New DOT HOS Interpretation

[over9five]

See if you guys agree with this. This is how the company (and IVIS) now calculate your 60 hours:

1. We get two 10 minute paid breaks here. These are now considered off duty time. They do not count towards your 60. In other words, you can now work well over 60 hours per week.

2. Someone also told me that the DOT counts time in 15 minute increments, so this would add 1/2 hour to your available hours per day. (Still can't go over 14). I have not checked the IVIS available hours that closely yet, but I've noticed they were wrong for a couple of months.

If true, that means we can now work 62.5 hours a week and not be in violation.

Comments?

 

[cachsux]

I think your mgmt team is as full of crap as mine is right now.

We've had three different rule interpretation changes just this week.

Here, paid breaks do count to 60 in five or 70 in eight.
Haven't heard the 15 min thing. ( I call bs)

Here they are doing the " rolling hours" method of no 34 hr resets, off two 1-5am periods, are needed until either you run out of 70 in 8 or you break the cycle by taking a day off after which the rules apply and you have to reset.
Yest it was posted "if you are in the public eye "STREETERS" the you must take the dot mandated 20/10 break by your 8th. Everyone not a streeter interpreted it as not mandated for them and did not take the break.
Since the Friday after tgiving lunches per the contract are optional.............as long as you take the dot 20/10 before your 8th.
Streeters can go over 70 in 8 as long as everything over 70 is in the yard.
Not technically dot but we've had 22.3 shifters drive up to 18.5 hours in a shift. I'm sure that's safe.

Don't ask me to explain any of that as I have no clue. I'm sticking to 60/5 from here on out.

 

[oldngray]

I would think if its a paid break then it would still count towards your hours, and I agree it looks like mgt trying to game the system (or scam drivers) to stretch their hours available.

 

[over9five]

I would think if its a paid break then it would still count towards your hours, and I agree it looks like mgt trying to game the system (or scam drivers) to stretch their hours available.

Well that's exactly what we all thought. But looking at the FMSCA updated rule, I think I'll have to agree with the company..... OR at least I can see how they came to that conclusion.
Go to the FMSCA site, scroll down to "On Duty Time". Under the old rule it was any time in a CMV. Now it does not include any time resting while parked.

I still question that as the break is paid time, how can it not be "on duty time". But I'm tired, and can't find that answer. If anyone else can, please post a link.

 

[over9five]

I think your mgmt team is as full of crap as mine is right now.

We've had three different rule interpretation changes just this week.

Here, paid breaks do count to 60 in five or 70 in eight.
Haven't heard the 15 min thing. ( I call bs)

Here they are doing the " rolling hours" method of no 34 hr resets, off two 1-5am periods, are needed until either you run out of 70 in 8 or you break the cycle by taking a day off after which the rules apply and you have to reset.
Yest it was posted "if you are in the public eye "STREETERS" the you must take the dot mandated 20/10 break by your 8th. Everyone not a streeter interpreted it as not mandated for them and did not take the break.
Since the Friday after tgiving lunches per the contract are optional.............as long as you take the dot 20/10 before your 8th.
Streeters can go over 70 in 8 as long as everything over 70 is in the yard.
Not technically dot but we've had 22.3 shifters drive up to 18.5 hours in a shift. I'm sure that's safe.

Don't ask me to explain any of that as I have no clue. I'm sticking to 60/5 from here on out.

I go by the 100 mile air radius. I don't take the 30 after 8.
I've reset every weekend because I've run out of hours by then anyhow. 60 hours by 4am Saturday, can't reset till 5am Monday, and my next scheduled shift is Monday afternoon.

 

[cachsux]

The 100 mile should apply to 705 but we observe the Dot break.
They have no clue. I'll stick to the hours of service that applies , and will get you disciplined, the other 11 months of the year.

 

[anonymous6]

all paid time goes to your hours. even if you work and get paid for anything OUTSIDE our company, paid hours goes towards your 60.

this issue came up last year and I live near a DOT truck scales and got this clarified by a DOT officer.

Stay LEGAL!!!

( I am assuming that you are on the 60 hour rule )

 

[fiddledee]

it depends on what your calculating. Breaks and meals can not be subtracted from the 14 hour punch to punch rule but should be subtracted from the hours worked calculation. You're not driving or working during your breaks are you?

 

[brett636]

http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/rules-regulations/topics/hos/index.htm

 

[over9five]

@orangputeh thanks, but DOT officers are like our management. Ask ten of them, get ten different answers. I want to see on their website that paid breaks are/are not included in the 60.

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[cachsux]

it depends on what your calculating. Breaks and meals can not be subtracted from the 14 hour punch to punch rule but should be subtracted from the hours worked calculation. You're not driving or working during your breaks are you?

Here if you don't take your paid break, don't show it during your days activities hen you enter your info at punch out and just punch out, they will add it on in payroll when calculating your paid day. 10 hours becomes 10:10.
We have had drives get warning letters for dot violating for actually working 59:30 for example, add no breaks during the week, and end up with 60:20 as their total.

Here the breaks count.
The fact is no matter what mgmt may say they changed, it does not override federal law. They underestimated volume, had weather factor in,etc. Right now they are grasping at straws because they don't know to crap or wind their watch.

 

[Jones]

I noticed a while back that the hours log in the IVIS was counting our paid break as off duty time, never got an official explanation for it and my supervisor seemed genuinely surprised when I pointed it out. I just assumed it was a glitch and continue to keep track of my hours the same as I did before.

 

[MaceFremonti]

The way that it was explained to us is your break is the same thing as your lunch it's time that you're not working and are off the clock. It's a "perk" that UPS pays you for the time. Technically you're not working so it doesn't count towards your at hours but out of the kindness of their heart (and our contract) UPS is actually giving us free money!

I've been in Feeders since May and have always calculated it this way. That's also how it was taught in my initial Feeder school class.

Coming from the hell that is the delivery division it seems like there's a lot of free money in Feeders...



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[cachsux]

Take an hour and ten lunch/break and give them that "perk" right back.

 

[Anonymous 10]

See if you guys agree with this. This is how the company (and IVIS) now calculate your 60 hours:

1. We get two 10 minute paid breaks here. These are now considered off duty time. They do not count towards your 60. In other words, you can now work well over 60 hours per week.

2. Someone also told me that the DOT counts time in 15 minute increments, so this would add 1/2 hour to your available hours per day. (Still can't go over 14). I have not checked the IVIS available hours that closely yet, but I've noticed they were wrong for a couple of months.

If true, that means we can now work 62.5 hours a week and not be in violation.

Comments?

Yea more money

 

[BigUnionGuy]

This is how the company (and IVIS) now calculate your 60 hours:
We get two 10 minute paid breaks here. These are now considered off duty time.

Someone also told me that the DOT counts time in 15 minute increments.

Comments?

Haven't heard of that here. Sounds like some sort of "creative" management thing.

If you run a log book.... the increments are 15 minutes. That's where it comes from.



-Bug-

 

[anonymous6]

@orangputeh thanks, but DOT officers are like our management. Ask ten of them, get ten different answers. I want to see on their website that paid breaks are/are not included in the 60.

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yes, it is on the FMsCA on log book rules. I don't care what the company says. my license is DOT and I obey their laws. maybe Dracula will back me up on this.

 

[cachsux]

yes, it is on the FMsCA on log book rules. I don't care what the company says. my license is DOT and I obey their laws. maybe Dracula will back me up on this.

That's my feeling, brother.

 

[over9five]

yes, it is on the FMsCA on log book rules. I don't care what the company says. my license is DOT and I obey their laws. maybe Dracula will back me up on this.

That's all well and good, but the FMSCA website says under the new rules our break is not on-duty time. What now?

This question has nothing to do with the company at this point. The only question I have is does the FMSCA mean paid breaks, or unpaid breaks, or both? I would *hope* that a paid break would be on-duty time, but it doesn't say that.

I'd like to see that on the log book rules, can you post a picture? You just have to make sure it's a new book with the new rules.

 

[over9five]

Here's a screenshot showing the old rule and the new rule.