UPS provides benefits to Civil Union Partners

[moreluck]

" Either way its not how we were designed to be. "

Brett....I seem to remember hearing that God doesn't make mistakes.

 

[hoser]

What? A great platform for the 1980's? What is wrong with you? That "arguement" is a good platform for any decade and you totally missed the point and I'll make it again.....anal sex, even with a condom, is more likely to spread AIDS/HIV and other diseases than vaginal sex. And what group of people are primarily having anal sex? Gay men. Yes, anal sex is not uncommon among the rest of the couples but it's primarily a staple of gay male partners.

i thought the lobby had persuaded everyone with the facts, but i guess not....

wow.

 

[Fighting4yourRights]

Homophobia is defined as "the fear, anxiety, anger, discomfort and aversion that some ostensibly heterosexual people hold for gay individuals -- is the result of repressed homosexual urges that the person is either unaware of or denies."

A study conducted at the University of Georgia found that men scoring high on a measure of homophobia also expereinced erections, at levels greater than chance, in response to homosexual pornography.

http://www.philosophy-religion.org/handouts/homophobia.htm

What do you think?

It's very interesting to me that this comment has gone completely ignored, even by browncafe's most outspoken homophobes....

I'm still interested in a response to help justify why some people are so scared of gay people?

 

[Fighting4yourRights]

You call me religious, yet you refer to nature as some divine being making decisions about the population status of our species. I am not attempting to hypothesize what nature may or may not be intending for our future. I am simply stating how we were originally designed to behave. Given our level of conciousness we don't always behave the way nature intended. Mothers have been known to kill their own children. People take their own lives through suicide, or they simply choose to be gay. Either way its not how we were designed to be.

Your paranoia of christianity is blinding you from comprehending my point. Being normal, as I am defining, has nothing to do with how a couple interacts. Its based merely on the fact that a long-term, loving, and sexual relationship involves one man, and one woman. That is a normal relationship, and irregardless of whether those conditions exist between two men or two women doesn't make them normal because the sexes do not match up. This isn't rocket science, just very basic biology.

Expecting the same treatment as a heterosexual couple, or considering yourself discriminated because you aren't allowed marriage is asinine. You choose to be in your current relationship, and society has no responsibility to change its definitions of marriage and normal relationships to fit you. You made your bed, now sleep in it.

Defining something as "normal" insinuates that nothing else is. Bestiality and pedophilia are not normal and are both classified as mental disorders. It gets tiring when this argument is consistently tossed around. Both do not include consent and it's rape.

What is normal to you is based on convention and an overly rigid belief system. People who fall outside this belief system do experience real forms of discrimination. Hate crimes are prevalent. Gay men and lesbians are still banned from serving openly in the US military service. Child custody decisions still frequently view gay and lesbian people as unfit parents. Gay and lesbian adolescents are often taunted and humiliated in their school settings. Many professional persons and employees in all occupations are still fearful of identifying as gay or lesbians in their work settings. Gay relationships are not widely recognized in any legal way.

The truth of the matter is, just like the Black civil rights movement, the gays will get their rights, too. And, just like the governor of Alabama did, many will stand at the front door of the school, blocking the entrance and screaming obscenities. But it will all be in vein and years down the road, generations will view you, as we now view George Wallace, as an old, tired, bigoted, cranky, ignorant, carcass of a man.

Sorry, for the extremity of this post, but I didn't get my coffee and abs class was canceled last night.

 

[brett636]

Defining something as "normal" insinuates that nothing else is. Bestiality and pedophilia are not normal and are both classified as mental disorders. It gets tiring when this argument is consistently tossed around. Both do not include consent and it's rape.

What is normal to you is based on convention and an overly rigid belief system. People who fall outside this belief system do experience real forms of discrimination. Hate crimes are prevalent. Gay men and lesbians are still banned from serving openly in the US military service. Child custody decisions still frequently view gay and lesbian people as unfit parents. Gay and lesbian adolescents are often taunted and humiliated in their school settings. Many professional persons and employees in all occupations are still fearful of identifying as gay or lesbians in their work settings. Gay relationships are not widely recognized in any legal way.

The truth of the matter is, just like the Black civil rights movement, the gays will get their rights, too. And, just like the governor of Alabama did, many will stand at the front door of the school, blocking the entrance and screaming obscenities. But it will all be in vein and years down the road, generations will view you, as we now view George Wallace, as an old, tired, bigoted, cranky, ignorant, carcass of a man.

Sorry, for the extremity of this post, but I didn't get my coffee and abs class was canceled last night.

Its quite humerous when you contrast the gay and lesbian movement to that of African Americans during the civil rights movement. You may as well compare cats to dogs, or apples to oranges. The fact remains that black people are born with dark skin. Gay and lesbian people are not born gay like they claim. They make a choice to have sexual relations with people of the same sex then cry because the rest of society treats them differently.

 

[brett636]

It's very interesting to me that this comment has gone completely ignored, even by browncafe's most outspoken homophobes....

I'm still interested in a response to help justify why some people are so scared of gay people?

If this is how you try to shutup your critics its plainly obvious you have no real grounds to base your arguements on other than emotion and hearsay.

 

[Fighting4yourRights]

I will clarify:

The truth of the matter is, just like the Black civil rights movement,

Or any other group who struggled to gain civil rights protection (i.e. women, racial minorities, persons with disabilities, religious minorities). Brett, you're right, the stigma of skin color is much different from the stigma of sexual identity. But the hateful feelings are the exact same.

the gays will get their rights, too.

Watch and learn how the LGBT community increasingly gains protection under state and federal law (hrc.com).

And, just like the governor of Alabama did, many will stand at the front door of the school, blocking the entrance and screaming obscenities. ..

I notice, as history continues to repeat itself, that those in power make the biggest scene. They yell out things like "sexuality is a choice" "what next, beastiality?" "So pedophiles should be allowed to marry children" "God created Adam and Eve" "AIDS is the Gay Plague" "they just want special rights" and on, and on


But it will all be in vein and years down the road, generations will view you, as we now view George Wallace, as an old, tired, bigoted, cranky, ignorant, carcass of a man.

Yes, as when I was a child and watched video clips from the civil rights era - with all the screaming and violence from the many Whites who opposed the integration and fair treatment of Blacks - I thought, damn, why are those people so crazed? I couldn't, and still can't understand, what's wrong with Black people? I think, children in the future might come across this old retired blog in the archives and think ..."why are those people so crazed?"

 

[Fighting4yourRights]

If this is how you try to shutup your critics its plainly obvious you have no real grounds to base your arguements on other than emotion and hearsay.

The reference is to an empirical study. That means people were chosen randomly to participate in the study; data were collected in a lab, analyzed, and the results were submitted to a scientific journal. Next the journal editors reviewed the theory, methods and data analysis, and determined the study to be authentic and a contribution to the scientific literature. The study was published in peer reviewed journal and I referenced it on this message board, to which no one responded, with the exception of you.

The study found that the more anti-gay a male was, the more likely he was to be aroused by gay porn. The researchers tested a theory and found support for it. It is unlikely that these researchers forced the *straight* guys to increase blood flow to their penis while watching gay porn.

As has been demonstrated repeatedly in the scientific community - sexual identity is result of a combination of genetic, hormonal and environmental factors. There is no choice in any of these.

Please educate. The emotion and hearsay is all yours.

 

[brett636]

The reference is to an empirical study. That means people were chosen randomly to participate in the study; data were collected in a lab, analyzed, and the results were submitted to a scientific journal. Next the journal editors reviewed the theory, methods and data analysis, and determined the study to be authentic and a contribution to the scientific literature. The study was published in peer reviewed journal and I referenced it on this message board, to which no one responded, with the exception of you. The emotion and hearsay is all yours.

I'm certain a study based on "homophobia" is completely legitimate and not biased in any way whatsoever. My point is that you are attacking the attackers, and not supporting your own viewpoints. Society has no responsbility to change its definitions towards anything because you make a choice to be one way or another.

 

[hoser]

You may as well compare cats to dogs, or apples to oranges. The fact remains that black people are born with dark skin. Gay and lesbian people are not born gay like they claim. They make a choice to have sexual relations with people of the same sex then cry because the rest of society treats them differently.

...just like how poor people choose to be homeless, right?

brett, you're losing a lot of cred on this forum.

I'm certain a study based on "homophobia" is completely legitimate and not biased in any way whatsoever. My point is that you are attacking the attackers, and not supporting your own viewpoints. Society has no responsbility to change its definitions towards anything because you make a choice to be one way or another.

I don't think Brett is homophobic. Homophobes are people who are afraid of homosexuals. Brett is ignorant of their identity and culture, but I don't think he's really threatened by it.

 

[brett636]

...just like how poor people choose to be homeless, right?

I think you would be surprised just how many homeless people choose to be homeless. With the exception of the hardluck situation, most homeless people are that way because they chose to use drugs or abuse alcohol, or they just can't handle the pressures of a normal life. Mental illiness does play a factor as well, but I suspect some of that is brought on by illicit drug use.

brett, you're losing a lot of cred on this forum.

Is that why my rep points have doubled due to my replies in this thread alone?

 

[hdkappler]

i used to deliver to a few gays on my old route.if i didn't no there first name i would say maam or sir.just like anyone else.i can still like the person.not the life style:

 

[scratch]

I think you would be surprised just how many homeless people choose to be homeless. With the exception of the hardluck situation, most homeless people are that way because they chose to use drugs or abuse alcohol, or they just can't handle the pressures of a normal life. Mental illiness does play a factor as well, but I suspect some of that is brought on by illicit drug use.

brett, you are so right about this point. I have worked Soup Kitchens feeding homeless people. And my wife helps cook for them once a week. Most of them prefer to be that way. All that factors you mentioned are true; alcohol, drugs, and mental illness. We would usually have five hundred people line up for soup, four sandwiches, and a glass of tea at the particular shelter I have worked. All these faith-based charities offer help to these people to get them shelter and jobs, but most of them won't take advantage of it.

 

[Overpaid Union Thug]

i used to deliver to a few gays on my old route.if i didn't no there first name i would say maam or sir.just like anyone else.i can still like the person.not the life style:

I don't have a problem with gays if they can keep their lifestyle out of my face. The problem today is that the gays, with help from the Democrats (mainly the farthest from the center), are slowly but surely shoving their lifestyle down the rest our throats. We are all expected to be "tolerant" but what do we get in return? Things like this.....

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=57022

 

[over9five]

I have been trying to stay out of responding to this thread, but that article, AND this line:

"the San Diego City Council unanimously adopted a resolution introduced by Mayor Jerry Sanders to designate July as "Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, Transgender Pride Month."

are simply disgusting. Repulsive. How certain posters on this site can defend these kind of people [-]revolts[/-] amazes me.

They should be ashamed.

 

[toonertoo]

What a nightmare, they endured, I would sue also.

 

[moreluck]

Prime-time TV not gay enough: study
By Steve Gorman



Are U.S. television networks gay enough? Not yet, but ABC is getting close, according to a gay-rights group.
The Gay and Lesbian Alliance Against Defamation (GLAAD) has given the Walt Disney Co.-owned network the highest marks of any of the five major broadcast networks in the group's first-ever report rating depictions of gay, lesbian and transgender characters and issues on prime-time TV.
The study assigned grades of "excellent," "good," "fair" or "failing" based on the number of "impressions," or occurrences, of gay characters, discussions or themes counted during 4,693 hours of programming examined from June 2006 through May 2007.
No network was rated as excellent. But ABC received a grade of "good" with 171 hours of gay-inclusive TV last season, accounting for 15 percent of its prime-time programming.
ABC shows also featured more regular characters who are gay, lesbian or transgender than any of its rival broadcasters, led by the first-season series, "Ugly Betty" and "Brothers & Sisters," according to the study, released on Monday.
The character of Betty's office cohort, Marc, played by Michael Urie, was depicted as coming out to his intolerant mother, while Alexis, played by Rebecca Romijn, was revealed to have once been Alex -- making her the first series regular transgender on a network comedy, GLAAD said.
"Overall, the approach that ABC takes ... can serve as a best-practice model," the study found.
GLAAD said networks and their advertisers stood to gain from more gay-friendly programming, as the gay community is generally more affluent, highly educated and brand-conscious than the population at large.
GLAAD noted that ABC, long known for its family-oriented, middle-of-the-road sitcom hits like "Happy Days," also has a history of landmark TV portraits of gay characters, dating back to 1977 and the debut of "Soap," which featured Billy Crystal as Jodie Dallas.
ABC also made broadcast history when Ellen DeGeneres' TV alter ego came out of the closet in 1997 on her sitcom "Ellen," becoming the first openly gay lead character on prime-time network television.
More recently, producers of the ABC hit medical drama "Grey's Anatomy" fired actor Isaiah Washington from the show in June after he reportedly made an anti-gay slur during a heated argument on the set with other cast members.
But GLAAD spokesman Damon Romine said ABC received no extra points for Washington's dismissal.
"This is all about representations on the screen," he said. "Our overall concern is increasing the inclusivity of the networks and having our lives be more visible."
The fledgling, youth-oriented CW network, formed from the merger of the now-defunct WB and UPN networks, scored the second-highest marks from GLAAD, rated as "fair" with 12 percent of its programming hours found to be gay-inclusive.
The CW reality contest show "America's Next Top Model" accounted for nearly all of that, the report said.
CBS, the nation's most watched network overall, and NBC also received grades of "fair," with 9 percent and 7 percent of their programming deemed gay-inclusive, respectively.
The study faulted CBS for casting gay and lesbian characters mostly as victims and villains in its procedural police dramas without including gays on any of the crime-solving teams.

"Since 'Will & Grace' left the air in May 2006, LGBT (lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgender) impressions on NBC have been few and far between," the report said. News Corp.-owned Fox, the most watched network among young adult viewers most prized by advertisers, received GLAAD's lowest score, "failing," for including gay and lesbian impressions in just 6 percent of its programming.

 

[govols019]

I found the cause of homosexuality: http://worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=53327

It's all in the soy!!!!!!

 

[govols019]

How certain posters on this site can defend these kind of people revolts amazes me.

They should be ashamed.

I will not be ashamed for being against hate and intolerance.

 

[athena]

A man/man or woman/woman relationship can't do that as its not

how nature intended.

You could make the argument that

nature now intends for there to be fewer reproductions of the human species.

I purposely used your words to make a point. You first stated "nature intended" so I was really just following your lead.

You call me religious, yet you refer to nature as some divine being making decisions about the population status of our species.

I am not attempting to hypothesize what nature may or may not be intending for our future. .

Except that is exactly what you are doing by stating we were "designed" to reproduce. You are, in fact, hypothesizing about what nature intended humans to and what nature intends for humans to continue to do.

I am simply stating how we were originally designed to behave. Given our level of conciousness we don't always behave the way nature intended. Mothers have been known to kill their own children. People take their own lives through suicide, or they simply choose to be gay. Either way its not how we were designed to be. .

I am not going to argue with you about whether being gay is a choice or not. I can see that enough people have already tired and you are clearly not going to agree. However, I do feel that it is extreme to compare homosexuality to suicide and murder. Do you hunt? I hope not, I would hate to be debating with a murder. Do you spank your children? I hope not, I would hate to be debating with an abuser. Do you ever eat too much? I hope not, I would hate to be debating with someone who is picking a slow and painful type of suicide.

Your paranoia of christianity is blinding you from comprehending my point. Being normal, as I am defining, has nothing to do with how a couple interacts. Its based merely on the fact that a long-term, loving, and sexual relationship involves one man, and one woman. That is a normal relationship, and irregardless of whether those conditions exist between two men or two women doesn't make them normal because the sexes do not match up. This isn't rocket science, just very basic biology.

First, I had a good laugh about my paranoia of Christianity. I am a Christian and a heterosexual. I talk with my mother for hours about God and what he is REALLY like and what he REALLY would like from me. The thing is, there was a time in my life when I only saw God as a "fire and brimstone" kind of god. The thing is, I was miserable. I eventually figured out that God loves me no matter what and he wants me to love others no matter what. Sure, I think there will be a judgment at the end of it all. That is exactly why I try very hard not to sit around judging others and certainly not treating them any worse than I would want to be treated. I have a feeling you are never going to help anyone you feel is "sinning" change by treating them as second class citizens. Are you going to be the first to throw a stone? The reason I argue that people should quit using Christianity as a platform for their callous judgments is because I don't think it is doing anything to help others see the true God that loves them. Where is the love? God is love first and foremost. So I ask again, where is the love?

Expecting the same treatment as a heterosexual couple, or considering yourself discriminated because you aren't allowed marriage is asinine. You choose to be in your current relationship, and society has no responsibility to change its definitions of marriage and normal relationships to fit you. You made your bed, now sleep in it.

I don't think it is ridiculous for a human to want to be treated as human. What society? I am part of the U.S. society and I do not define "normal" relationship the way you do. It is the responsibility of society to change all kinds of definitions and opinions as society changes. Women now have jobs and make their own money. There was a time that this was not the definition of a good woman. I work and will be working for the next 20-30 years. Am I not a good woman?