UPS is trying to steal part of our lunch.

pretzel_man

Well-Known Member
P Man, I respect most of what you say about UPS but what you say about the over/under is just wrong. Our best (and by best, I mean fastest) drivers at my center are never under, always over. And these are the runners and gunners. They may be almost at scratch, but never are. And if they can't do their routes in the official allotted UPS time for that route, no one can.

So while I still respect your opinion on most subjects, I think you are dead wrong on this one. I go by stops per hour for an accurate reading of how I am doing, not the "over/under."

Helen,

Work measurement is meant to describe how long a job should take to do with a good load and proper conditions.

If the drivers you are mentioning have good methods, a good load, and good dispatch then the problem is the measurement.

I certainly don't know the situation you mention, but when I've seen this generally the driver has a poor load. Work measurement is meant to point out where a problem exists, not what the cause is.

P-Man
 

soberups

Pees in the brown Koolaid
I am opposed to the stupid thought that lunch begins and ends at a stop on trace. I think lunch can be taken in trace, but should begin and end at the lunch location. It seems illegal to direct an employee to drive a company vehicle while on lunch.

In most cases you are correct, but for a driver with a significant rural area to deliver it is often necessary to break trace in order to find a restroom. If the company is going to hold us to the trace then it needs to rent a portable toilet and put it in the approximate location where the driver will be at his lunch time.

I am also against using telematics to find small discrepancies. There are enough large variances to address. Its idoyic to try and fix items that are smaller than the accurcay of the system.

I agree...but with the layoffs we have a lot of front-line sups who are afraid for their jobs and are trying to justify their continued employment with UPS by micromanaging their people in order to create a "paper trail" of reports and warning letters that create the illusion that they are contributing something to the operation. UPS just spent millions of dollars on Telematics; that expense must be justified.

That being said, allowances were never "intentionally rigged" to be "one hour behind the actual time needed to complete the route". That didn't happen.

It would be a lot easier to believe that the alowances were in fact intended to be fair...if there were some method for fixing or adjusting an obviously flawed study. The reality...is that a time study, no matter how inaccurate, is chiseled in stone. You cant appeal it, you cant correct it, you cant dispute it. It will never, ever be fixed, no matter how far divorced from reality it might be. Any system with absolutely no mechanism for correcting errors is, by definition, inherently unfair and biased.

P-Man
 

soberups

Pees in the brown Koolaid
One of the best things about work measurement at UPS is that it is maintained and controlled by the IE department- which has no performance responsibilities. Then it is used to measure job performance of drivers, centers and divisions that are run by operations people, who don't have control of the allowances.

Actually, this is probably the worst thing about work measurement at UPS.

IE is basically an absentee landlord with no accountability towards the operations that it measures.

The people who do the "studies" will never have to deal with the reality of the flawed measurements they produce. They are insulated from any responsibility; they dont have to actually manage the operation or do the work in the real world; they simply spit out some numbers and move on, leaving others to clean up the mess that they create.

Time is money. IE isnt going to give away money. There is simply no financial or moral incentive for them to create realistic allowances in the first place.
 

dannyboy

From the promised LAND
Sober

I have a brotherinlaw that works industrial engineering. He has spent the majority of his early years in the garment industry, specifically Blue Jeans.

Each step of the process is timed. Many times, on many different subjects, and the results are then tabulated against the quality of the work. After those products are deemed worthy quality wise, all those studies that did not produce a quality product are discarded. The slowest 5% and the fastest 5% are also discarded.

What is left is a pretty narrow time allotment for each step of the work, from spreading the material in thick piles 100 feet long, cutting each section with the least amount of waste, supplying each section with the loops, zippers, brass grommets etc etc, and each jean is made. Each little movement is studied, and wasted movement eliminated.

A UPS time study is pretty much the same way. The time that it takes you to enter your package car, place the diad into the holder, while your other hand begins to fasten the seat belt, while the now free hand that placed the diad is grasping the seatbelt, while the now other free hand starts the engine. As your vehicle starts to move, that time has been studied the same way. Each movement has been choreographed and is seamless.

There is a defined time allowance for each time you do that. And stop, select and dismount. None of that changes much from one delivery to another.

Where we get into trouble is on area time. And that is where I believe the problems began. Many times, the last time studies were done by people that either did not have much training, or could care less. After all, how can you do a time study on a driver when the clipboard is not in hand, and the time study person is talking on the phone to someone for 20 minutes. And then they play catchup, or try.

My last time study was done by one of our districts best time study guys. I would guess he has done several thousand. I gained almost an hour on the last time study, that took almost an hour away. I went from scratch -50, to being over almost every day by 45 minutes. After the last time study, went back to being under allowed every day by 10-70 clicks. So there is a real issue with how the on road time study is done.

UPS is not interested in cutting routes to where you are beat every day (I really dont believe it), but in their haste to get time studies done, there were a lot of things done that skewed the results on many routes. And some parts of some routes were never studied, as they were shuffled from one area to another while the studies were ongoing.

So the individual components to the time study are set in stone. They dont change. What screwed up a lot of areas was the human element. Whether stupidity, lack of proper knowledge, haste, who knows. But what is for sure is that there are some routes that are really badly in need of study before production discipline means anything.

As far as the original subject of the thread, there are a lot of areas that the trace will not put the driver in an area that has restrooms/eating establishments available. When they created the trace, there was no consideration for lunch made.

Therefor, when it comes time for lunch, you do have the right to break trace and go to lunch. You are to stay on the clock until you park the car. That is when your lunch period begins. And it stops when you climb back into the package car again to leave.

If there is a travel time of more than a few minutes involved, there might be cause to have a meeting with UPS, the driver and the BA to discuss any issues that come up.

There is no way I would ever eat in my package car. Heat, cold, humidity, vermin, and dirt are all reasons. We deserve a place to sit and relax, after being able to wash the crap off our hands.

d
 
M

Mike23

Guest
I'm not too worried about UPS trying to steal my lunch...just my soul :(

Also a few things their 'time study' doesn't take into account, which I've noticed.

1. There's no time allocation for air meets

2. No time allocation if you're driving a smaller vehicle then your route requires

3. No time allocation for when the center pages you to ask if you have such and such a package, ETA, bring it to office, etc...

4. No time allocation for when a sup requests you phone them

5. At our depot we're told at 1000 to go through our ENTIRE truck to make sure air wasn't misloaded. Also at 1130 do the same thing. I don't because I have a great preloader and honestly, going through 200pkgs from 1000 would likely take me close to 1130...Again though, no time allocation for this

In other words, too many variables left out in an already ridiculously complicated formula. Scrap'em and build it from scratch to do with now times, not then times.

The number one peeve for me is the air meets. A 15min airmeet = around 5 stops for me. If I'm 5 stops short of my minimum in the morning and they gave me a 10 stop split, well, what the heck?! How does that work when I'm wasting 15min loading crap you couldn't get on my truck in time?!
 

helenofcalifornia

Well-Known Member
Or how about this one. We now have to unload our own trucks every day and are told not to put it on local sort time. So we come in dead tired from a day of hard work and now have to unload the stuff we just loaded. And what's more, put it on our own driving time!!!

We were originally told to put it on local sort time, but a new memo came from the big bosses, and now it is on us. (Local sort, who can't hire anyone, can't call anyone in to double, must have been having a little numbers problem too with all the additional time being put on them by the drivers. Ya think???)

This is just crap!! So forget the over/under stuff, forget the stops per hour ******, "it is what it is" and don't bug me about numbers anymore until you fix your *****!

Freakin' bean counters in Atlanta!!

P.S. I hit $50,000 with the last paycheck in July. I am going to be making $100,000 this year. Most money I have ever made. Thank you Atlanta. "I just hit the UPS Lottery and I am going to Disneyworld next April!!!!!"
 
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feederdriver06

former monkey slave
Take your lunch on area but when you get to your lunch spot. also, your 10 minute break is yours to take when ever you want NOT when your sup wants you to take it.
 

dannyboy

From the promised LAND
Helen

You work as instructed. BUt document. And when your on road drops, you will have the paperwork to document what you say.

On the flip side, when in doubt about an instruction by management, have them put the instructions in writing. That way, there is no doubt about he said, she said. Its all in writing.

For a while, they tried this on AM time. Wanted us to punch off AM time within 9 hundredths. Would love to, but when your start time is 8:50, the PCM goes till 9+, then you get to crawl out on the belt and split the packages, load your car, and dont leave the building until 9:30 or later........? Dont think so. That means they are asking me to falsify my on road time. Told them to put those instructions in writing, or to let me see those instructions from atlanta.

That was the end of that. So depending on how big a target you have right now, you could do it either way.

d
 

Tiny Panda

Well-Known Member
I'm glad that by law in the UK if we drive a tachograph vehicle (over 3.5t) then we have to stop for a minimum of 45 mins after 4 and half hours
 

edd_tv

Cardboard picker upper
Does this also apply to the 10 minute PT break? Our sups are trying to tell us that while we are sitting at letter boxes waiting for their P/U time we are supposed to take our break, but don't leave the box.


in my bldg they eliminated the 22.3 evening job that picked up the late letter boxes and put them on a route i sometimes had to cover. They were all 715 commit so needless to say i made some major overtime. I would set sometimes for an hour and a half, on the clock, and in overtime.
 

browniehound

Well-Known Member
I am opposed to the stupid thought that lunch begins and ends at a stop on trace. I think lunch can be taken in trace, but should begin and end at the lunch location. It seems illegal to direct an employee to drive a company vehicle while on lunch.

I am also against using telematics to find small discrepancies. There are enough large variances to address. Its idoyic to try and fix items that are smaller than the accurcay of the system.

That being said, allowances were never "intentionally rigged" to be "one hour behind the actual time needed to complete the route". That didn't happen.

P-Man

P-man,
You're the voice of reason. If the company were run more by people with your thinking I would be buying stock hand over fist.

I also agree that the company is focused on large discrepancies because minor discrepancies show no matter if you're guilty or not.

We've been on 'telematics' for more than 1/2 of a year and I have not had 1 word said to me or questioned about anything I did.

Just do your freakin' job and there should be no worries, no?
 
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