caught supe altering timecards

DSM515

Well-Known Member
This is no laughing matter, theft is theft. He is stealing from you flat out and breaking state law. I would make sure you have all the proof on your side. make copies, and follow the right due process. You have talked to your center manager give him two days to fire this theif. Then if he doesn't file a grievance for theft and ask for his job and a review of your time cards for the entire time he has been in your center. Then you want all time owed to you paid in double time. But be ready for them to be after you and keep doing your job by the book. good luck and don't let this theif get off the hook he/they would never let you off for theft as they/you shouldn't let him.
 

satellitedriver

Moderator
Nothing new.
I have seen 5 center manager's and 2 center "teams" disappear, for falsifying records.
In the last 25 yrs, I have always had an open honest relationship with all my supervisors and I knew the pressures placed upon them.
There are 2 main reasons I never agreed to go into management.
The first reason was that I would not be mobile. I watched as a manager was "transferred" on a Friday and had to report to a far away location on Monday, with total disregard for his wife's job and his children's schooling needs.
The second reason was in my first year when I had to lock the office door and talk down my center manager while he had a nervous breakdown.-( I learned what was expected from a center manager)-
That conversation/counseling session was a great experience for myself and him.
He took my advice and quit UPS and went on to follow his passion and has done great work managing relief organizations serving third world countries.
I decided to be just a driver.


 

over9five

Moderator
Staff member
This could not be true. UPS mgmt would never do this, they are perfect, they tell me this all the time.
They also tell me my load is perfect daily, the preload perfect. The night sort Perfect.
The CEO perfect.
The Board of Directors, Perfect.
The package cars, Perfect.
The lawyers at UPS Perfect.
The Plan is Perfect.
The only thing at UPS that is not perfect at UPS is the drivers.

Yup, the drivers suck.
 

Integrity

Binge Poster
Don't waste your time with the ethics hotline.
Bubblehead,

I agree with your assessment of the UPS Help Line.

It has been proven to me that it is a completely unreliable internal process for handling concerns with Integrity.

Why do you say it is a waste of time?

Can you offer proof?

Sincerely,
I
 

TearsInRain

IE boogeyman
This is no laughing matter, theft is theft. He is stealing from you flat out and breaking state law. I would make sure you have all the proof on your side. make copies, and follow the right due process. You have talked to your center manager give him two days to fire this theif. Then if he doesn't file a grievance for theft and ask for his job and a review of your time cards for the entire time he has been in your center. Then you want all time owed to you paid in double time. But be ready for them to be after you and keep doing your job by the book. good luck and don't let this theif get off the hook he/they would never let you off for theft as they/you shouldn't let him.

i'm a supervisor....
 

soberups

Pees in the brown Koolaid
Nothing new.
I have seen 5 center manager's and 2 center "teams" disappear, for falsifying records.
In the last 25 yrs, I have always had an open honest relationship with all my supervisors and I knew the pressures placed upon them.

You have shared with us in previous threads the fact that you falsify your own delivery records by sheeting missed stops as "emergency conditions" on a routine basis, as instructed by your management team.

I am curious... how you can have an "open and honest" relationship with a management person who instructs you to falsify records and defraud your customers out of the refunds that they would otherwise be entitled to for those missed packages?
 

Catatonic

Nine Lives
You have shared with us in previous threads the fact that you falsify your own delivery records by sheeting missed stops as "emergency conditions" on a routine basis, as instructed by your management team.

I am curious... how you can have an "open and honest" relationship with a management person who instructs you to falsify records and defraud your customers out of the refunds that they would otherwise be entitled to for those missed packages?

The Grand Rationalizer steps into the fray ... it seems fairly hypocritical for you to be splitting hairs. LOL
 

satellitedriver

Moderator
You have shared with us in previous threads the fact that you falsify your own delivery records by sheeting missed stops as "emergency conditions" on a routine basis, as instructed by your management team.

I am curious... how you can have an "open and honest" relationship with a management person who instructs you to falsify records and defraud your customers out of the refunds that they would otherwise be entitled to for those missed packages?

You ask this direct question,
"
how you can have an "open and honest" relationship with a management person who instructs you to falsify records and defraud your customers out of the refunds that they would otherwise be entitled "
The answer is that I honestly tell my sup that it is physically impossible to make certain deliveries.
I am instructed to not sheet them as missed. I openly and honestly tell them that I will sheet them as ECON's, to satisfy their demands.
You call it falsifying records.
I call it working as directed.
You erroneously tie together two different points trying to make me culpable in a deceitful practice.
My honesty with management and my honesty with my customers.
I have made it -( openly and honestly)- well known to management that it is not safe for me to deliver after 10pm and that I refuse to work unsafe.
If a customer asks why they did not get their package, I openly and honestly tell them that I was over dispatched and I refuse to deliver after 10pm.
If they wish to file a complaint/claim, so be it, and I tell them so.

I have delivered in this rural area for 20yrs and have lived in this community for 32yrs.
When a package is a day late, I apologize and tell them the reason why they did not get their package on time. The vast majority of my customers feel sympathy for me when I show up at their homes after 9pm and tell me it could have waited till tomorrow.

Sorry, but your post had an undertone that ticked me off.
Sober, you have no clue what I have done to deliver very important packages to my customers.
Ask me about when I drove my personal car through an ice storm to get a Christmas package to a elderly widow woman on Christmas Eve.
Ask me about driving my personal car through flood waters to get much needed medicine to a cancer patient.
I could add to the list.
I am no hero, but I will go through Hell and high water when the need is there.

Also, I am sure a man of your integrity has never "falsified" any delivery record.
Integrity is not like Virginity.
Only one is lost forever.





 

soberups

Pees in the brown Koolaid
You ask this direct question,
"
how you can have an "open and honest" relationship with a management person who instructs you to falsify records and defraud your customers out of the refunds that they would otherwise be entitled "
The answer is that I honestly tell my sup that it is physically impossible to make certain deliveries.
I am instructed to not sheet them as missed. I openly and honestly tell them that I will sheet them as ECON's, to satisfy their demands.
You call it falsifying records.
I call it working as directed.

I do not for one moment doubt your personal integrity.

I do not for one moment doubt your dedication and willingness to go above and beyond for your customers.

I do not for one moment disagree with the fact that expecting you to make deliveries after 10:00 is unsafe, as well as unprofessional and inappropriate.

I am simply questioning the wisdom and ethics of falsifying one's delivery records by recording "missed" packages as "emergency conditions" when to do so means (a)denying that customer the ability to get a refund for shipping charges paid and (b) allowing your management team to dishonestly avoid facing any consequences for knowingly and intentionally overdispatching you, thereby allowing the problem to be perpetuated. Management's incompetence or unwillingess to make correct dispatch decisions is not an "emergency condition".

The fact that you have been instructed to falsify a delivery record does not make it right to do so. And, by definition, it is impossible to have an "open and honest" relationship with a superior who instructs you to be dishonest.
 

soberups

Pees in the brown Koolaid
Also, I am sure a man of your integrity has never "falsified" any delivery record.
Integrity is not like Virginity.
Only one is lost forever.

When I was a rookie driver, there were several instances where I brought dozens or even hundreds of missed stops back to the building at 10:30 or 11:00 at night.

My center manager instucted me to unload them without sheeting them or recording them on my timecard as "missed". (This was pre-DIAD when we had paper delivery records and timecards.)

I was young and naive, so I did what I was told until my shop steward caught wind of what was going on. He explained the "reality" of UPS to me. He made me aware of the fact that my dishonesty was enabling the problem to continue, and that I could be fired for that dishonesty if Loss Prevention ever found out what was occuring. He pointed out that the same supervisor who was telling me to unload the stops without recording them would, in a heartbeat, turn around and deny ever giving me such instructions if LP started investigating the situation.

From that point on I started recording missed stops as "missed" on my timecard. My supervisor threw a fit the first couple of times I did it, but it was at that point that they were forced to correct the underlying dispatch problem instead of continuing to hide it.
 

over9five

Moderator
Staff member
so i talked to my center manager yesterday; he seemed calm and just said "i'll take care of it", but i could tell he was angry as hell because his hand started shaking

we talked about it later; gonna pull up all the electronic records, build the paperwork, then bring in our security guy for the coup-de-grace
Update needed. Was it taken care of?
 

TearsInRain

IE boogeyman
Update needed. Was it taken care of?

i ended up writing a 6 page report on three separate day-events

it's been 3 weeks and i haven't heard a single thing since

i guess security just doesn't give a **** if drivers aren't filing grievances over it

from this point on i'm covering my own ass and shutting out what anyone else does; what's the point if no one's going to do anything with it....
 

menotyou

bella amicizia
i ended up writing a 6 page report on three separate day-events

it's been 3 weeks and i haven't heard a single thing since

i guess security just doesn't give a **** if drivers aren't filing grievances over it

from this point on i'm covering my own ass and shutting out what anyone else does; what's the point if no one's going to do anything with it....
The point is if these people are willing to steal from us, they will steal from you. These are the people who talked you into going into management. Feeling warm and fuzzy, yet?
 

over9five

Moderator
Staff member
yes, absolutely. once it's handed off to security, there's not much he can do without risking his job for interfering with an active investigation.
Agreed. So you both are still working side by side with the dishonest sup who has doubtless been questioned by security? How uncomfortable is that?
 

menotyou

bella amicizia
I fear tears is in for a rude awakening. I hope not, as I like how he thinks and I hope his center manager is worth his faith.
I do hope I'm wrong.
 
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