Is this a unfair time study?

[Damok]

You are lying. Unless the driver you replaced was 60 years old, there's no scenario where that much work could be added. I don't care if it's the laziest driver at UPS, 40-65 extra stops is at the very least 2hrs more work (11.5).

I would guess GPS language worries you.

 

[BrownShark]

You are lying. Unless the driver you replaced was 60 years old, there's no scenario where that much work could be added. I don't care if it's the laziest driver at UPS, 40-65 extra stops is at the very least 2hrs more work (11.5).

Hey GRIFF,

UPS management still handing out prozac for those illusions youre having??

65 stops being only 2 hours worth of work??

Thats 32.5 stops per hour numbnuts....alone.

Unless a driver is doing 65 stops in the trailer park where you live, and the movement of the truck is limited to single wide trailers, then thats impossible.

A typical driver in the dark can do approx. 18 stops an hour in the dark on a regular residential area, and hopefully those 65 stops would be DR and not signature or the time goes to 12.5 stops per hour for signatures.

Not sure if you have ever done the job, but get a clue.

Peace.

 

[Jones]

Hey GRIFF,

UPS management still handing out prozac for those illusions youre having??

65 stops being only 2 hours worth of work??

Thats 32.5 stops per hour numbnuts....alone.

Unless a driver is doing 65 stops in the trailer park where you live, and the movement of the truck is limited to single wide trailers, then thats impossible.

A typical driver in the dark can do approx. 18 stops an hour in the dark on a regular residential area, and hopefully those 65 stops would be DR and not signature or the time goes to 12.5 stops per hour for signatures.

Not sure if you have ever done the job, but get a clue.

Peace.

I don't think he's saying what you think he's saying.

 

[Griff]

Hey GRIFF,

UPS management still handing out prozac for those illusions youre having??

65 stops being only 2 hours worth of work??

Thats 32.5 stops per hour numbnuts....alone.

Unless a driver is doing 65 stops in the trailer park where you live, and the movement of the truck is limited to single wide trailers, then thats impossible.

A typical driver in the dark can do approx. 18 stops an hour in the dark on a regular residential area, and hopefully those 65 stops would be DR and not signature or the time goes to 12.5 stops per hour for signatures.

Not sure if you have ever done the job, but get a clue.

Peace.

I'm not talking about about an average driver. I said it was 2hrs at the very least, meaning best case scenario (smart guy). There's plenty of runners out there that hit 30-35 stops an hour. I have all the clues I'll ever need, perhaps I could rent some out to you.

 

[Brownnblue]

This is a good question. Many things affect planned time; however, one thing that absolutely doesn't is the driver on a route. I did a quick "back of the napkin" calculation using 18 MPH overall and 0.025 hrs/stop for delivery and 0.02 hrs/stop for PU and the standard package allowances for Del and PU and came up with 10.86 planned hours for your day. Since there are other things that go into planned time (start work, finish work, CODs Del Confirmation, etc.), at first glance it looks like your day is a little low. I have seen, though, entire centers running over 20 SPORH, so it is not ridiculous that your particular area plans out at over 20. Here are some things that make stop allowances lower than normal: lots of dock deliveries; lots of multi-delivery carries (more than one delivery on a single carry); lots of high density driver release residentials...

Here is my experience with time studies, and I've told operations management this many times... About 10% are "tight" and about 10% are "loose". The 80% in the middle are just fine. Check with the swing drivers (cover drivers?) in your center and they will tell you exactly which ones are which. Your only issue is whether a travel variance was improperly applied in one of the baseline units you are delivering. Ask your supervisor to print out a planned day for you on the day you are interested in and see if any of the delivery or PU units are extremely low in hours per stop (below 0.02 for delivery or 0.017 for PU). (As an on-road sup and an IE sup/mgr I never had any issues with reviewing a driver's planned day worksheet with him. If your on-car sup is uncomfortable with this review, ask that your package IE rep conduct the review with you... It's part of their job...) If this is the case, ask him/her to check with the IE department to see if any large negative travel variances had been applied in these units. It is a definite no-no to apply travel variances in baseline units, so this may help.

If you are interested and if your sup is agreeable, ask them to print out a planned day for the area with you and another driver on a different day and compare the calculations. The only differences should be in travel, which is pretty complicated, but in no way related to the driver... Jake

Would it be possible to share this "back of the napkin" equation with us? I have asked a number of times to get a review of my planned day; this request has been met with everything from laughter to loud personal insults. With this kind of reaction to my asking WHAT MY DAILY QUOTA SYSTEM IS BASED UPON, it pretty much leads me to believe that the system is fraudulent. Adding to this is the fact that the driver who was previously on my route did about 30 stops less per day. How is it possible that that kind of "flexibility" is built into the calculation.

I also asked to review my last time study (about 9 months ago, my first in fifteen years) and got absolutely nowhere. I should not have to beat my head against a wall just to have a mere glimpse at what the statistical equation for my livelihood is. If it is there job as you say it is, someone is slacking off.

I have been driving for 21 years and I will be very frank; your posts in this thread is as close as I have gotten to having the planned day equation explained to me. Too complicated? Tell ya what; you tell me about the equation, and I will help you understand genetic epistemologist Jean Piaget's four stages of cognitive development. Geez, look at this; I'm rambling on desperately and sarcasticly.........

 

[Midwest Upser]

To all of the coverage drivers who do Baselines two words...pace yourself!!! I hear the other drivers who run baselines "vent" how much they are given to do. I ask them if they run and the response is "I want to get home." Well so do I but I will not run for them. Ask yourself this the next time you are running from package car to house at every stop, "would you have taken the job as a package car driver if the HR person interviewing you told you will run every stop off until you retire." Slow down and pace yourself, your knees will give out and you will never make it to retirement.

 

[browned out]

We have a mall route in our center and it takes a good driver 10 or more hours to complete it and it is usually worth 8 or 8.5. They refuse to do a time study on this route because they know that it is really worth 10 hours or more.

The poor sap doing this route is made to take the dump van out from 7 to 8pm to make late night pu to make his numbers look better on paper.

What a joke
Dishonest and lack of integrity. Bad computer Here's a slap on the wrist. OH thats right you don't have a wrist or drive a truck, you are a computer.

 

[rod]

I've been driving for 1.5 years now and last night I punched out arround 8... I had 197 stops, 431 packages, 60 miles, 15 pick-ups, and i think had 40 pieces on pickups....and i got a planned day of 10.3 I ran it in 10.65 i believe.. so i was .35 over... my stop average was 20.5/hr

So is this the norm? am i complaining about nothing? Is it normal at other centers to have good time studies on one route and crappy on another? Normal to change the time study on the same route depending on who's driving?

Just kinda curious what you all have to say...

one of these days a light bulb will go off above you- you will slap your forhead and say outloud " Damm no matter what I do it ain't good enough." then you will discover your own comfortable safe pace, say to hell with worring about an unrealistic time allowance and you will live happily ever after (til you retire).

 

[DS]

In these centers in my old district we instructed the center managers to use best demonstrated performance, not over/under... I do understand your frustration though, and would like to see UPS move back to more accurate ways to estimate workloads. I do see this as a potential way of reducing over 9.5s while satisfying UPS's need to prevent dispatching under 8.0. I don't want to see it favor either one, just make is as fair and accurate as possible. Jake

Jake,you seem to have it all figured out except the biggest thing of all.
Area knowledge.In a mall every store has thier own idea of proper delivery methods.If you try to save time by ringing the buzzer at the back door because you think its faster,you may be in for a long wait.
If you know the reciever,he goes out of his way to make your day easier if you can be versitile and work with instead of against him.In reality the regular driver may be able to do 180 stops in 9.5 with his full break,when anyone else might scrape in just under 12 with a code 05.The best demonstrated performance for anyone in a big mall would be realistically unattainable to a guy like, say....you.

 

[U`nder P`ermanent S`tress]

Typical, you are still in wage progression, so your manager is trying to get the most work done at the least cost. I have had 4 time studies and not once did I gain any time, I always seemed to lose it. My last one was 3 years ago and was taken by a supervisor who was taller than I am. What does that mean? The time study is based partially on steps, what takes me 3 steps the taller guy can do in 2 and they count their own steps, not yours. One more thing to consider is that there is a maximum step count for each stop, I learned this my last study, see I counted my own steps, to and from the truck, at my very first stop and then asked the supervisor what he got? The numbers were off by 40 steps and I was told that 64 is the maximum allowed per stop. I guess I should have driven over the sidewalk and onto the lawn and gotten closer to the stop. Look, what I have learned is the more you do the more you get and you have to pace yourself to work safely. Just do the best you can with what you are given to do and if you bring business stops back because of closures, make sure you have done all business attempts first and residentials after. It is going to take time, once you get your own route, eventually you will get it down to under 9.5 hours worked. I never bonus thought and you want to stay under 3 hours over allowed, thats key, if you are over 3 the building manager gets involved. Tell them you want to drive 30yrs for UPS, not get burned out before 3. Best wishes.

 

[ups_vette]

Typical, you are still in wage progression, so your manager is trying to get the most work done at the least cost. I have had 4 time studies and not once did I gain any time, I always seemed to lose it. My last one was 3 years ago and was taken by a supervisor who was taller than I am. What does that mean? The time study is based partially on steps, what takes me 3 steps the taller guy can do in 2 and they count their own steps, not yours. One more thing to consider is that there is a maximum step count for each stop, I learned this my last study, see I counted my own steps, to and from the truck, at my very first stop and then asked the supervisor what he got? The numbers were off by 40 steps and I was told that 64 is the maximum allowed per stop. I guess I should have driven over the sidewalk and onto the lawn and gotten closer to the stop.

WOW!! What a concept. To "get the most work done at the least cost" I'm sure this concept is contrary to the way you run your personal life, when having work done on your car or home. You want to get the least work done at the most cost. I can see you're a financial genius.

As far as the distance from the "truck" to a stop, it's measured in feet, not the number of steps. The average adult step is 2 1/2 feet, some are longer and some are shorter. The Time Study Observer knows the distance of his/her step, counts the number of steps taken and converts it to feet. It's not uncomon for a short person to take more steps to cover the same distance as a taller person, but the distance will be the same.

The 64 you refer to is the number of steps for an average person (2 1/2 feet per step) to walk, which would be 160 feet. I seriously doubt you have many stops that are more than 160 feet from the "truck" to the stop one way.

So, you can take as many baby steps as you wish, but it will not change the the distance you walk Just follow the method you were taught and walk at a brisk pace and do not run.

 

[BigBrownSanta]

Are their any time allowance variences for deliveries to handicapped people?

I have (at least to me) a high number of handicapped (and elderly) people on my route that take a long time to come to the door to get their package. If I just leave the package, some of these people would really have to struggle to get their packages indoors.

 

[Griff]

If a manager constantly talks to you about overallowed, tell him/her the union doesn't recognize their standards and to go away. It's that simple.

 

[LeddySS98]

Wow, my thread is still going on here...

Sorry no new update for you guys telling you that the manager fixed the time study... I was a buck fifty over one day and the Sup jumped me first thing wanting to know why I had 12 minutes of downtime in between these two stops as he pointed to the numbers on the sheet... I explained to him that i was sorting the truck, moving from one resi section to another, AND that i had clocked 10 min. of that 12 out as my paid break, while i was sorting/driving to the new section...I then went on to tell him that I'd really like to be a better driver and maybe he could come out with me and show me what i'm doing wrong... but he was uanable to do so due to all the conference calls and what not... I've ran a buck over a few times since then and he's never said a thing to me since... and i no longer code out paid break while i sort/move either. But I do call him on his cell phone as I'm driving to a new resi section where i have maybe 6 stops, and then i go to another resi section where i'll have 4 stops...and i tell him that if i was'nt dispatched with partial resi sections that it would really help with my production numbers...

"I'll talk to dispatch and look into it" is all I ever get back

 

[UPS Lifer]

You are lying. Unless the driver you replaced was 60 years old, there's no scenario where that much work could be added. I don't care if it's the laziest driver at UPS, 40-65 extra stops is at the very least 2hrs more work (11.5).

Griff,
I am just curious...do you EVER have any positive to say about anything or anybody

Your energy follows you where ever you go... wouldn't it be better to have positive rather than a negative presence when you enter an area???

I will get off the soap box! I don't want to banter on this.

 

[Griff]

Griff,
I am just curious...do you EVER have any positive to say about anything or anybody

Your energy follows you where ever you go... wouldn't it be better to have positive rather than a negative presence when you enter an area???

I will get off the soap box! I don't want to banter on this.

When you speak the truth, you will always seem negative. Something you would know nothing about, I understand your confusion.

 

[55andout?]

I find that most of my part time sups who became drivers actually are easier to train and do a better job as rookies. They have been through a great deal and are just glad to have a good full time job.

 

[oldster]

The new GTS time card system has a planned day report that can be printed out in the center. It shows how the planned day was calculated. Its all simple math except the on-area travel calculation. If you are in a non-preload center "Driver sort and load", and you are bonus, the % effective on the sort does not calculate properly. Other than that, it should match the planned day on the WOR.