What Should We Do If Fred Wins?

UnconTROLLed

perfection
From my understanding, under the new Federal Labor Law which took affect on July 1st, if we "lose" this and it is voted on without the language in it we could still go union if a major card action goes into play. Even though it will still have to be on a national level, the fact that it will only take a majority of card signers to win. While yes, this is still quite labor intensive and a lot of grunt work will be involved, we can still show frederick how most of us feel. Even if only 1 card is signed at each location and that person votes yes, the entire system will still have to go union under the new law. This is something to think about as well as the new law states that only a majority of card signers and no longer the 50+1 rule in effect. Maybe this is what Jimmie and the boys have been waiting for.

You do realize that Fred has enough money to pay off "no" voters too, right? IMO FedEx Express will never go union aside from those that already are.
 

LTFedExer

Well-Known Member
About what I would expect from you. I understand things quite well. You aren't getting what you want and you are PO'd. You want everyone to act as you say and if not then "shut-up". Very Rush Limbaugh like. I have a three year old who acts like that too sometimes. She's cute though.
It's not hard to act more grown up than MrFedEx when he doesn't get what he wants or when someone doesn't agree with him.
From my understanding, under the new Federal Labor Law which took affect on July 1st, if we "lose" this and it is voted on without the language in it we could still go union if a major card action goes into play. Even though it will still have to be on a national level, the fact that it will only take a majority of card signers to win. While yes, this is still quite labor intensive and a lot of grunt work will be involved, we can still show frederick how most of us feel. Even if only 1 card is signed at each location and that person votes yes, the entire system will still have to go union under the new law. This is something to think about as well as the new law states that only a majority of card signers and no longer the 50+1 rule in effect. Maybe this is what Jimmie and the boys have been waiting for.
This is true Mayor, but that's not good enough for MrFedEx. Again, he wants it the way HE wants.....any other way is not good enough. The only reason this option does not appease MrFedEx is because he is afraid that if it did go to a national vote, the union would not be voted in.
Majority of Fedex employees are happy with their non union jobs.I dont see Fedex unionizing any time soon.
Possible, but unless a vote was taken, we wouldn't know......would we?
You do realize that Fred has enough money to pay off "no" voters too, right? IMO FedEx Express will never go union aside from those that already are.
I can't believe I read this.
 

MrFedEx

Engorged Member
It's not hard to act more grown up than MrFedEx when he doesn't get what he wants or when someone doesn't agree with him.

This is true Mayor, but that's not good enough for MrFedEx. Again, he wants it the way HE wants.....any other way is not good enough. The only reason this option does not appease MrFedEx is because he is afraid that if it did go to a national vote, the union would not be voted in.

Possible, but unless a vote was taken, we wouldn't know......would we?

I can't believe I read this.

Right. You cannot believe that FedEx would either pay-off people or apply pressure not to vote for a union. Perhaps you and FedEx Driver should compare notes and return to reality. Again, why is Fred pushing so hard to keep his RLA exemption if he "knows" that the new July 1st language will result in a union anyway because it's so "easy" now to vote one in. The answer should be obvious even to you.

In states and areas where union support is weak, FedEx can apply pressure to intimidate employees into thinking they will lose their jobs if they vote for a union. Even with the liberalized RLA voting changes, it's still all or nothing, and Fred is counting on being able to win.

You and others like you simply amaze me. All FedEx has ever had to was be fair and do the right thing, and because they've had the RLA, their choice was always "no". I'm not on the Hoffa payroll, and I would have loved to seen Fred do the "right" things, but he didn't, and chose to maximize profits instead of standing by his employees. The RLA has allowed him to basically do whatever he wanted to since 1973, and in the early years, Fred chose the high road. Over time, however, his anti-union "shield" has created a means for him to take the low road, and even during the peak profit years, FedEx kept taking away. Why? Because they could, and there was absolutely nothing we could do about it. I don't admire Hoffa or the IBT, but they're still a better choice than Fred.

At our most recent meeting with our MD, I mentioned the RLA fight in DC, and asked him if we could hear the Teamster side of the story too. He promptly wrote my name down on his notepad, refused to even answer the question, and went on to the next talking point. When another courier asked a similar question, her name was also written down, and the question ignored.

Since everyone is so happy and doesn't want a union, just end the exemption so we can all just simply vote on it and let everyone know we hate unions and love FedEx. That's what you and FedEx Driver are saying, right? The "vast majority" love Fred, so just let us show-it, OK?
 

vantexan

Well-Known Member
Right. You cannot believe that FedEx would either pay-off people or apply pressure not to vote for a union. Perhaps you and FedEx Driver should compare notes and return to reality. Again, why is Fred pushing so hard to keep his RLA exemption if he "knows" that the new July 1st language will result in a union anyway because it's so "easy" now to vote one in. The answer should be obvious even to you.

In states and areas where union support is weak, FedEx can apply pressure to intimidate employees into thinking they will lose their jobs if they vote for a union. Even with the liberalized RLA voting changes, it's still all or nothing, and Fred is counting on being able to win.

You and others like you simply amaze me. All FedEx has ever had to was be fair and do the right thing, and because they've had the RLA, their choice was always "no". I'm not on the Hoffa payroll, and I would have loved to seen Fred do the "right" things, but he didn't, and chose to maximize profits instead of standing by his employees. The RLA has allowed him to basically do whatever he wanted to since 1973, and in the early years, Fred chose the high road. Over time, however, his anti-union "shield" has created a means for him to take the low road, and even during the peak profit years, FedEx kept taking away. Why? Because they could, and there was absolutely nothing we could do about it. I don't admire Hoffa or the IBT, but they're still a better choice than Fred.

At our most recent meeting with our MD, I mentioned the RLA fight in DC, and asked him if we could hear the Teamster side of the story too. He promptly wrote my name down on his notepad, refused to even answer the question, and went on to the next talking point. When another courier asked a similar question, her name was also written down, and the question ignored.

Since everyone is so happy and doesn't want a union, just end the exemption so we can all just simply vote on it and let everyone know we hate unions and love FedEx. That's what you and FedEx Driver are saying, right? The "vast majority" love Fred, so just let us show-it, OK?

I don't see them paying people off. First, they'd have to pay a very large number of people a substantial amount of money. I'm pretty certain that would be highly illegal and there are way too many loose ends involved. It's not like they can run down to skid row and recruit bums for $20. You'd have to have enough people willing to break the law and keep quiet about it. And they'd have to be employees. Just trying to recruit tens of thousands of people would set off rumors. And land people in jail. And I doubt those people are going to serve prison terms quietly out of loyalty to FedEx. Life isn't a nicely written movie script. Scandals like these are messy, and those at the top have too much to lose. Better to just scare people with the evils of unions, pretty easy to do in a bad economy. It's up to the union to educate employees about the realities of being in a union. I've heard opinions all over the map about what would happen if we unionized, and since I'm in an anti-union area the opinions are mostly negative. If a union gets in, it'll have to be in more friendly areas, assuming we're under the NLRA. I think the more conservative areas will come around when they realize they aren't getting better pay like the others. But if we have a national vote under the RLA that's a moot point.

I personally think a national vote under the RLA would be best. Local votes under the NLRA would mean union busting moves by FedEx at the local level, picking the stations off as they go union while the rest of the company has business as usual. Literally united we stand, divided we fall. What kind of measures might they employ? How about showing up to work one morning and finding yourself locked out by corporate security? People hired behind the scenes, getting the work done using the ROADS system for both sorting freight and delivering it with ROADS manifest. Has anyone here actually used the ROADS manifest to run their rts by? So why was it implemented? There it sits, ready to be used. I think the urgency to get ROADS up and running was part of a contingency plan if the NLRA language was voted in. Remember that Congress has dragged their feet on the FAA bill. It could have easily been voted on last year when FedEx was rolling out ROADS.

I don't think FedEx really wants to spend massive amounts of money to divert freight to Ground and screw 10's of thousands of employees. Not to mention the bad PR they'll get and goodwill lost when public realizes they aren't the funny guys in the commercials. My guess is that FedEx has another plan in place, and that may be what ROADS is for. Part-timers for the sort and P1 deliveries. FTers coming in later for SOS and pups. This would eliminate most overtime and save them a huge amount of money, improving profits. And if it's their intent to keep pay progression to a trickle, it will get very tough for alot of people if they can't count on OT to meet their obligations. FedEx is of course counting very much on a victory in Congress to implement these plans. But the NMB threw a big monkey wrench into the works with the RLA rules change. So all is not lost. Just remember, FedEx may make an offer to increase pay to prevent a RLA national vote. But if they then implement a plan to not only eliminate all OT or even hold FTers to 35-37 hrs, you may not be any better off than now. I'm just hoping I won't be worse off. My point on all this is that about the only leverage we'll have is a union, or at least the right to vote for one. FedEx still holds most of the cards, and they will do whatever it takes, legally, to make sure they maintain profit margins and a high stock price.
 

MrFedEx

Engorged Member
If the RLA exemption were eliminated, how many stations would go union? If you believe FedEx Driver, LT FedExer and the rest, they'd say something like "a handful". How many is that? 3 or 4 stations full of bad-attitude "troublemakers" like me? So why not just drop the exemption and let FedEx deal with a couple of stations that choose to go union? FedEx could easily handle that. After all, aren't our pilots union? The company didn't fail, did it? That also begs this question. If the pilots were so happy, why did they vote for a union...twice? The first one was in-house, and the second one was ALPA. Simple logic should provide an answer. After all, these guys were already making good money and working for the best boss in the world. Why oh why would they want a union?

The reality is that an overwhelming number of locations would go union, and everyone knows it. Once again, what are all of you afraid of since the "overwhelming" majority of employees do not want a union. Are the rest of us going to force them to sign cards? Come on, Fred, just let it go and have us vote. Why can't you do that?
 

MrFedEx

Engorged Member
I don't see them paying people off. First, they'd have to pay a very large number of people a substantial amount of money. I'm pretty certain that would be highly illegal and there are way too many loose ends involved. It's not like they can run down to skid row and recruit bums for $20. You'd have to have enough people willing to break the law and keep quiet about it. And they'd have to be employees. Just trying to recruit tens of thousands of people would set off rumors. And land people in jail. And I doubt those people are going to serve prison terms quietly out of loyalty to FedEx. Life isn't a nicely written movie script. Scandals like these are messy, and those at the top have too much to lose. Better to just scare people with the evils of unions, pretty easy to do in a bad economy. It's up to the union to educate employees about the realities of being in a union. I've heard opinions all over the map about what would happen if we unionized, and since I'm in an anti-union area the opinions are mostly negative. If a union gets in, it'll have to be in more friendly areas, assuming we're under the NLRA. I think the more conservative areas will come around when they realize they aren't getting better pay like the others. But if we have a national vote under the RLA that's a moot point.

I personally think a national vote under the RLA would be best. Local votes under the NLRA would mean union busting moves by FedEx at the local level, picking the stations off as they go union while the rest of the company has business as usual. Literally united we stand, divided we fall. What kind of measures might they employ? How about showing up to work one morning and finding yourself locked out by corporate security? People hired behind the scenes, getting the work done using the ROADS system for both sorting freight and delivering it with ROADS manifest. Has anyone here actually used the ROADS manifest to run their rts by? So why was it implemented? There it sits, ready to be used. I think the urgency to get ROADS up and running was part of a contingency plan if the NLRA language was voted in. Remember that Congress has dragged their feet on the FAA bill. It could have easily been voted on last year when FedEx was rolling out ROADS.

I don't think FedEx really wants to spend massive amounts of money to divert freight to Ground and screw 10's of thousands of employees. Not to mention the bad PR they'll get and goodwill lost when public realizes they aren't the funny guys in the commercials. My guess is that FedEx has another plan in place, and that may be what ROADS is for. Part-timers for the sort and P1 deliveries. FTers coming in later for SOS and pups. This would eliminate most overtime and save them a huge amount of money, improving profits. And if it's their intent to keep pay progression to a trickle, it will get very tough for alot of people if they can't count on OT to meet their obligations. FedEx is of course counting very much on a victory in Congress to implement these plans. But the NMB threw a big monkey wrench into the works with the RLA rules change. So all is not lost. Just remember, FedEx may make an offer to increase pay to prevent a RLA national vote. But if they then implement a plan to not only eliminate all OT or even hold FTers to 35-37 hrs, you may not be any better off than now. I'm just hoping I won't be worse off. My point on all this is that about the only leverage we'll have is a union, or at least the right to vote for one. FedEx still holds most of the cards, and they will do whatever it takes, legally, to make sure they maintain profit margins and a high stock price.

FedEx would never pay people off directly. They'd pressure people the same way they always have, through intimidation and harassment.
 

UnconTROLLed

perfection
I could see it happening. Not saying it will or will not, but it would not surprise me. FedEx is ruthless, and if what I see at UPS goes on every day (dealmaking, extra raises, I saw one person get a $4,000 "pay adjustment" when they were only owed $240...) I would imagine anything is possible over there.
 

MrFedEx

Engorged Member
I could see it happening. Not saying it will or will not, but it would not surprise me. FedEx is ruthless, and if what I see at UPS goes on every day (dealmaking, extra raises, I saw one person get a $4,000 "pay adjustment" when they were only owed $240...) I would imagine anything is possible over there.

There are so many special deals and double-standards at FedEx. Yes, ruthless is a good word for it.
 

vantexan

Well-Known Member
If the RLA exemption were eliminated, how many stations would go union? If you believe FedEx Driver, LT FedExer and the rest, they'd say something like "a handful". How many is that? 3 or 4 stations full of bad-attitude "troublemakers" like me? So why not just drop the exemption and let FedEx deal with a couple of stations that choose to go union? FedEx could easily handle that. After all, aren't our pilots union? The company didn't fail, did it? That also begs this question. If the pilots were so happy, why did they vote for a union...twice? The first one was in-house, and the second one was ALPA. Simple logic should provide an answer. After all, these guys were already making good money and working for the best boss in the world. Why oh why would they want a union?

The reality is that an overwhelming number of locations would go union, and everyone knows it. Once again, what are all of you afraid of since the "overwhelming" majority of employees do not want a union. Are the rest of us going to force them to sign cards? Come on, Fred, just let it go and have us vote. Why can't you do that?

But hasn't the RLA exemption been eliminated with the NMB rules change? We can now have a national vote with a simple majority of participating employees, not possible before. Now the issue is whether we'll do it that way or, if Congress approves it, be classified under the NLRA and have local elections. So no matter what Congress does now we can still vote in a union. FedEx certainly thought the new rules were unfair to them, challenging it, and losing, in court.
 

bbsam

Moderator
Staff member
This whole thread reminds me of the beginning of one of the "Raiders of the Lost Ark" movies. "Ya lost today, kid. Doesn't mean ya gotta like it."
 

MrFedEx

Engorged Member
This whole thread reminds me of the beginning of one of the "Raiders of the Lost Ark" movies. "Ya lost today, kid. Doesn't mean ya gotta like it."

The battle might be lost, but not the war. Even if the RLA goes Fred's way, he's going to have his hands full. Intimidation and harassment are a way of life at FedEx and firmly ingrained in the culture. Unless you work there, it's hard to understand the mentality at work. Anyone who wants to find out the way it works, please show-up for work with a Teamsters button on your uniform (forbidden), and then ask to distrbute union literature in the breakroom, OK? Then, after work, stand outside with literature or a sign that says "FedEx is anti-union". Think there will be any consequences for you?
 

MrFedEx

Engorged Member
I'm really not trying to argue with you but harass tens of thousands of people? Really?

Don't you think your name is on-file somewhere in the company for what you've written here and after identifying yourself? Being intimidated is just the status quo at FedEx. People are so afraid to say what they really think because they know there will be fallout for them personally. Years of indoctrination have had the desired effct in many cases.
 

vantexan

Well-Known Member
Don't you think your name is on-file somewhere in the company for what you've written here and after identifying yourself? Being intimidated is just the status quo at FedEx. People are so afraid to say what they really think because they know there will be fallout for them personally. Years of indoctrination have had the desired effct in many cases.

Yes, but they know what was done to me and why I'm mad. If they were going to do anything to me they would've done it already. Appears instead that they acted on some info I supplied and corrected a bad situation. Besides, things can only get better, so what does it matter? But trying to intimidate everyone in a station? I've seen couriers go after mgrs in the past, just don't see it happening.
 

Cactus

Just telling it like it is
Majority of Fedex employees are happy with their non union jobs.I dont see Fedex unionizing any time soon.

I hope you do call in sick and try it and end up getting fired because of it.Then you end up applying for a job over at UPS and we can read your stupid rants about how UPS sucks.I******************************

Wow.

Let me tell you something. If integrity were martial arts, you'd have a black-belt in brown-nosing.

Is Fred S your master?
 
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