Smartpost

zubenelgenubi

Well-Known Member
I'm sure UPS would use that argument.

A guy selling cheeseburgers out of his van might have a product comparable to a bigmac but to say he's McDonald's competition would be a stretch. Scale is a factor and the intent of the contractual language matters.

Either way, that's a decision for the union competition and negotiating committees and possibly arbitration. At the very least, this should be leveraged to get a large amount of last mile deliveries back into the hands of UPS teamsters.
The language in the letter of understanding says "its", which is singular, instead of "their", which is plural. It's pretty clear this is all aimed specifically at fedex and smartpost.
 

Boywondr

The truth never changes.
I'm sure UPS would use that argument.

A guy selling cheeseburgers out of his van might have a product comparable to a bigmac but to say he's McDonald's competition would be a stretch. Scale is a factor and the intent of the contractual language matters.

Either way, that's a decision for the union competition and negotiating committees and possibly arbitration. At the very least, this should be leveraged to get a large amount of last mile deliveries back into the hands of UPS teamsters.
Good luck.
 

It will be fine

Well-Known Member
I'm sure UPS would use that argument.

A guy selling cheeseburgers out of his van might have a product comparable to a bigmac but to say he's McDonald's competition would be a stretch. Scale is a factor and the intent of the contractual language matters.

Either way, that's a decision for the union competition and negotiating committees and possibly arbitration. At the very least, this should be leveraged to get a large amount of last mile deliveries back into the hands of UPS teamsters.
It’ll be much harder for UPS economically to handle the surepost volume. FedEx can do it by paying us less. UPS doesn’t have that option. Teamsters won’t take lower pay in exchange for more full time driver positions.
 

DriveInDriveOut

Proud Deplorable
It’ll be much harder for UPS economically to handle the surepost volume. FedEx can do it by paying us less. UPS doesn’t have that option. Teamsters won’t take lower pay in exchange for more full time driver positions.
Luckily for UPS our union just forced a concessionary contract on us that includes a new, lower paid, classification of driver called 22.4.
 

bacha29

Well-Known Member
Luckily for UPS our union just forced a concessionary contract on us that includes a new, lower paid, classification of driver called 22.4.
Just another example of the ongoing race to the bottom with little or nothing standing in the way. If you need another example just go to the job boards and look. Desperate FXG contractors crying for help that can be quickly approved and thrown into the fray. But,.....if you noticed the money they're offering is the same money that they offered 5 or 6 years ago.

The thing to remember about doing Smartpost out in the jings is that the mail carrier can now leave his letters in the box out at the end of the lane. The Ground guy will have to take it back to the house....all the way back to the house which means getting stuck back in those god forsaken places..... a lot.
 

worldwide

Well-Known Member
What is their handled volume in the domestic US vs UPS? Above I see a lot of European based companies and I'm sure we dont see their delivery transactions at the dock like FDX and UPS but what is their volume transaction percentile vs ours?

Asendia and RRD are logistics forwarders. Freight (LTL) seems to be their mainstays but their impact is low keyed. DHL is linked to the Deutsche Post.

Where is their services that mirrors ours at the post office?
Do some research - DHL eCommerce handling more volume that UPS SurePost in the US - they just released their quarterly numbers and they are kicking UPS's butt on international - both small package and light weight SurePost-like volume. Pitney Bowes and RR Donnelley are huge players in the US light weight, e-commerce space. Just because you don't see any trucks with their names on the side, does not mean they are not big players in the light-weight parcel market in the US. Ascendia is a JV between French & Swiss Post office handling US outbound international light-weight packages. Think beyond US domestic - the Sure-Post compatible volume for packages leaving the US is much larger than domestic and UPS is far from the #1 player in that market.
 

zubenelgenubi

Well-Known Member
Do some research - DHL eCommerce handling more volume that UPS SurePost in the US - they just released their quarterly numbers and they are kicking UPS's butt on international - both small package and light weight SurePost-like volume. Pitney Bowes and RR Donnelley are huge players in the US light weight, e-commerce space. Just because you don't see any trucks with their names on the side, does not mean they are not big players in the light-weight parcel market in the US. Ascendia is a JV between French & Swiss Post office handling US outbound international light-weight packages. Think beyond US domestic - the Sure-Post compatible volume for packages leaving the US is much larger than domestic and UPS is far from the #1 player in that market.
Inasmuch as it concerns eliminating the surepost service, it doesn't matter if they are shipping packages that are compatible with surepost. What matters is if they are offering a surepost-like service
 

Boywondr

The truth never changes.
Do some research - DHL eCommerce handling more volume that UPS SurePost in the US - they just released their quarterly numbers and they are kicking UPS's butt on international - both small package and light weight SurePost-like volume. Pitney Bowes and RR Donnelley are huge players in the US light weight, e-commerce space. Just because you don't see any trucks with their names on the side, does not mean they are not big players in the light-weight parcel market in the US. Ascendia is a JV between French & Swiss Post office handling US outbound international light-weight packages. Think beyond US domestic - the Sure-Post compatible volume for packages leaving the US is much larger than domestic and UPS is far from the #1 player in that market.
I did the research. I already explained that even tho we don't see the physical trucks delivering DHL's (German post) volume to the United States Post Office their volume is there.

Btw, I do know that ups dumps tons of exports with DHL (A. Austin) daily for them to deliver for us. There's more going on behind the scenes, as I said, but Smartpost is our mirrored competition at the docks. The bean counters and Teamsters negotiators will figure it all out.

They have an escape clause to not internalize all the Surepost if it's deemed not economically feasible as I've posted before in post #31 so we shall wait and see how the numbers shake out.
 

bacha29

Well-Known Member
Luckily for UPS our union just forced a concessionary contract on us that includes a new, lower paid, classification of driver called 22.4.
If you think this is bad just go over and look at the stunning NLRB rulings that have been handed down over the past few months. You'll be absolutely floored when you read them especially if you're a brown shirt Teamster. Yes, you have a concession filled contract and will likely be even more concessionary when these rulings come home to roost.
Simply more examples of the ongoing race to the bottom with the final outcome being one where this will no longer be a favorable part of the economy to be involved with.
 

DriveInDriveOut

Proud Deplorable
If you think this is bad just go over and look at the stunning NLRB rulings that have been handed down over the past few months. You'll be absolutely floored when you read them especially if you're a brown shirt Teamster. Yes, you have a concession filled contract and will likely be even more concessionary when these rulings come home to roost.
Simply more examples of the ongoing race to the bottom with the final outcome being one where this will no longer be a favorable part of the economy to be involved with.
Yawn.
 

bacha29

Well-Known Member
Same here. At the same time however if you're a UPS union represented employee don't say i didn't warn you if UPS uses the new "contract coverage" rule or the new "blocking charge" rule to bring shock and awe to your sheltered little world.

Likewise if you're an Express letter carrier there is a new ruling and I'm trying to get more specifics on it but in general it would allow a company to reclassify you as an "independent contractor" without having to risk nearly as much in the way of fines and litigation in order to do so.

Granted, nothing may come out of this but the potential IS there for a WHOLE LOT to come out of this.
 

59 Dano

I just want to make friends!
Same here. At the same time however if you're a UPS union represented employee don't say i didn't warn you if UPS uses the new "contract coverage" rule or the new "blocking charge" rule to bring shock and awe to your sheltered little world.

Likewise if you're an Express letter carrier there is a new ruling and I'm trying to get more specifics on it but in general it would allow a company to reclassify you as an "independent contractor" without having to risk nearly as much in the way of fines and litigation in order to do so.

Granted, nothing may come out of this but the potential IS there for a WHOLE LOT to come out of this.
Good thing you're an expert on UPS union contracts and Express employment statuses. Imagine how much more of an expert you'd be if you'd ever had any experience with either!
 

bacha29

Well-Known Member
Good thing you're an expert on UPS union contracts and Express employment statuses. Imagine how much more of an expert you'd be if you'd ever had any experience with either!
While I do have direct experience in negotiating union labor contracts I am only recommending that every UPS brown shirt and FX letter carrier take a moment and go over to the NLB website and and look at some of it's recent rulings.

They in turn can draw their own conclusions ...Unfortunately in your case your ability to do so is the first thing they took away from you the moment you arrived at the reeducation academy.
 

59 Dano

I just want to make friends!
While I do have direct experience in negotiating union labor contracts I am only recommending that every UPS brown shirt and FX letter carrier take a moment and go over to the NLB website and and look at some of it's recent rulings.
You have experience negotiating union labor contracts? LOL LOL LOL!!!!

They in turn can draw their own conclusions ...Unfortunately in your case your ability to do so is the first thing they took away from you the moment you arrived at the reeducation academy.
What do you mean, "unfortunately"? They did so at my request!
 

Boywondr

The truth never changes.
While I do have direct experience in negotiating union labor contracts I am only recommending that every UPS brown shirt and FX letter carrier take a moment and go over to the NLB website and and look at some of it's recent rulings.

They in turn can draw their own conclusions ...Unfortunately in your case your ability to do so is the first thing they took away from you the moment you arrived at the reeducation academy.
Post some links?
 
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