Watching Supervisors work

[Griff]

Since when do I have authority to change the process to make it more effective. More importantly, when will I be paid for my consulting services? You've made it clear that I shouldn't even file grievances because it's not my job to boss the boss. Now I'm supposed to critique and alter the jobs of frontline management? Make up your mind.

here the union goon now tries to take the position that he can change nothing at work when we all know the real issue was his liberal embellishment in descibing a normal scene of the morning dispatch.
The typical union goon will scream loudly whenever he sees any acts of management dishonesty. At the same time as you see by the quoted post his discription of the morning dispatch was wonderfully dishonest as he liberally embellished on his description. Thus the virus attacks the host.

Come off it, you're just digging your hole deeper. We can't even get our shelves SPA'd out the way we want them and you're sitting here telling me I can change the process of how frontline management operates. I'm all for being held accountable, all I want is fairness and consistency. When I run bonus, nothing is said to me. When I'm overallowed, I am questioned and threatened. I don't bid, so I'm always moving around, my production numbers change like the wind. Same methods, same work ethic, day in and day out. No embellishment is needed, this is fact at UPS and nothing will change it because you look for the worst in your employees. Good thing for me I know my union rights and I rise to the challenge when my performance is questioned and the "BOSS" walks away with his tail between his legs. There I go, bossing the boss again by asking him if he's going to discipline me over it, that damn contract!)!(!)!#)(!#*)(!#*)(!*#)(*!)#(

 

[tieguy]

Tie have you fallen lately? Maybe something fell off a shelf and land on your noggin?

This thread was about supervisors working! You hijacked it into a so-called bossing the boss thread. Now you continue to misread and mis-interput the meanings of my posts and others here.

I suggest you seek some help because im worried for you, you have always had an anti union tone to you but now its a plain hatred and i fear for the safety of other union employees in your presence.

If you do your job as a boss the right way you wont need a union steward to boss the boss now would you?

I think the issue of the contract is a crutch and an excuse to attack management under the pretense of following the contract. In fact the union goon has deep seated emotional issues that causes him to attack the employer the way he does. His attacks are unnatural in the normal employer / employee relationship. Therefore I do think an analysis of how the disgruntled union goon attacks the employer for motives other the the contract is very relevant here in this thread.

 

[tieguy]

Come off it, you're just digging your hole deeper. We can't even get our shelves SPA'd out the way we want them and you're sitting here telling me I can change the process of how frontline management operates. I'm all for being held accountable, all I want is fairness and consistency. When I run bonus, nothing is said to me. When I'm overallowed, I am questioned and threatened. I don't bid, so I'm always moving around, my production numbers change like the wind. Same methods, same work ethic, day in and day out. No embellishment is needed, this is fact at UPS and nothing will change it because you look for the worst in your employees. Good thing for me I know my union rights and I rise to the challenge when my performance is questioned and the "BOSS" walks away with his tail between his legs. There I go, bossing the boss again by asking him if he's going to discipline me over it, that damn contract!)!(!)!#)(!#*)(!#*)(!*#)(*!)#(

Your point you make here highlight my point. The boss kicks your but and makes your earn your money. You resent that so you use the contract as a way to get back at the boss. I respect the fact that you are now coming clean on this critical issue. The part about the boss looking for the worst in you is what you personally spread when you attempt to destroy the morale of your fellow employees. You should not try to use these same words on me for I am immune to your brain washing and have been trained to recognize your brainwashing when it is used. Try to take a positive out of your experience. Even if you are the least best in your center you still work harder then many in the world. Just not hard enough to be one of the best in brown

 

[Griff]

Your point you make here highlight my point. The boss kicks your but and makes your earn your money. You resent that so you use the contract as a way to get back at the boss. I respect the fact that you are now coming clean on this critical issue. The part about the boss looking for the worst in you is what you personally spread when you attempt to destroy the morale of your fellow employees. You should not try to use these same words on me for I am immune to your brain washing and have been trained to recognize your brainwashing when it is used. Try to take a positive out of your experience. Even if you are the least best in your center you still work harder then many in the world. Just not hard enough to be one of the best in brown

You really aren't very bright. The boss doesn't kick my "but" or make me earn my money. You're only as good as the dispatch printout that morning, nothing else is taken into consideration. Do you honestly think a manager grilling me in the morning has any bearing on reducing the paid day? Do you really think I'm going to go out and skip my breaks or run for you? I could careless what he says because I cannot be disciplined based on performance. There isn't a thing him or you can do about it and you know it. Does this mean that I'm going to go out and drag my feet all day just to piss my center manager off, absolutely not, but I guarantee this is the outcome you already have dancing around in your bird-brain.

You want to talk about highlighting points? Everything you say about frontline management highlights my point that you guys are going the way of the dinosaur.

Follow the contract and you won't have any problems, Tieguy. But me and you both know you won't do that, will you? It's an ego thing, I understand, you're the boss and what you say goes.

 

[1989]

Flawed logic. Why should we be hustling sales leads when UPS hikes rates 18% NDA and 6% ground (hovering base rates around $6.20 for ground!).

To pay for your benefits, that's why.

 

[tieguy]

You really aren't very bright. The boss doesn't kick my "but" or make me earn my money. You're only as good as the dispatch printout that morning, nothing else is taken into consideration. Do you honestly think a manager grilling me in the morning has any bearing on reducing the paid day? Do you really think I'm going to go out and skip my breaks or run for you? I could careless what he says because I cannot be disciplined based on performance. There isn't a thing him or you can do about it and you know it. Does this mean that I'm going to go out and drag my feet all day just to piss my center manager off, absolutely not, but I guarantee this is the outcome you already have dancing around in your bird-brain.

You want to talk about highlighting points? Everything you say about frontline management highlights my point that you guys are going the way of the dinosaur.

Follow the contract and you won't have any problems, Tieguy. But me and you both know you won't do that, will you? It's an ego thing, I understand, you're the boss and what you say goes.

And I can see you're still struggling with being poorly thought of by your boss. As you can see your vicious attacks don't have any effect on me. I expect your type of attacks since I do represent another version of the boss that you have been trained to attack. Its strange though how much you folks who have emulated this form of union/company relations still try to deny the tactic. I thought it was pretty much commonly known on both sides of the fence. I don't really think it helps your cause to deny these tactics. Those that are susceptible to be company haters will do so anyway. Those who have no interest in your brand of professional negativism will not succumb to it. So why not be open and honest about it? We all know this about anything but the contract. Its always been a means for you to screw with the company about everything that has ever gone wrong in your life. The contract has always been an excuse.

 

[Mike Hawk]

Tieguy

This whole bossing the boss thing you go on and on about, I don’t understand why you are so upset about it. When management does not abide by the contract they signed, on purpose or out of incompetence, they require someone to "boss" them because they are apparently unable to do so themselves. In the world of Tie, only the bosses real boss should boss the boss, but would the bosses boss grieve the boss for violating the contract?
If (God forbid) a manager under you violated the contract, would you grieve him/her so the union didn’t have to? After all you are his/her boss and you should be the one bossing him/her. But I really doubt any manager has ever filed a grievance on behalf of the union so tell me Tieguy if we don’t "boss the boss" who will?

 

[tieguy]

Tieguy

This whole bossing the boss thing you go on and on about, I don’t understand why you are so upset about it. When management does not abide by the contract they signed, on purpose or out of incompetence, they require someone to "boss" them because they are apparently unable to do so themselves. In the world of Tie, only the bosses real boss should boss the boss, but would the bosses boss grieve the boss for violating the contract?
If (God forbid) a manager under you violated the contract, would you grieve him/her so the union didn’t have to? After all you are his/her boss and you should be the one bossing him/her. But I really doubt any manager has ever filed a grievance on behalf of the union so tell me Tieguy if we don’t "boss the boss" who will?

Mike I'm not upset by it all. in fact I'm trying to comment in a way that shows there is no anger. I'm simply recognizing what goes on and why and pointing it out. To simply state it is about contract enforcement does the process an injustice. Its always been a whole lot more.

 

[tieguy]

See how easy it is to be an arrogant nitwit and cast aspersions on people? I'll never turn in a sales lead, ever. Has nothing to do with not wanting to do someone else's job or anything like that, it's simple math and it doesn't work out in the drivers favor. I know too many people who have gotten robbed by UPS through the sales lead program when it comes to big accounts. It's tantamount to the bonus system, the dice are loaded, thanks but no thanks[unquote]

here is another quote by a teamster goon. Here he starts by bragging on how easy it is to spread misinformation. He then attacks the sales lead program alleging dishonesty with big accounts.All of this is part of the goons program of attacking anything and everything with the company. Again nothing to do with the contract . Everything to do with destroying the host.

 

[1989]

The hardest I've ever worked was when I was a pt sup. One day the ba was on my case for putting about 15-20 packages behind cars at the end of the day. (I was tired of delivering pkgs. for 2-4 hour every morning)So I had a goon follow me at the end of the day. He didn't like that, so then I used 2 goons to follow me. I didn't care about hours, I just wanted the job done right so I could go home.

 

[doctor brown 688]

This thread is hilarious! I think reading Article 21 of the National Master might help you (Tie) get heading in the right direction....................... I am rather new to this board and do more reading than giving my input but couldn't resist being sucked into this one. Before I start I would like to say Tie that I hope you don't feel picked on, because I know it's not your fault for being the way you come accross to people on this board.You must sit in the front row at all the management training schools(A.K.A. old time hate school) I know,I know the company says they don't have these any more,(correct me if I'm wrong) but if I recall that is the correct response to this situation followed by a bashing of the old school managers that are left throughout the company(to make the union person feel you are his ally)and then drove home with some b.s. about working together to change and create a better company for tomorrow......blah,blah,blah. I don't want to assume to know what you are thinking, but what I have read here on this board it "appears" that you think non-management (union) workers will buy all your logical and analizing b.s. like you actually come up with the crap yourself.Hello! It does'nt take a scholar to figure it out,especially when you have more than one manager spouting off the same b.s. in local centers everywhere,it just makes you look silly when you try and pass it off to others on this board as your own,although I think one would have to be naive,might be effective on those who haven't heard it before.Some of your posts have been text book word for word used by management to handle the same situation you were trained for.For example this is a quote from this topic thread from you:

The boss runs a business that allows you and me the opportunity to buy the wife a nice house to live in and allows us to afford the kids a great lifestyle.

That quote is old management school textbook word for word as it gets, and something every 10+ year vet has heard. Except you forgot to add the innuendo that you would hate to see them lose all that for failing to perform their duties up to spec.. I could go on and on, shame on me for being sucked into your game but you and I know the posts that you write are for fun,there is nothing more fun to a UPS supervisor than getting a hardcore union employee all worked up.I think some of the others are on to something about you having a steward being a little hard on you lately,seems to me you might be looking for some weaker prey on the B.C..Call me a liar!

To answer altstewie original question, if you are a steward no problem,I would explain to the supe you have reason to believe supes have been working in a certain area and if so you would like to have the extra work and go investigate it.Find someone in that area who will be your eyes and keep track of how long the supe works everyday and grieve for the time.Check with your area B.A. but investigating should be paid for time, if you are still on the clock on your shift.If your not a steward do the same on your break find someone to keep track of time for you and get with your steward to further investigate the situation. Doc

 

[Mike Hawk]

Mike I'm not upset by it all. in fact I'm trying to comment in a way that shows there is no anger. I'm simply recognizing what goes on and why and pointing it out. To simply state it is about contract enforcement does the process an injustice. Its always been a whole lot more.

Calling them "union goons" seems to indicate some amount of anger, or do you make derogatory generalizations about everyone?

On another note I would like to see you answer the question in my last post, if we don’t boss the boss who will?

 

[Lobofan5]

This entire thread exposes a major problem with UPS.

Hourly-Union

Vs.

Salary-Non-Union.


Hard to get along if we all don't bat on the same team.

 

[Ptrunner]

Im the original thread maker and i was hoping to get my question answered and Im not sure if it was answer but i think after reading all these post, Ive come to a conclusion. Ill just take a walk and ill look to see whose working. And if they tell me no more walking around, first ill see if the business agent tells me i can keep walking around. And then if they tell me i cant walk around, then i can say well you must be hiding something and anytime i see a supe working, i might as well nickle and dime them until they want to let me walk.

3 years ago I did this. We had some pt supes who didnt know the contract. I could see through the cars doors onto other belts and i was on the belt across from them. Everyday i was watching supes work and after 3 warnings i gave the full time supe that i was going to file. And the pt supe began closing the doors so i couldnt see through anymore. Sometimes i could see them splitting the belt though so i told the supe if you want to keep those car doors closed then ill just file for 1 min greivances and so on. And he said Im going to look bad for doing it. And i didnt care. I filed for 12 mins the next week, and then the Labor Manager and Center Manager at the grievance hearing told me starting on monday those doors would be open and the supes would stop working. And they did. They put 2 extra people on the belt.

Tieguy why couldnt the full time supe do his job and get 2 extra people on the belt. Because they dont care they have to get their numbers. They dont care about the contract they signed with the union. Isn't that so childish to actually close doors to block so no one will file a grievance. Everyone on the belt was college kids and they just want to get the work done and go home. Now those same college kids care about the contract because guess what, all that hard work got them no where, they didn't get a bonus for busting their butts, they didn't get more full time jobs made. NO , they were told to work harder once PAS came in. And when they got misloads because the flow is way too damn fast, they now understood why i was filing those 1min grievances.

 

[tieguy]

Im the original thread maker and i was hoping to get my question answered and Im not sure if it was answer but i think after reading all these post, Ive come to a conclusion. Ill just take a walk and ill look to see whose working. And if they tell me no more walking around, first ill see if the business agent tells me i can keep walking around. And then if they tell me i cant walk around, then i can say well you must be hiding something and anytime i see a supe working, i might as well nickle and dime them until they want to let me walk.

This is one of my favorites. Shop steward we want you to stay late and come in early to make sure that no sup is working and no driver is working off the clock.
That steward would never think to do so for ups unless he was being paid for it. But would be chastised for being a poor steward if he did not give the union this free labor.
The stewards have it tough. They are often a tool for the union goon as he tries to harass the company.

 

[tieguy]

Calling them "union goons" seems to indicate some amount of anger, or do you make derogatory generalizations about everyone?

On another note I would like to see you answer the question in my last post, if we don’t boss the boss who will?

The union goon term is needed to seperate them from others. In griffs original call to arms he cried because there were many teamsters he could not get to join him on his attacks on the company. Many teamsters want the teamster union as an insurance policy. They don't want to come to work everyday looking for a reason to attack the company. Who files the grievances and how its done is really irrelevant.

 

[tieguy]

Hey Tieguy..... Just wanted to thank you for dissing my reputation for supporting a fellow Teamster. We must have your panties in a bunch. You are just supporting the fact that management retaliates against any hint of solidarity amongst it's members.

your welcome. I did it because you were a cheerleader. I thought you should have been a player and voiced your own opinion rather then shaking pom poms on the sideline.

 

[Steward773]

I was, and played very well thank you. You took the the bait hook line and sinker by dissing my rep and calling me Griffs stooge..... thus proving the point that you retaliate against any hint of solidarity we show as Teamsters.

 

[tieguy]

I was, and played very well thank you. You took the the bait hook line and sinker by dissing my rep and calling me Griffs stooge..... thus proving the point that you retaliate against any hint of solidarity we show as Teamsters.

This would be a typical response. Notice that I presently have approximately 8 or 9 brothers showing soladarity against me. Your post was the only one that recieved a negative. Therefore you may have to reach for another answer. I thank you though for that response. I believe it is number 3 in the teamster goon handbook.

 

[tieguy]

by the way I see your friends came running to the defense of your reputation . I particullarly want everyone to read "i do less works" comments which I found particularly insightfull. Cowardly comments said on the sidelines are often a trait displayed by the union goons.

Often along the way the union goon faces moments of crisis. Someone will actually challenge that persons belief system. A cry for help will come out as 773 did when he cried because I gave him negative reps. At this point its critical that other goons rush to his aid and reassure him before his brainwashing unravels. This may actually be the true meaning of soladarity. In this case I do less work reassured him that there was nothing wrong with him and that I was simply being a dick. This is a common form of support. These type of comments then soften up the potential goon for further brainwashing.