Members Not Voting

Boywondr

The truth never changes.
A combination of apathy, cowardice, and impotence. At least from my experience, this is what I've seen.

Apathy - Some individuals are perfectly content with the current situation or maybe even don't realize that the Union exists.

Cowardice - A lot of people just want to "do their job and go home," without putting a target on their back. So they don't file grievances, or really get involved with the Union at all.

Impotence - Some members have seen certain ironclad grievances fail or disappear one too many times to care anymore. They believe, best case scenario, that the Union is just weak. Worst case scenario, that there is active collusion between Union officials and management to sweep certain issues under the rug and possibly disparage others who make any noise.

As much as I hate to say it, the last one is what I hear the most from people. And I'm not entirely sure whether they're wrong to feel the way they do.
Where are the true leaders of today that arent officers?! The rank and file blue collar workers. Well?

The honest ones that get punched in the gut and stabbed in the back but keep fighting to fix the locals they work out of even when slandered by union officers?

The people who fight the management and the BA at the risk of their jobs?

That is why the union is weakened in some areas and why members give up or opt out. Where are the Jimmy Hoffa Sr's and the ones that arent afraid to fight for their families and neighbors?

Show me a union that is fearless and I'll say it's about time.

We've become soft and you know it.

The panels see it every session as the company pounds their own workers finances into bankruptcy to prove who is boss even if the employee isn't guilty. Where is the outcry? Where are the "brothers" who fight for each other?

I'll tell you where they are they're sucking up to management and destroying the strength of their work groups. Cowards and butt kissers. What a legacy they will leave. Makes me puke.
 

Rack em

First to worst!
Where are the true leaders of today that arent officers?! The rank and file blue collar workers. Well?

The honest ones that get punched in the gut and stabbed in the back but keep fighting to fix the locals they work out of even when slandered by union officers?

The people who fight the management and the BA at the risk of their jobs?

That is why the union is weakened in some areas and why members give up or opt out. Where are the Jimmy Hoffa Sr's and the ones that arent afraid to fight for their families and neighbors?

Show me a union that is fearless and I'll say it's about time.

We've become soft and you know it.

The panels see it every session as the company pounds their own workers finances into bankruptcy to prove who is boss even if the employee isn't guilty. Where is the outcry? Where are the "brothers" who fight for each other?

I'll tell you where they are they're sucking up to management and destroying the strength of their work groups. Cowards and butt kissers. What a legacy they will leave. Makes me puke.
Amen brother!
 

Boywondr

The truth never changes.
Amen brother!
We've got ourselves burdened into oblivion with loan debt and can't afford to sit out of work for 8 weeks to fight for our own dignity. Some of us have dug our own holes, some inherited medical issues but still we've mostly done it to ourselves.
Screenshot_20191230-211041_Google.jpg
 

Sudz

Well-Known Member
I see see much more "apathy" and "cowardice" here than "impotence".

To have a majority of impotence there would be many more people that actually know the contract. Most can't even tell you what their next raise will be.
I guess I should clarify, I mean the "perception of impotence." On the part of the Union officials, not members. It's the members who believe, whether rightly or wrongly, that the Union either can't or won't help them. And I've heard that complaint a lot. I've tried to combat it, but it seems my words to my friends and co-workers are doomed to fall on deaf ears.
 

Rack em

First to worst!
We've got ourselves burdened into oblivion with loan debt and can't afford to sit out of work for 8 weeks to fight for our own dignity. Some of us have dug our own holes, some inherited medical issues but still we've mostly done it to ourselves.View attachment 277929
I'm not sure if I understand what you're saying...Are you saying if there was a strike, you would cross the picket line to work because of your own personal reasons?
 

Boywondr

The truth never changes.
I'm not sure if I understand what you're saying...Are you saying if there was a strike, you would cross the picket line to work because of your own personal reasons?
Heck no! Didn't the last time either. I'm saying that the members have gotten so far in debt that they're afraid to fight for their rights already won in the cba because they're afraid to be put out of work.
They're afraid to become a "target" of crooked management.
 

Rack em

First to worst!
Heck no! Didn't the last time either. I'm saying that the members have gotten so far in debt that they're afraid to fight for their rights already won in the cba because they're afraid to be put out of work.
Gotcha...unfortunately the company knows who they can bully because they have that mentality. I wish our union was stronger and there was still solidarity, but times are changing for sure.
 

Boywondr

The truth never changes.
Gotcha...unfortunately the company knows who they can bully because they have that mentality. I wish our union was stronger and there was still solidarity, but times are changing for sure.
Changing because we no longer fight for anything.
Back to the voting percentages...

Afganistan had a higher percentage of voters in their first democratic election even when they knew the Taliban was going to blow up some polls with them in attendance.

Americans have become soft. Our grandparents would be outraged if they saw the labor unions today.
RTW? They'd never entertain the thought.
 

Sudz

Well-Known Member
Where are the true leaders of today that arent officers?! The rank and file blue collar workers. Well?

The honest ones that get punched in the gut and stabbed in the back but keep fighting to fix the locals they work out of even when slandered by union officers?

The people who fight the management and the BA at the risk of their jobs?

That is why the union is weakened in some areas and why members give up or opt out. Where are the Jimmy Hoffa Sr's and the ones that arent afraid to fight for their families and neighbors?

Show me a union that is fearless and I'll say it's about time.

We've become soft and you know it.

The panels see it every session as the company pounds their own workers finances into bankruptcy to prove who is boss even if the employee isn't guilty. Where is the outcry? Where are the "brothers" who fight for each other?

I'll tell you where they are they're sucking up to management and destroying the strength of their work groups. Cowards and butt kissers. What a legacy they will leave. Makes me puke.
Believe me, I hate seeing people get stepped on all the time. I hate it even more when they're not willing to stand up and fight.

Unfortunately the stewards in my building were lazy, so they're really the ones who gave the local a bad name. The BA was good. It got to the point where I just went over the steward's heads and contacted my BA directly when I had issues. The stewards tried to talk me out of filing grievances one too many times for me to take it anymore.

"You can't file grievances because of no soap in the restroom."
"You can't file over toilet paper."
"You can't file grievances if supervisors work less than 15 minutes."
 

Boywondr

The truth never changes.
Believe me, I hate seeing people get stepped on all the time. I hate it even more when they're not willing to stand up and fight.

Unfortunately the stewards in my building were lazy, so they're really the ones who gave the local a bad name. The BA was good. It got to the point where I just went over the steward's heads and contacted my BA directly when I had issues. The stewards tried to talk me out of filing grievances one too many times for me to take it anymore.

"You can't file grievances because of no soap in the restroom."
"You can't file over toilet paper."
"You can't file grievances if supervisors work less than 15 minutes."
I'd tell them "I can file labor charges on you" though. No crooked steward would ever have peace in our building.
 

Sudz

Well-Known Member
I'd tell them "I can file labor charges on you" though. No crooked steward would ever have peace in our building.
Well, I guess I just never got to that point. I guess I never saw the need to go that far as long as the BA acknowledged they were wrong and was more than willing to help me file directly. Things got done a lot faster when I called him than when I went through a steward, that's for sure.
 

Sudz

Well-Known Member
But the point is, those who aren't familiar with the Union because they're new don't see or hear from the BA. Their dealings with the Union are through bad stewards, who unfortunately formed their perception of the Union itself. Once you start suggesting that they make phone calls or send emails, they pretty much check out of the conversation. "Nah, that's too much for me."
 

Boywondr

The truth never changes.
Well, I guess I just never got to that point. I guess I never saw the need to go that far as long as the BA acknowledged they were wrong and was more than willing to help me file directly. Things got done a lot faster when I called him than when I went through a steward, that's for sure.
You gotta give those crooked stewards something to think about when their heads hit the pillow even if it's a bluff.
 

Sudz

Well-Known Member
You gotta give those crooked stewards something to think about when their heads hit the pillow even if it's a bluff.
I don't know if I had the guts to do that back when this all went down. I know I do now though, if it comes to that.

I mentioned cowardice before in the context of butting heads with management, through grievances or otherwise. Threatening charges against stewards definitely requires harder stones than that.
 

542thruNthru

Well-Known Member
Going back to the main point of this thread real quick.

I think its obvious that getting the members to vote is not as simple as it sounds.
 

Rack em

First to worst!
Going back to the main point of this thread real quick.

I think its obvious that getting the members to vote is not as simple as it sounds.
You're right, it will take an act of God to get members to give a full minute or 2 of their lives to vote on a contract that will effect the next 5 years of their lives. I still can't understand why it's so difficult to vote, but for whatever reason, people (part timers most likely) just can't find the 2 minutes.
 

Boywondr

The truth never changes.
Going back to the main point of this thread real quick.

I think its obvious that getting the members to vote is not as simple as it sounds.
A good steward can motivate many. Multiple good stewards motivates scores of members to get involved. Our last election had about a 50% turn out in voting (eligible members) and we actually expected more like 60-70%. Motivated people vote in high percentages and it may be easier to give up when things look bad but honest, strong willed people have resolve that can make things happen.

People dont know what they can have because they don't ask and keep on asking until things change. They dont persevere.
 

542thruNthru

Well-Known Member
A good steward can motivate many. Multiple good stewards motivates scores of members to get involved. Our last election had about a 50% turn out in voting (eligible members) and we actually expected more like 60-70%. Motivated people vote in high percentages and it may be easier to give up when things look bad but honest, strong willed people have resolve that can make things happen.

People dont know what they can have because they don't ask and keep on asking until things change. They dont persevere.
Not denying that but... we still need these good stewards to volunteer. We can't force membership involvement.

All I'm saying is people like to blame 2 things. The local for voter apathy and the PT workers.

It's much much much more then just that.
 
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