Discussion in 'UPS Retirement Topics' started by Returntosender, Jan 3, 2014.

  1. Returntosender

    Returntosender Well-Known Member

    It seems like another life. At the height of his corporate career, Tom Palome was pulling in a salary in the low six-figures and flying first class on business trips to Europe.

    Today, the 77-year-old former vice president of marketing for Oral-B juggles two part-time jobs: one as a $10-an-hour food demonstrator at Sam’s Club, the other flipping burgers and serving drinks at a golf club grill for slightly more than minimum wage.
  2. brownmonster

    brownmonster Man of Great Wisdom

    Simple solution. Quit shopping.
  3. Monkey Butt

    Monkey Butt You can call me Chappy Staff Member

    He only had $90,000 prior to 2008 downturn.
    That is 1/3 his annual salary versus having 20 times his annual salary.
    Makes one wonder how good a VP he was?
  4. cosmo1

    cosmo1 Just another internet hooligan.

    Considering that most golf clubs provide free golf to employees, not a bad gig.
  5. bmwmc

    bmwmc Active Member

    My issue with all this retirement scare is how expectations are being sold to these people. 10x or 20x annual income saved? I mean com-on-man. What kind of lifestyle do you think your going to have in your late 50s-60s-70s and what are you spending money on?

    There's are three old saying on Wall St. "There a sucker born every day" "trust us" and "young people are inflationary and old people are deflationary."

    Add up all you current cost of upkeep like rent food cable electricity, entertainment, travel, etc. I bet the average in between $2500 and $3000 a month. For most people SS will pay about half that so you'll need about $1500 a month to cover the rest. That's about $360,000 spent over 20 years. That's assuming you sold your house and rent (for mobility).

    So let say you sold your home and got half back on equity of around $150,000 so now you down to needing $210,000. Certainly not the 1 million to 2 million Wall St. would love to get there hands on. Wall St. and the financial industry lives to steal the product of your labor.

    Lets not forget living outside the US for even cheaper retirement options. As for healthcare? Well, when the wheels come off the bus, they come off the bus. Better to put that money into a burial package than trying to squeeze out a few more months or years and have doctors, hospitals, banks and lawyers take what little you can leave behind to your children. Life's short so forget worrying about money and worry more about running out of time to live. People you need dreams and ambitions more than money.

    I read a story once of a women in her 60s taking a motorcycle camping out along the way to Peru so she could see Machu Picchu then rode back to Scottsdale. She said the whole trip cost less than $500. I've heard of people working on Cruise liners just to get free passage to a destinations. If you can dream it you can do it period.
  6. justcrankn

    justcrankn New Member

    The article implies that he was going to retire on $90K which was then wiped out with bad investments. This is obviously only part of his story.

    Retiring with 20X salary/wages sounds about right. Your pension should be factored into that if you think it will remain solvent.
  7. bmwmc

    bmwmc Active Member

    You see this is the problem with this kind of math and assumption. Lets look at a hypothetical young person who has just completed college or trade school, establishes themselves (if there lucky) in a career path job, and starts contributing to a retirement account like a 401K (cause that's all there is now) at age 25;

    They earn $35,000. To save 20x ($700,000) of there income they would have to set aside $23,333 per year for 30 years to retire at 55. That's 66% of there income. Impossible. They would have to live on less than a thousand dollars a month for 30 years.
    Even if you add 10 more years its still over 1/2 there income. All adjustment like inflation and wage growth wash due to higher rates of needed contributions. This is why this whole retirement scare does more harm than good. Its better to save purchasing power via investment instruments central banks can't devalue (like gold) and invest in yourself by learning skills and trades that supplement income and add meaning to your life. I don't think of retirement where I will just do nothing I think of it as a lifestyle change. Its not work or not to work its life as a career.
  8. justcrankn

    justcrankn New Member

    I"m sorry you won't ever be able to retire. I will be retiring shortly. To me retirement means I won't have to work again. If I have to work again, it's only semi-retirement.

    Your calculations assume a ROI of ZERO. No wonder you'll never be able to retire.
  9. UpstateNYUPSer

    UpstateNYUPSer Very proud grandfather.

    His calculations claim that any wage increases and/or inflation are offset by the need for increased contributions. One of the first tips to building your 401k balance is to increase your contribution rate every time you get a pay raise.

    My retirement plans do not have any provisions where I have to work.
  10. pretender

    pretender Active Member

    That just goes to show that just because you are a VP, it doesn't mean you are good at managing money. Years ago, my wife used to work with a woman whose husband was a VP with a different company--She drove a Mercedes, but never had lunch money. They always lived on the edge. Over the years, he has held high positions with various companies, most recently a CFO! They "own" two homes, a yacht, fancy cars, and are on the verge of bankruptcy. She could not believe it when my wife told her that I retired at age 57 (with a 13 year old car).
  11. bmwmc

    bmwmc Active Member



    Again you not recognizing the scale of inputs to achieve the desired outputs. UPS worker and managers live on a small pension island. My calculations are for those that have no company sponsored pensions. Lastly, "work" is a subjective definitions.


    Again "work" is a subjective definition. I won't ever stop working not because I can't but because I don't want to. I might teach ESL (English as a Second Language) in an impoverished nation or in one of the emerging market economies. Or, start my own charitable organization bringing schools and economic resources to the developing world. Or, maybe become and expert in pottery making. Who knows? The idea is I'm just going to jerk off three times a day, and fish out local river and stream, or to live an ostentatious life surrounding myself with shinny trinkets to satisfy my own lazy self-centered attitude and perspective of the world which is not my definition of retirement.
  12. Benben

    Benben Active Member

    bmwmc, you state "work is a subjective definition."

    I purpose to you this question; If you are doing what you love or truly enjoy is it really work? Isn't retirement actually just a time in which you can now do what you want when you want IF you had planned appropriately?

    BTW, your financial example is horrible to say the least! You completely ignore the power of compounding and time value of money.

    pss. Get the hell off the gold! Your ignorance may actually harm someone reading this thread! The market gave +25% for 2013. Gold dropped over 28% USD in 2013 ( Your gold "suggestion" would have cost someone well over 50% of their investment.
  13. pretender

    pretender Active Member

    “Compound interest is the eighth wonder of the world. He who understands it, earns it ... he who doesn't ... pays it.”

    Albert Einstein
  14. oldngray

    oldngray nowhere special

    You have a 13 year old car? :yawn2: I splurged and mine is only 11.
  15. pretender

    pretender Active Member

    There you go, living beyond your means! :wink2:
  16. justcrankn

    justcrankn New Member

    Wow! You're going to jerk off 3X/day with shinny trinkets. To each his own.
  17. Monkey Butt

    Monkey Butt You can call me Chappy Staff Member

    While I agree with this quote 100% ...
    There is no actual evidence that Einstein ever said this and it did not appear in print or documented otherwise until 23 years after his death.

    With that said, I use a similar phrase and attribute it to Einstein as well.
  18. anonymous6

    anonymous6 Guest

    americans are the worst savers in the world so this is a scare story to wake people up. some kind of insane statistic is that 90% of people ready to retire have less than 10 thousand saved and are dependent on social security and working to survive until they die.

    pretty sad.
  19. pretender

    pretender Active Member

  20. upschuck

    upschuck Well-Known Member

    My mom lives on her SS only, has a lot of money stashed away, but does not want to use it. Grew up just post depression era so parents drilled that into her to live within her means. That was one of the best things parents taught me as a kid.