SPHOR

[UPS Lifer]

Actually if your so worried about having an accident or injury you would follow the contract and take your lunch and breaks during the negotiated time periods. The original purpose of the lunch and break times in to mentally and physically rest and refresh. God forbid you have an accident after your 7th hour of work and someone gets injured, gets a good attorney and they go over your time card only to find you did not take your rest period that YOUR labor agreement requires.

Lunch and breaks are one of the most challenging subjects to deal with... more so for utility drivers then for drivers with assigned routes. The biggest concern I would have is false documentation on your DIAD. Don't do it. Don't say you are at luch if you are not at lunch (or break). I have always agreed with the above statement. My guess is that if you had to go to the labor board because of not being able to take a lunch as the contract specifies you will win every time. Falsify the time in the DIAD and you will lose every time.

Check with the state you live in.... some states only require 1/2 hour lunch break. If you are in compliance with state law you have your state on your side. So if you follow your contract and state law - you will probably not risk losing your job. Especially if you let the boss know that. Also, have mgmt attach a copy of the delivery records to each ride and ask for a copy of the previous day's records to go in the file as well for comparison purpose.

I HATE SHADY GAMES. I have no respect for managers/supervisors who pull that crap!

Don't forget - you get disciplined for not following the methods (direction or instruction). So follow the methods. One of the methods (it least it used to be) is use a brisk work pace (3 ft a second). So - make sure you park legally and use a brisk work pace. Most drivers lose time behind the bulkhead door during selection. If you lose 10 seconds a stop because of poor selection methods that turns out to 16 minutes plus for 100 stops a day. Poor selection methods adds up! Keep that in mind.

Again - each driver is going to have a different set of circumstances so use common sense.

If you know that the mgmt is playing games - go by the book. Believe it or not, there are some supervisors and managers who actually want to help you! Keep that in mind before you pull out your loaded guns. Give your supervisor a chance and ask questions... lots of them. Document the questions & answers after the ride is over... (On your own time). Do this only if you feel they are out to get you. I only documented when I could no longer trust my boss.

 

[paidover95]

upstateUPSNYer I see your still making friends in every thread you go to!!lol once a peacock always a peacock!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

Hardly

Why would they spend 3 days with you for the sole purpose of locking in your SPORH and then not hold you to that number?

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

upstateUPSNYer I see your still making friends in every thread you go to!!lol once a peacock always a peacock!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Whatever.

 

[Bubblehead]

Whether you sign or not the resulting SPORH number is what you will be held to from that day forward.

So does this mean you now believe that you don't have so sign?

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

So does this mean you now believe that you don't have so sign?

I still think that you have to sign but whether you sign or not is irrelevant--much like Rod--you will still be held to your new number.

 

[Treegrower]

Why would they spend 3 days with you for the sole purpose of locking in your SPORH and then not hold you to that number?

Why do they do allot of things like pretend you must sign off or else? to justify their existence. Why you ask? Oh, I don't know. Fear,intimidation. Brow beat you into making some metric or number. It's a well oiled machine. The same reason they "goose" your load for those 3 consecutive days. Come on UpState we all know the game. If you are doing your job and moving along steadily and making progress thoughout the day and using the proper methods all time, those numbers mean nothing and I suspect you know that. I've been around for 30 years and I can tell you that while I have seen many, many a employee both hourly and mgt get permannately terminated for a whole variety of things, I have never, ever seen an employee lose his/her job beacause they didn't meet SPORH. I suspect neither have you. For some other dischargeable offense yes, of course. For not meeting SPORH or some other production metric, nope. Have never seen it.

 

[Treegrower]

I still think that you have to sign but whether you sign or not is irrelevant--much like Rod--you will still be held to your new number.

__ you will be held to your new number. Interesting. Seeing how they couldn't hold you to the old number.

 

[Bubblehead]

I still think that you have to sign but whether you sign or not is irrelevant--much like Rod--you will still be held to your new number.

How will they do that? SPOHR encompasses two variables of many in a very complex equation. It's all smoke and mirrors. An attempt to intimidate. It will not go any further than the letter. The case that people are referencing as a production termination was an arbitration ruling and it was for more than performance. His entire work record was being sighted for his termination by the arbitrator. I read the decision, it was more than production that sunk his ship. Every day brings different challenges and circumstances. To try and validate our employment by isolating two variables, time and stops, is ludicris. It's a UPS route, not a paper route.

 

[grgrcr88]

We have a pending term in our local right now for failure to maintain SPORH, I'll lett you know in 2 months or more how it comes out.

 

[brownmonster]

It should be in the contract that if they require you to maintain a certain SPORH they in turn need to provide a consistant stop count. No more of this 110 one day and 145 the next. These clowns play by a different set of rules then we do.

 

[Treegrower]

We have a pending term in our local right now for failure to maintain SPORH, I'll lett you know in 2 months or more how it comes out.

How can there be a pending term in the local for failure to maintain SPORH. Wouldn't that be a supplemental agreement? Wouldn't that be outside the scope of the National Master at this point? Could that be considered your local entering into a seperate agreement, which is contractually prohibited?
Keep us up to date on that. That's pretty interesting.

 

[UPS Lifer]

How can there be a pending term in the local for failure to maintain SPORH. Wouldn't that be a supplemental agreement? Wouldn't that be outside the scope of the National Master at this point? Could that be considered your local entering into a seperate agreement, which is contractually prohibited?
Keep us up to date on that. That's pretty interesting.

The company does not discipline for SPORH. They discipline you for not following the methods - instructions - or not working as directed. SPORH may be at the root of the problem but if you follow the methods and listen to the instructions you cannot lose your job. But as you know, if you continue to challenge them, they will find a method or a failed instruction (something previously documented) to continue to discipline you on. This is no different than safety.... they can not discipline you for having an injury but they can discipline you for not following SWM.

Always keep that in mind and ask yourself - Is all this worth it? What am I trying to accomplish by bucking the system? Is it more important to put food on the table for my family? Only you can answer that.

Some of the best drivers I encountered where those who had had a performance or SPORH problem. After having 3 day rides or many OJSes, they followed the methods were generally scratch drivers who performed very consistently and had very few service problems.

 

[Bubblehead]

How can there be a pending term in the local for failure to maintain SPORH. Wouldn't that be a supplemental agreement? Wouldn't that be outside the scope of the National Master at this point? Could that be considered your local entering into a seperate agreement, which is contractually prohibited?
Keep us up to date on that. That's pretty interesting.

More to the point, what happened during the suspension phase of progressive discipline? Was it grieved then? I need more information.

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

We have a pending term in our local right now for failure to maintain SPORH, I'll lett you know in 2 months or more how it comes out.

Did he sign his lock in paperwork?

 

[grgrcr88]

More to the point, what happened during the suspension phase of progressive discipline? Was it grieved then? I need more information.

Driver was on a pending susp. and pendind term.

It was grieved, postponed twice in Nov. and Dec. then settled to a final warning in Jan. No other right ups since until a pending term in Feb.

This is not a pending term for a method violation or anything else. The letter clearly states failure to maintain certified SPORH.

 

[grgrcr88]

Did he sign his lock in paperwork?

No.And I never said that because you don"t sign it you won't be hels accountable. I just said you are not required to sign anything unless its a condition of employement.

 

[UPS Lifer]

No.And I never said that because you don"t sign it you won't be hels accountable. I just said you are not required to sign anything unless its a condition of employement.

You don't have to sign paperwork to be held accountable. Having a supervisor and a witness there while it is reviewed is good enough. If it is a certification of some sort that is necessary to fulfill your obligation as a driver etc. and you don't sign it, you could be pulled out of service until you sign it.

Don't be misled or mislead others into thinking that not signing paperwork means you cannot be held accountable.

 

[brownmonster]

Lifer, Greengrocer clearly is misleading no one." I never said that because you don"t sign it you won't be held accountable"

 

[browniehound]

Always keep that in mind and ask yourself - Is all this worth it? What am I trying to accomplish by bucking the system? Is it more important to put food on the table for my family? Only you can answer that.

.

I have to ask the same question. Is it really all worth it? Why buck the system? We will never win.

UPS runs a tight ship and they are in control. My philosophy is to just do what they say and do it the way they want it to be done. Its a simple as that. I have never heard of a driver being disaplined, never mind fired for following the rules.

I also look at it another way. The 'Space and Visability' training is there for our protection. Knowing it and practicing it keeps us out of accidents. It benefits the driver and the company. Sometimes when I am in a rush and being unsafe, the training makes me think for a second and just slow down in the package car. Its not worth an accident. I was always told "don't make up time driving the package car".

Those are words to live by!

A couple of years back I was designated for a one-on-one meeting with a management person because my "stats" ie my age and years of driving suggested I was high risk for a Tier III accident. What I came away with was good stuff.

A good driver doesn't cause accidents. A great driver can avoid accidents that others would cause or avoid all accidents entirely.

Its all about having space around the vehicle and space for the vehicle to move, and then having the visibilty to see the entire picture and be seen by all other vehicles.
Its really as simple as this and I truly believe its something to live by just for the simple fact that it will keep you safe, accident free, and under UPS' radar.

Follow the methods and you can't be fired for production. Don't follow the methods and you're asking for trouble. The methods are there to help you, not hurt you.