Which came first, the chicken or the scrambled egg


From the promised LAND
Had some time today, so I thought I would post.

Several of us were in deep discussions on the safety program, issues and track record at UPS. Some of you will remember that I was quite active in the safety program at UPS here locally, with mixed results.

But when you look at the history and politics of safety at UPS, there are several truths that need to be evaluated.

First, how committed is UPS to the actual safety of the employee. I mean really. Not at the corp. level, but at the front line where the work is actually done. And I don’t mean just lip service to safety, but actual change in the way things are done, and the mentality of the front line sups.

IT was not that long ago history wise that we had a trailer with nearly 300 packages arrive at our center with a leaking hazmat (hydrochloric acid) leaking over some other hazmat packages in the right rear of the drop frame trailer.

It was getting near dispatch time, and the 300 packages really needed to make the sort, so we were instructed by the center management team to take a good breath of air, unload as much as possible in the nose, and as we ran back out, to push the packages out of the trailer. You could not see, as the fumes would burn your eyes, you could not breathe either. Just one example of UPS not that long ago.

Fast forward to what we have today.

So why the difference? Is UPS really concerned about the employee, and has changed the way they look at us, as a valuable resource instead of a disposable commodity? Are they more interested in the cost of hurt employees, after all, it’s a business and the bottom dollar is very important. Are they more concerned about possible fines and jail time something like this would now bring? After all, much of what we are seeing now is a reaction to avoiding huge fines by changing the way we do business. Are they only interested in meeting OSHA basic requirements, and had OSHA not been created, the above would be a daily occurrence somewhere in the UPS system?

Which is it? Or is it a combination of things?



Most Awesome Dog
Staff member
Welcome back, nice to hear from you.
In my opinion they are only concerned with safety, when it is the mistakes we make, not the mistakes they make.
As you know every area has their safety concerns. With drivers its on and off vehicle and lifting, and driving accidents.
With pt its load and unload. But when a ptimer is aloof and really doesnt car, it can cause driver injury, but no one wants to address it. They have the same excuse as we all do, overload, and probably rightly so.
I got my hand smashed to smitherenes trying to unjam two fifty pound boxes on top shelf, not lip loaded, jammed on top of each other, and could not get them out from underneath the rail for the door. The door could not open more than 1/2 way, and I couldnt work that way. When I finally got it unjammed, the door flew open with my hand inbetween the box and the rail. The way the box finally came down pushed my hand into a bad area. I have no clue how he even got it loaded that way. He would have had to push it on top from the side, and I do not have that kind of strength I guess. Considering that the shelf was basically empty besides these three 50 pounders, my question is why not just lip load them. I stood there cursing under my breathe as i knew in a nano second it was going to hurt like heck, not to mention how much more those pinches hurt when its cold. I have asked him to not do this, that being able to open my back door is kinda important, but he just gives me the yada yada , im too busy, too many trucks, splitting the belt etc.
My question is how can I be safe when I 1. cant open my door back door, watch for falling objects. 2. get a firm grip, when I got stacks on the floor, cant get close.
Im ok, didnt go to doctor, as it isnt broken, just badly bruised. Its pretty ugly. But would it get more follow up If I did? Its not the loaders fault he doesnt have time to adjust the load or maybe hes never been taught. But I know I dont like the pain inflicted on me by someone else not having time to do their job correctly. In the long run someone pays, be it the customer or the hourly.
In my opinion they dont care, until something bad happens. And then it will be my fault, the loaders fault, but never the companies fault.


Firstly,hi DB, good to see your still frisky.I agree that corporate is pushing to make it appear that saftey is thier main concern although the front line workers having to memorize word for word about 2 pages of saftey tips,is a far cry from actually caring about thier saftey.
I once twisted my ankle on a roll of wallcovering while attempting to select a pkg off the shelf.Of course I got the "why were you walking on our customers packages"well duh...I suggested that they could install straps from the wheel well to the middle shelf to secure these types of packages to stop them from rolling around,and nothing ever came of that.I spent that peak doling out calendars to the drivers and they still made me go out and deliver air letters in deep snow and ice ruts.
In my case I had a scrambled leg.

Brown Dog

Brown since 81
I think the two posts above mine are right on the mark. Most of it is lip service except when OSHA or an injury is involved. I guess that's where alot of my negativity about UPS comes from. I do not believe UPS is serious about safety except when $:greedy: is involved. I have witnessed first hand supes directing loaders into a trailer with noxious fumes. Production over people. I used to think we were all in this together, company and hourly, but now I think upper mngt doesn't care near as much about employees and safety as it does about production and lining their pockets off our backs. I know not every mgmt person is a cold hearted, calculating, insensitive, moneygrabbing, push you under the bus to climb the corporate ladder type of person. BUT 75% of the ones I've known and worked for HAVE been. I know I come off as a complainer and a whiner here at BC. I really don't say much at work, just do my job, and get home. I have also noticed that sometimes my being quiet and reserved at work is sometimes perceived as being weak and easy to manipulate. I have had to fight for my rights. But you have to know your rights first. Safety is first with me, but not with the company:angry:


I had a sup on road with me one time. When I got to my first stop I pulled up to back to a door and as I was slowing to a stop the sup released his seat belt and jumped out of the truck. I was dumfounded that he would do this and by the time I got backed to the door I was hot!!!!! He felt that he had to watch me back. I personally do not like this practice ( sup out of the car to watch me back- I feel that it just makes me have to watch one more thing while backing and I don't need the extra distraction). Anyway after I grabbed my diad and I was exitting the vehicle I let the sup have it. He had asked me a question (don't remeber what), I answered him and said "and by the way, DON'T EVER JUMP OUT OF MY TRUCK WHEN IT'S MOVING". He did not say one word to me, did not respond to my statement, apologize, nothing. But he definately knew I had nailed him!!!!!!!!!!!! It's a good thing he never did it again because I absolutely would have stopped right then and there and not moved until he was OFF my truck. Just goes to prove that they don't care very much about what they preach.l

Dirty Savage

Paranoid Android
Yes, we all know UPS loves to preach safety. Did you all receive your brown rubber bracelets which state "Make safety a personal value"? Guess that's there way of stating the obvious. But, is anything really being done to inforce this? To wit: I've been here for four years now and about once a month all us drivers get together for a pre-work safety meeting wherein we discuss safety issues and ways to remedy them. Well, for four years now I have made it known that our centre is without an eye-wash station. Well, ok, we have a station, but there is no eye-wash bottle. Four years I've been bringing this up and as of last Friday . . . still no bottle. Seems trivial but there was a time about six months ago when I did get something in my eye and I had to have another driver flush my eye with water from her personal water bottle. Kinda unsanitary but it got the job done. So yeah, I would be apt to agree that UPS loves to talk safety but they never actually do anything about it until someone gets hurt, and then it's always the employees fault.

End rant.


free at last.......
Back in the early days of union organization, the main concerns were low pay, long hours and safety. We're still struggling with the long hours and safety (which in my opinion go hand in hand).

I'd be willing to bet that there is more money being spent lobbying for relaxed laws dealing with safety than any other regulated item. And this is not limited to one company, but many.

There is a cost to doing business in a safe manner. There is also a cost in doing it unsafely. Unfortunately, the cost in doing business safely is an upfront cost. One that a company can more easily control. The beancounters can see that expense. They don't see (or won't see) the expense of an unsafe act until it has happened. Another example of what happens when you try to run a business on paper and don't project beyond that.

Ultimately, we are in charge of our own personal safety. There are many things we can and should do everyday to assure our safety. Some things are not in our total control, such as equipment and the actions of others. We have to have some faith that our company is looking out for us. That faith is wearing thin in the corporate climate we find ourselves in these days.

Make sure you are doing everything in your power to work safely. Not only for you...... but for your family and the general public. It's your concern and not the companys' that will get you home safe and healthy everyday.


Well-Known Member
imo Safety is a #1 concern when it affects thier total service plan and thier osha reportable injuries. If the center manager is alloted 2 accidents and 1 injury a month and dont make thier quota, why should it affect thier bonus towards the end of the year. All about dollars and cents, bottom line.
A blanket message during an ice storm to be off the clock by 7pm for safety reasons is more a slap in the face than a concern.


Cardboard picker upper
when i worked preload i was unloading a trailer that got pulled from the door before i was finished in it. i fell in the floor and cut a rather large gash above my eye. my sup had the guts to tell me that if i had been working faster that trailer would have been unloaded and i would have not been in it. after that, i made sure to fill out every accident report i could get my hands on. the guy who pulled it said the sup had told him it was done. i think he got in trouble for not checking it himself as well. just goes to show you how much they care for thier people.


While working the yard, I have seen a great number of items that would need attention in the safety area, and there were mgmt in the yard at that time and nothing was said. This was during the busy season so there is a lot of stress, but Safety for safety sakes....I have my doubts.