TP-60 Safety

Discussion in 'UPS Discussions' started by warriors55, Jul 13, 2009.

  1. warriors55

    warriors55 New Member

    I was just curious if anyone might know the amont of weight that can be put on a TP-60 trailer. We have had a problem with UPS putting to must weight on trailer to be pulled safely . Any info would be greatly appreciated.THANKS!!!!
     
  2. MonavieLeaker

    MonavieLeaker Bringin Teh_Lulz

  3. some1else

    some1else Active Member

    i havent looked at one; but there should be a spec. plate just like a pkg car that list gvwr? dont forget the pkg car's gcvwr as well if you have a fully loaded 1000 and a bricked tp-60... its gonna add up!
     
  4. UpstateNYUPSer

    UpstateNYUPSer Very proud grandfather.


    I was thinking this as well--check on the tongue where it hooks up to the PC.
     
  5. pickup

    pickup Well-Known Member

    and if you can't find a spec plate anyway on any of these trailers, or the information is conveniently scratched off, there might be a very good reason for that.(i.e. they don't want you to know) :sad-little:
     
  6. dannyboy

    dannyboy From the promised LAND

    As a practical matter, with normal packages, you would be very hard pressed to get close to the max weight of either a package car or a TP60.

    Its when you get into industries that get a lot of heavy packages that you will push the limits.

    Picking up books for instance. 2100 small boxes of books on a p800 will most likely be overweight, especially if you only get to a top speed of 28MPH on you way back to the center.

    The weight of the TP60 vs the package car would be a concern if the TP60 did not have its own braking system.

    Personally, I would never pull a TP60 with anything smaller than a P700. My personal view is that you are asking for problems.

    d
     
  7. over9five

    over9five Moderator Staff Member

    I used to pull an empty TP-60 out to a p/u who would fill it during the day. One time, I couldn't get the trailer (empty) down onto the ball on my PC. It took the weight of 3 men to get it down and hitched.

    I now know this is an insane way to pull a trailer (negative tongue weight). My point is there is ZERO training on towing a TP-60. My sup back then showed me how to hook it on, and that was it. Of course this was many years ago, but I've not heard of any new TP-60 training classes, are there?

    Even a one hour class would be wise. Just showing some rookie how to couple it then waving goodbye is not enough.
     
  8. dannyboy

    dannyboy From the promised LAND

    9.5, you do bring up an interesting point that I had forgotten.

    I wonder what the DOT language is on a negative tongue weight for a trailer? And this is due to the trailer being empty, and the package car being full.

    I dont know the answer to that, but it would seem that it is a real safety issue.

    d
     
  9. soberups

    soberups Pees in the brown Koolaid

    If the trailer is empty then it has about 300 lbs of positive toungue weight. The balance point is in front, so if empty it will always tip forward onto the toungue. Negative toungue weight can only occur if there is significantly more weight in the back half of the trailer than in the front. I have never found this to noticeably affect handling while being towed, the only problem is that it can make it a real hassle to get the trailer hooked up without assistance.
     
  10. freeloader

    freeloader geek

    TP-60 safety is an oxymoron. Those things are accidents waiting to happen from just about every aspect:

    They are difficult to hook up because of the negative tongue weight.
    They are difficult to maneuver for the driver.
    They roll all over the yard because the brakes never work.
    They are difficult to unload on primary unloads and metro unloads.
    They get yanked around the yard by forklifts with makeshift hitches that do more harm than good.
     
  11. dannyboy

    dannyboy From the promised LAND

    Sober

    IF the package car is empty, there is no problem. IF both are full, there is no problem, there is weight on the front of the tongue.

    The problem lies when you have a package car that is loaded, and a trailer that is not, or is loaded only behind the tires.

    This puts the ball below the hitch even without the jack being on the ground. This puts a negative pull up-wards for the whole trip. While a properly latched hitch should be able to handle it, they were not designed for that type of lift.

    So the question remains, is there something in the DOT regs that address the issue of negative tongue weight on a trailer.

    d
     
  12. soberups

    soberups Pees in the brown Koolaid

    I have been towing one every day for the last 18 years, and I have never had a safety issue with them. With practice, they are easy to maneuver....certainly easier than a tractor towing a 40 foot box.

    The rest of the issues you describe are maintainence or equipment issues. If the brakes dont work, write them up and get them fixed.

    Our building has a spot on the primary unload which is basically a "shed" on wheels that has a conveyor belt extension, it was designed for the TP-60's we have to be unloaded from.

    We also move our TP-60's around with a forklift. Our mechanics just used an arc welder to burn :censored2: thru the tip of one of the forks that was big enough to mount a trailer ball into. The ball itself has a small hole in the shaft which allows it to be secured to the fork with an oversized cotter pin, or easily removed as needed. Simple, cheap, and it works great.
     
  13. soberups

    soberups Pees in the brown Koolaid

    The amount of weight in the package car has no effect on the balance of the trailer.

    I have pulled empty trailers with a full package car hundreds of times. I have never had an issue, or noticed any difference in handling.

    Even if you have a big load in the back of the trailer causing negative balance, once you get it pushed down onto the ball and latched it will not have a noticeable effect on the handling of the package car.

    I have had negative balance that required 2 people (say 400 lbs.) to stand on the toungue in order to push it down onto the ball and latch it. I had no issues with the handling whatsoever.

    The only safety issue here is that trying to stand on the toungue is a good way to fall off and get injured. I wont do it, instead I go get the forklift and use it to force the toungue down onto the ball.
     
  14. dannyboy

    dannyboy From the promised LAND

    The issue is not one of handling, but of tongue/hitch design. These types of hitches are designed for having a positive pressure on the hitch. And that is where I believe there is an issue.

    And that is where I am interested if the subject is covered under language by the DOT.

    After all, they do cover all sorts of other issues, I would be interested in finding out more.

    As far as handling, yes there is not any noticeable difference.

    d
     
  15. upssup

    upssup New Member

    There is a training handout and demonstration that has been used here in the midwest for a while now. The negative tongue weight is an issue only with one of the brands of trailers that we use.
     
  16. soberups

    soberups Pees in the brown Koolaid

    I have always felt that, in buildings that have TP-60s, all new drivers who achieve seniority should be given a class in the proper method of hooking and unhooking a trailer, plus an hour or so of practice time to learn how to back it up.

    Too many drivers have their first experience with a TP-60 on the morning that they have been assigned to run a new route cold. A sup helps them hook it up, and away they go. Not knowing the route is stressful enough, combine that with trying to learn how to tow a trailer and its an accident waiting to happen.

    My building has 14 trailers. Odds are, an unassigned driver is going to wind up on a route that tows one sooner or later. All new drivers should be trained for this.
     
  17. sano

    sano New Member

    Just a safety heads up. The information about negative tongue pressure not affecting handling may be true of a package car, however, it is certainly not true of many personal vehicles. If you are pulling a trailer with your pickup or suv you need some tongue weight or it will sway. If you have a trailer that wants to sway back and forth when you get to a certain speed try adding some tongue weight.

    This has been a public service announcement... Now back to your normal programing.:happy-very:
     
  18. City Driver

    City Driver New Member

    do yall need CDLs to drive package cars? like a class B or C or somethin?
     
  19. UpstateNYUPSer

    UpstateNYUPSer Very proud grandfather.

    Non-CDL Class C in NY
     
  20. wornoutupser

    wornoutupser Active Member

    Our building had a driver lose his job over one of the trailers. He eventually got his job back after gathering reports of them jumping the hitch ball.
    His trailer made it 35 miles down the highay and then jumped (empty) on the highway. No one was injured and no property damage occurred.
    UPS promptly accused him of not hitching the trailer correctly. How in the world did it make it 35 miles if the hitch was not fastened?
    UPS has since changed the hitch mount on our trilers in this building.