The contradictions continue

Discussion in 'UPS Information Technology' started by virtualpro, Dec 26, 2008.

  1. virtualpro

    virtualpro New Member

    Why in a climate of: close all requisitions; “no more headcount for support”, “do not expect promotions out of band to 1 or 2 unit management (much less option level)”, “too many mangers and not enough workers” & a policy to “do more with hourly Technicians”; etc. Why do we have 3 Option level positions and a 2 Unit position posted on the outside ( There is nobody internally qualified to fill these spots? Span and Control says an Option level manager should be managing 25 or more people; do we have 3 departments this large without managers? Looks like these are highly technical positions? We used to have a wealth of Technical people until we forced them all to start managing people. Will they manage people or be single contributors? What are we doing here?
  2. nervIS

    nervIS New Member

    this is an easy one. we need a options level manager to manage all the 2 unit single contributor managers. god forbid that we do not have enough management.
  3. simcoe919a

    simcoe919a New Member

    What blows my mind: They have management people running reports (reports, reports, reports) to see how effective TSG is. Duh! NO one is effective because there is little recordable work allowed. And the stuff that is non-recordable is not permitted to be recorded.

    The new UPS pays the technicians and management to sit around and watch the operations suffer. Additionally, why is it technology management is not required to help operations because they report to “region”. Way to watch the partners suffer!

    Merry Christmas, sit and run reports and make sure your technicians are planned for not helping the company run well.
  4. Dfigtree

    Dfigtree New Member

    Ain't been a partnership since 11/11/1999 when "By the end of the day, the U.P.S. shares had jumped from their initial offering price, to $68.125 a share." (NY Times) Talk about partners suffering!
  5. I always thought that the one position that was worth option level was that of Project Manager (sometimes Systems Manager at UPS). Such a person, if a true PM, runs several projects, large teams of people, and needs to understand finance, leadership, management, people, and all that goes with that. Such people are pretty rare. They need to be able to do all that and also be able to report on, market, and sell their projects to all levels of UPS management. They also need to know how to work their way through the organization to that their efforts get the support and resources they need at the right time, and don't get starved by others in their little fiefdoms, or small-brained administrators.

    Go UPS!
  6. virtualpro

    virtualpro New Member

    I agree with your assessment of what a PM position should require. One of these postions are for a Principal Architect and I agree that should be a very senior position with it's focus as technical. Why do we continue to push the senior technical people we have into management roles? How do we justify going to the outside for these people?
  7. Its that age old delemma, that in order to advance in many companies, you must become an administrator. Gimme a superb technologist, or a great business analyst anytime, and I shall rule the world.

    Go UPS!
  8. Monkey Butt

    Monkey Butt Dark Prince of Double Standards Staff Member

    While you administrate?
  9. Project manager? is this the title for someone who manages to make a project out of anything? because if so we need these titles in package operations....LOTS of those there. :wink2:
  10. jehardrock

    jehardrock New Member

    The role of a Project Manager in IT may apply to all the responsibilities of what was previously described. However, these responsibilities have been delegated down to the Project Leader (at least in my case). In my environment, my Project Manager does very little. I am responsible for 25+ employees, all of which are MIP participants (including 3 2-unit individuals that report to me). I also have multiple projects to manage. So I ask you......what is the purpose of a Project Manager in IT?
  11. upscorpis

    upscorpis Member

    This likely leaves a few scenarios:

    1) You are on top of everything. You have no need for your PM to get involved. They are allowing you that freedom since you have proven to be a top performer and this experience is good for your development. If this is true, you should recognize it and be thankful your PM is looking out for you.

    2) You need some assistance from your PM which you feel you are not receiving. In this case you should approach your PM in a way that will allow them to get the message without appearing to be needy so as not to negatively affect their view of you. If you get no response, ask your SM for advice on how to get a better response. This will get the message across to the SM about your PM in a manner that shows you're trying to work through the problem vs. bellyaching about it.

    Just trying to help....
  12. upscorpis

    upscorpis Member

    For the record, I did see these posted internally as well.
  13. Dfigtree

    Dfigtree New Member

  14. jehardrock

    jehardrock New Member

    Spoken like a true PM or above. I prefer #1. However, nobody is looking out for me. It's a matter of my abilities to do the job at the PM level and having my career halted because I am "relo no". But what the heck.....let's give him the responsibility anyway.
  15. upscorpis

    upscorpis Member

    So if you were the PM, how would you handle the situation of a PL like yourself? Would you get involved where your involvement clearly is not required? Would you allow the PL the leeway to do the job that they seemingly deserve? I'm truly curious to hear what you feel the proper approach to be.
  16. upscorpis

    upscorpis Member

    Intelligence is not the end all be all but I'm sure you realize that.

    If there is some issue with performance that you can factually describe, have you taken advantage of the open door policy?
  17. Monkey Butt

    Monkey Butt Dark Prince of Double Standards Staff Member

    Yes the door is always open
    and the light's on in the hall
    And you know that I'll be waiting
    if you'd ever come to call
  18. jehardrock

    jehardrock New Member

    If I were a PM I would provide support when warranted. I would allow my PL to do his/her job but would stay informed and available to support my team. As a PM, I would also support my team instead of jumping to conclusions and siding with the business before gathering the facts.

    My feeling here is that when some people get promoted to certain levels they feel they don't have to do anything but delegate and place blame. We as Management are all do-ers in my opinion. Not to do the job of their subordinates, but to support each other when needed and warranted.
  19. upscorpis

    upscorpis Member

    Well that is a perfectly reasonable expectation from where I sit. I surmise that the specific issues you mention are at the bottom of your disappointment with your or other PMs in your area. I trust that you'll find a way to get the message of your expectations in those areas across to the offending parties and/or their managers. I hope you are successful in doing so.
  20. Dfigtree

    Dfigtree New Member

    <<Intelligence is not the end all be all but I'm sure you realize that.>>
    Now that is pretty obvious (intelligence is not the end all be all as it relates to IS management ... so true ... so true) and one of the funniest things I've heard in a long time. Not to knock the Podunk college that the Putz went to, but it sure wasn't U of P. Anyone with a heart beat in NJ can get in. That is a good thing, actually, but doesn't necessarily qualify you to have to thousands of people under your dirty BVD's.

    <<If there is some issue with performance that you can factually describe, have you taken advantage of the open door policy?>>

    Hah! Anyone who was in the Puts' office a few years back when he went on a one hour psychotic rant, with his spit projected all around his (old) office and his eyes bulging out of his head kinda like Jackie Gleason, can tell you that the Putz should be in a padded cell. He should have been fired right then by the IS HR manager who was present for the foul languaged event. The blonde head of IS-HR-California-surfer b let that tirade go without mention. Don't rock the boat and you don't get fired/demoted/transferred. I guess no one fires the police chief.

    <<Have you taken advantage of the open door policy?>> (It's an Open Door philosophy. There is no policy. Read the book.)

    I broke down the door on my way out.