Ethics
- Thread starter ok2bclever
- Start date
susiedriver
Well-Known Member
I agree Wily, the leaker should be punished.wily_old_vet said:
ok2bclever
I Re Member
Glad you think so danny, I know I have said I am not sure before.
I didn't really think you would agree with that statement anyway.
Never even considered that the program used poinits.
Heck, I'll even admit I don't know what a poinit is .
I didn't really think you would agree with that statement anyway.
Never even considered that the program used poinits.
Heck, I'll even admit I don't know what a poinit is .
Last edited:
ok2bclever
I Re Member
Hey, we all make mitsakes now and then. 
So what are you doing with your days now that you aren't delivering packages and fighting the good fight?
You haven't been retired long enough to start saying that crap about how you are busier now than you were before you retired, have you?
So what are you doing with your days now that you aren't delivering packages and fighting the good fight?
You haven't been retired long enough to start saying that crap about how you are busier now than you were before you retired, have you?
dannyboy
From the promised LAND
Actually I am busy. Between the wife, kids, church, and fullfilling some dreams, I am working longer hours than before. But I dont mind and really enjoy it.
I try and meet the other drivers for lunch once a week if I can, just to keep up with things.
And it is strange to be invited to the breakfast once a month with other retired drivers, many of whom I loaded trucks for.
And yes I do miss it. The comeraderie between drivers, the customers most of all. At least 4 times a week I still get calls from drivers before start time asking for advice. This morning it was a driver that got a three day suspension. What can I say. He always had a really bad attitude. I told him with what happened he was lucky to not be fired.
And as I went by the center to drop off some late NDA outbound, I saw the vast fleet of rentals, and glad I dont have to crawl through that small hole ever again.
But it has been a good ride, and I gave it my best. And looking at what I have, much of that is due to having a good job.
Now off to Sams to get a new keyboard. OR is it costco? I guess I will know after the weekend.
d
I try and meet the other drivers for lunch once a week if I can, just to keep up with things.
And it is strange to be invited to the breakfast once a month with other retired drivers, many of whom I loaded trucks for.
And yes I do miss it. The comeraderie between drivers, the customers most of all. At least 4 times a week I still get calls from drivers before start time asking for advice. This morning it was a driver that got a three day suspension. What can I say. He always had a really bad attitude. I told him with what happened he was lucky to not be fired.
And as I went by the center to drop off some late NDA outbound, I saw the vast fleet of rentals, and glad I dont have to crawl through that small hole ever again.
But it has been a good ride, and I gave it my best. And looking at what I have, much of that is due to having a good job.
Now off to Sams to get a new keyboard. OR is it costco? I guess I will know after the weekend.
d
wkmac
Well-Known Member
tieguy
Banned
interesting article WK. Probably too complex a concept for me to even take a side on at this point and a concept I really have not pondered on to any great lengths. I assume the state referred to is our government?All of us I would think have a belief on how much government involvement we feel we need in our lives. I personally believe in less overall government. I personally believe the government will often overemphasize its importance to society. The total elimination of government to me is uncomprehendable. I would think you would still have people within a society who would still wish to position theirselves into some type of leadership role. Once that leadership role is taken it would seem there would then be an evolution towards governing others. The TV show survivor is a great example as you see contestants develop leadership roles while trying to stay low. You would almost need a government or leardership group of some type formed to prevent the state from reforming itself? I'm not sure if the morality issue really defines the existence or need for the state. In its simplest form the state which could be your neighbors may need to be organized to the benifit of the common good. The building of roads , education of your children feeding and caring for those who are not able to fend for theirselves. Defending yourself against other states who wish to take what you have. I realize I'm dabling in this subject at a grass roots level but I'm trying to imagine a society without any government or goverment guidance at all. When I do so mentally I picture the caveman evolving into what we have today. Even in the commune type scenario; you still would have to have someone in a leadership position to organize the teamwork. The leader of that commune would then become the state and probably evolve into a leadership group as different needs arose. Anyway interesting concept probably a great beer discussion
Last edited:
tieguy
Banned
"I agree Wily, the leaker should be punished."
This issue has absolutely nothing to do with someone committing a crime that needs to be brought to justice. In fact there is a good chance that her covert CIA role was overstated.
This issue is pure politics. The democrats believe its the smoking gun. Their belief that this issue if pursued could end up proving the bush administration knew there were no WMD's and unnecessarily drew us into Iraq.
I believed Clinton should have paid the price for what amounts to sexual harrassment in the workplace.
If the evidence proves that Bush and Cheney knowingly entered Iraq under false pretenses then I would have no problem holding him accountable for his actions. I will never support the use of our troops for contrived reasons.
The two year grand jury with perjury charges that may possibly be generated off faulty recolections of past events does not meet the test. If you were to ask me my recolections of conversations that took place over two years ago there is a good chance I would get at least some of the information wrong.
For now I'm willing to let the investigation continue unabated ( not that I can stop it) to answer the question of whether our troops were put into harms way for contrived reasons. But everything I see at this point tells me that the connection between a leaker and a Bush / Cheney WMD consipiracy tells me its a heck of a stretch.
This issue has absolutely nothing to do with someone committing a crime that needs to be brought to justice. In fact there is a good chance that her covert CIA role was overstated.
This issue is pure politics. The democrats believe its the smoking gun. Their belief that this issue if pursued could end up proving the bush administration knew there were no WMD's and unnecessarily drew us into Iraq.
I believed Clinton should have paid the price for what amounts to sexual harrassment in the workplace.
If the evidence proves that Bush and Cheney knowingly entered Iraq under false pretenses then I would have no problem holding him accountable for his actions. I will never support the use of our troops for contrived reasons.
The two year grand jury with perjury charges that may possibly be generated off faulty recolections of past events does not meet the test. If you were to ask me my recolections of conversations that took place over two years ago there is a good chance I would get at least some of the information wrong.
For now I'm willing to let the investigation continue unabated ( not that I can stop it) to answer the question of whether our troops were put into harms way for contrived reasons. But everything I see at this point tells me that the connection between a leaker and a Bush / Cheney WMD consipiracy tells me its a heck of a stretch.
wkmac
Well-Known Member
wily_old_vet
Well-Known Member
]"I agree Wily, the leaker should be punished."
This issue has absolutely nothing to do with someone committing a crime that needs to be brought to justice. In fact there is a good chance that her covert CIA role was overstated.
Tie-for once I have to stand up for Susie (gasp, ohmygod the sky is falling). She was responding to a statement I made about the leak of information about the "secret" CIA prisons.
This issue has absolutely nothing to do with someone committing a crime that needs to be brought to justice. In fact there is a good chance that her covert CIA role was overstated.
Tie-for once I have to stand up for Susie (gasp, ohmygod the sky is falling). She was responding to a statement I made about the leak of information about the "secret" CIA prisons.
wkmac
Well-Known Member
wkmac
Well-Known Member
Saw this stuff out on the net. Whether true or not I can not say but I'd not be surprised to learn it's all true and worse. The real truth is there is hypocrisy and lack of ethics on all sides in politics. JMCO! (just my cynical opinion) What you see below is as I found these so-called facts as stated out on the net. Again, take with grain of salt until you confirm for yourself.
1)Filmmaker Michael Moore insists that corporations are evil and claims he doesn't invest in the stock market due to moral principle. But Moore's IRS forms, viewed by Schweizer, show that over the past five years he has owned shares in such corporate giants as Halliburton, Merck, Pfizer, Sunoco, Tenet Healthcare, Ford, General Electric and McDonald's.
2)Staunch union supporter Rep. Nancy Pelosi (Calif.) has received the Cesar Chavez Award from the United Farmworkers Union. But the $25 million Northern California vineyard she and her husband own is a non-union shop.
The hypocrisy doesn't end there. Pelosi has received more money from the Hotel Employees and Restaurant Employees union than any other member of Congress in recent election cycles.
3)But the Pelosis own a large stake in an exclusive hotel in Rutherford, Calif. It has more than 250 employees. But none of them are in a union, according to Schweizer, author of "The Bushes: Portrait of a Dynasty" and a regular contributor to the New York Times, Wall Street Journal and other periodicals.
4)The Pelosis are also partners in a restaurant chain called Piatti, which has 900 employees. The chain is – that's right, a non-union shop.
5)Ralph Nader is another liberal who claims that unions are essential to protect worker rights. But when an editor of one of his publications tried to form a union to ameliorate miserable working conditions, the editor was fired and the locks changed on the office door.
6)Self-described socialist Noam Chomsky has described the Pentagon as "the most vile institution on the face of the earth" and lashed out against tax havens and trusts that benefit only the rich.
But Chomsky has been paid millions of dollars by the Pentagon over the last 40 years, and he used a venerable law firm to set up his irrevocable trust to shield his assets from the IRS.
7)Air America radio host Al Franken says conservatives are racist because they lack diversity and oppose affirmative action. But fewer than 1 percent of the people he has hired over the past 15 years have been African-American.
8)Ted Kennedy has fought for the estate tax and spoken out against tax shelters. But he has repeatedly benefited from an intricate web of trusts and private foundations that have shielded most of his family's fortune from the IRS.
9)One Kennedy family trust wasn't even set up in the U.S., but in Fiji.
Another family member, environmentalist Robert Kennedy Jr., has said that it is not moral to profit from natural resources. But he receives an annual check from the family's large holdings in the oil industry.
10)Barbra Streisand has talked about the necessity of unions to protect a "living wage." But she prefers to do her filming and postproduction work in Canada, where she can pay less than American union wages.
11)Bill and Hillary Clinton have spoken in favor of the estate tax, and in 2000 Bill vetoed a bill seeking to end it. But the Clintons have set up a contract trust that allows them to substantially reduce the amount of inheritance tax their estate will pay when they die.
Hillary, for her part, has written and spoken extensively about the right of children to make major decisions regarding their own lives, including having abortions without parental notification.
12)But she barred 13-year-old daughter Chelsea from getting her ears pierced and forbid the teen from watching MTV or HBO.
13)Billionaire Bush-basher George Soros says the wealthy should pay higher, more progressive tax rates. But he holds the bulk of his money in tax-free overseas accounts in Curacao, Bermuda and the Cayman Islands.
What you see below is as I found these so-called facts as stated out on the net. Again, take with grain of salt until you confirm for yourself. 1)Filmmaker Michael Moore insists that corporations are evil and claims he doesn't invest in the stock market due to moral principle. But Moore's IRS forms, viewed by Schweizer, show that over the past five years he has owned shares in such corporate giants as Halliburton, Merck, Pfizer, Sunoco, Tenet Healthcare, Ford, General Electric and McDonald's.
2)Staunch union supporter Rep. Nancy Pelosi (Calif.) has received the Cesar Chavez Award from the United Farmworkers Union. But the $25 million Northern California vineyard she and her husband own is a non-union shop.
The hypocrisy doesn't end there. Pelosi has received more money from the Hotel Employees and Restaurant Employees union than any other member of Congress in recent election cycles.
3)But the Pelosis own a large stake in an exclusive hotel in Rutherford, Calif. It has more than 250 employees. But none of them are in a union, according to Schweizer, author of "The Bushes: Portrait of a Dynasty" and a regular contributor to the New York Times, Wall Street Journal and other periodicals.
4)The Pelosis are also partners in a restaurant chain called Piatti, which has 900 employees. The chain is – that's right, a non-union shop.
5)Ralph Nader is another liberal who claims that unions are essential to protect worker rights. But when an editor of one of his publications tried to form a union to ameliorate miserable working conditions, the editor was fired and the locks changed on the office door.
6)Self-described socialist Noam Chomsky has described the Pentagon as "the most vile institution on the face of the earth" and lashed out against tax havens and trusts that benefit only the rich.
But Chomsky has been paid millions of dollars by the Pentagon over the last 40 years, and he used a venerable law firm to set up his irrevocable trust to shield his assets from the IRS.
7)Air America radio host Al Franken says conservatives are racist because they lack diversity and oppose affirmative action. But fewer than 1 percent of the people he has hired over the past 15 years have been African-American.
8)Ted Kennedy has fought for the estate tax and spoken out against tax shelters. But he has repeatedly benefited from an intricate web of trusts and private foundations that have shielded most of his family's fortune from the IRS.
9)One Kennedy family trust wasn't even set up in the U.S., but in Fiji.
Another family member, environmentalist Robert Kennedy Jr., has said that it is not moral to profit from natural resources. But he receives an annual check from the family's large holdings in the oil industry.
10)Barbra Streisand has talked about the necessity of unions to protect a "living wage." But she prefers to do her filming and postproduction work in Canada, where she can pay less than American union wages.
11)Bill and Hillary Clinton have spoken in favor of the estate tax, and in 2000 Bill vetoed a bill seeking to end it. But the Clintons have set up a contract trust that allows them to substantially reduce the amount of inheritance tax their estate will pay when they die.
Hillary, for her part, has written and spoken extensively about the right of children to make major decisions regarding their own lives, including having abortions without parental notification.
12)But she barred 13-year-old daughter Chelsea from getting her ears pierced and forbid the teen from watching MTV or HBO.
13)Billionaire Bush-basher George Soros says the wealthy should pay higher, more progressive tax rates. But he holds the bulk of his money in tax-free overseas accounts in Curacao, Bermuda and the Cayman Islands.
Last edited:
ok2bclever
I Re Member
Interesting, you feel it is worthwhile to post all anti-democratic gossip that you haven't bothered to confirm.
Of course, it wouldn't do any good to put any anti-libertarian crud up here because no one would recognize any of the names or care.
Of course, it wouldn't do any good to put any anti-libertarian crud up here because no one would recognize any of the names or care.
wkmac
Well-Known Member
Never know I might beat you to it! Actually the so-called facts are in a published book now out , and yeah it's a rightwinger of course that I stumbled on via a link, but like I said and since the thread was about ethics, I assumed all ethics were opened for comment but I guess I was wrong and this only applies to one side of the political isle. I didn't strike a nerve did I?
Personally I believe all the politicos on all sides, even libertarians too, have major skeltons in all their closets and if one looks hard at all sides they will find them. I just want to limit their power to keep them from throwing their skeltons into my life where I have to work that much harder to help them rid themselves of it!
Be careful, your real loyalities may begin to show and my thoughts of your self described political independence may wain!
Personally I believe all the politicos on all sides, even libertarians too, have major skeltons in all their closets and if one looks hard at all sides they will find them. I just want to limit their power to keep them from throwing their skeltons into my life where I have to work that much harder to help them rid themselves of it!
Be careful, your real loyalities may begin to show and my thoughts of your self described political independence may wain!
