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HEFFERNAN

Huge Member
I actually tend to think he should. Being from a high cost of living area myself, I can definitely agree that a driver in say NYC should be given more than a driver somewhere in the middle of nowhere Alabama, where housing is affordable. Where I am, prices for homes start in the 300K's. Someone living where the avg. home price is 100K and avg. income is 28K is living like a king with this job, IMHO.

It's a union job. Pay rate should be the same across the board and country. Housing and Foreclosures are a daily struggle in CT as much as it is in CA. I live 90 minutes from NYC and can assure you no one lives in Manhattan that deliver there (too expensive). I have a 20 mile commute, I know drivers (and Sups) that commute over 45 miles to work in our center. Its the price we pay for health care and a pension.
 

John19841

Well-Known Member
Alright, let's try this from a different perspective. Can you guys at least see how someone making $70K and living in an area where they can buy a good home for $100K, vs someone making 70K a year and living in an area where a comparable home costs $300K. The one living in the cheaper area would have a much better standard of living given their income.

I think it's the same for a lot of professions. Police officers, firefighters, etc. should all be paid an amount that enables them to live where they work. Also, in the Boston area, even going 50-60 miles away from the city, house prices still start in the 3's
 

upsgrunt

Well-Known Member
Ryan,
Going back to the lobster example; Are you forced to live where you do? Do you NEED to live in that region? Is it our fault that we live in the armpit of the nation where the cost of living is more reasonable than where you are at. Like you pointed out in a previous post about needs and wants; it's all about what you need and what you think you want. I'm not trying to be a horse's ass, but if you can't keep up with the times, then it's time to change.
Steve
 

IDoLessWorkThanMost

Well-Known Member
Alright, let's try this from a different perspective. Can you guys at least see how someone making $70K and living in an area where they can buy a good home for $100K, vs someone making 70K a year and living in an area where a comparable home costs $300K. The one living in the cheaper area would have a much better standard of living given their income.

I think it's the same for a lot of professions. Police officers, firefighters, etc. should all be paid an amount that enables them to live where they work. Also, in the Boston area, even going 50-60 miles away from the city, house prices still start in the 3's

A bit of an exaggeration. 60 miles NW of Boston you're well into NH and it's 1/2 to 1/4 the price of metro Boston with loads of land.
 

John19841

Well-Known Member
Ryan,
Going back to the lobster example; Are you forced to live where you do? Do you NEED to live in that region? Is it our fault that we live in the armpit of the nation where the cost of living is more reasonable than where you are at. Like you pointed out in a previous post about needs and wants; it's all about what you need and what you think you want. I'm not trying to be a horse's ass, but if you can't keep up with the times, then it's time to change.
Steve

I really don't understand what the argument is over here. All I said was that I agree that employees in higher cost of living areas should be compensated fairly in that area. In a reasonable area a UPS driver's income allows for more. And you should know that unless you want to quit and try to get rehired, UPS does not allow transfers...so yes, I am required to live in the area I do.
 

upsgrunt

Well-Known Member
No argument intended, and I kind of see and agree with your point; It just seems like a fine line where someone deserves more because of where they live, and someone agrees to less because of where they live.
 

John19841

Well-Known Member
Let's try this one more time.

I'm enjoying this thread; I really am. Different responses than I anticipated.

Anyway, I would love to live in the midwest area somewhere where homes are cheap, land is abundant, etc. But...I don't. Family, friends, UPS, etc. all make getting up and relocating impossible. I lived in Northern Maine for a couple of years, and let me tell you, what a change in lifestyle. So laid back. Anyway, $10 an hour was a good wage for the area. with rents available for $250/month and houses starting at 30K. Everything else (gas, utilities, groceries, etc.) was the same price, but housing is where the savings is at. I can only imagine being a driver there. For $100k you could literally buy a 3000 sq ft house (If you could find one) with 10 acres of land.

I am not complaining about being at the same pay level of every one else in the country. My main gripe is with the COLA raises. The rates are already different all over the country, but no one complains that a driver in one are makes $.10 more than a driver in another. Why? Because it's minuscule. I'm just saying that it should be more realistic.

I am really hoping that the current housing market decline will help bring things in some areas to a more realistic level. Home prices have been rising at a ridiculous rate over the last 20 or so years around here, and it's about time they start to become affordable again. Buying a house for $29.5K in 1987 and selling it for 379K in 2005 is just ludicrous.

But anyway, I'm hoping to hear a response from some others in expensive areas...:whiteflag:
 

John19841

Well-Known Member
No argument intended, and I kind of see and agree with your point; It just seems like a fine line where someone deserves more because of where they live, and someone agrees to less because of where they live.


Ok, and believe me, I can also see your point of not wanting to accept less for doing the same job just because of where you live. I suppose where we differ is that I see making more not as getting more because it does not equate to anymore disposable income.

I guess in a perfect world (my perfect world, anyway) it would be based on avg. home prices. lowest avg. in country would get top driver rate now, and it would go up in the form of COLA to compensate for the difference.

For simplicities sake, let's say area with the lowest avg home prices in the country are $100K
Mortgage on that at 6% 30 years = 599.55/month or 7194.60 per year
Area with highest avg. home prices is $200K
mortgage on that at 6% 30 years = 1165.15/month or 13981.80 per year

Difference is 6787.20 per year

So, the higher cost area would get 3.26/hr more.

Just dreaming...
 
S

speeddemon

Guest
Alright, let's try this from a different perspective. Can you guys at least see how someone making $70K and living in an area where they can buy a good home for $100K, vs someone making 70K a year and living in an area where a comparable home costs $300K. The one living in the cheaper area would have a much better standard of living given their income.

I think it's the same for a lot of professions. Police officers, firefighters, etc. should all be paid an amount that enables them to live where they work. Also, in the Boston area, even going 50-60 miles away from the city, house prices still start in the 3's

All I have to say is, who forces you to live in that high cost area? We make choices, and thier are consequences to those choices. Is it fair? No, but thats life. I live where I do because it DOES have a low cost of living, taxes, ect.....Its all about planning.
 
Well, I didn't plan on living in a smaller town in Texas, I was born here and will more than likely die here. That is also a choice for some, but I will not leave this area and leave my family behind. They are all part of who I am.
As far as the differences in wages in one place compared to another, never really gave it much thought. Personally I think people in Cal. should be paid more because they have to put up with Californians.:devil3:
 

HEFFERNAN

Huge Member
I really don't understand what the argument is over here. All I said was that I agree that employees in higher cost of living areas should be compensated fairly in that area. In a reasonable area a UPS driver's income allows for more. And you should know that unless you want to quit and try to get rehired, UPS does not allow transfers...so yes, I am required to live in the area I do.


I don't think anyone is arguing with your statement at all. Its truthful and factual. BUT We are in the trucking business. This is a union job where pay rate is based on a signed contract for all. A guy moving a box in Hawaii should not get paid more than one in St Louis. I can't comment on other countries because of different national laws.

I'm sure a gas station attendant in Boston makes more an hour than one in French Lick, Indiana. I'm sure a police officer from NYC makes more an hour than one in Fort Kent, Maine. You have to move the pay scale to fit the environment to attract employees.

Trust me, I'd be mad if someone was making more than me just because they deliver in the big city or their mortgage is 200K more than myself. It doesn't end there though. All these different supplements from different unions pisses me off. Its so garbage that they want more than everyone else. I don't know the specifics of their demands but why strike when the rest of the unions signed the master contract. Are we weak?

(WHOOOOPS......went off topic a little)
 

UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)

Well-Known Member
COLA is designed to increase our base wage if the cost of living index reaches or surpasses a predetermined figure. However, as has been stated, this is a national contract and, as such, there should be one uniform wage, whether you live in LA or Backwater, AR.

It is a purely personal decision where one chooses to call home. There are far too many variables in that decision to discuss here. Corporations also have to decide where they want to call home. Have you ever noticed that most credit card companies call Delaware or South Dakota home? I have been told that it has something to do with the laws in these states. Why do you think UPS chose to move to Hotlanta? It was a purely business decision as the cost of living is much, much lower than CT.

My daughter recently moved to western NC 45 min west of Raliegh/Durham. Beautiful area and much, much cheaper than NY.

Getting back to this thread, IMO it would not be fair to adjust the COLA based upon zip codes. You knew the wage when you were hired and could then determine if that wage would satisfy your standard of living. If so, great--if not, either increase your income or lower your expenses. It's that simple.
 

Mike Hawk

Well-Known Member
I don't think anyone is arguing with your statement at all. Its truthful and factual. BUT We are in the trucking business. This is a union job where pay rate is based on a signed contract for all. A guy moving a box in Hawaii should not get paid more than one in St Louis. I can't comment on other countries because of different national laws.

I'm sure a gas station attendant in Boston makes more an hour than one in French Lick, Indiana. I'm sure a police officer from NYC makes more an hour than one in Fort Kent, Maine. You have to move the pay scale to fit the environment to attract employees.

Trust me, I'd be mad if someone was making more than me just because they deliver in the big city or their mortgage is 200K more than myself. It doesn't end there though. All these different supplements from different unions pisses me off. Its so garbage that they want more than everyone else. I don't know the specifics of their demands but why strike when the rest of the unions signed the master contract. Are we weak?

(WHOOOOPS......went off topic a little)
Not every local has the same needs/wants as every other local. With supplements and riders, local 123 in freezeyournutsoff Alaska might be able to get better heaters in their package cars in exchange for 40 paid hours in an option week instead of 50.
 
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