Check out: Thoroughbred Teamsters Podcast

zubenelgenubi

Well-Known Member
Have at it. By why open yourself up to it when it can be avoided?
I haven't had an issue yet. I would think the people who refuse to sign stuff make themselves a bigger target, we are to work as directed and grieve later, correct? Refusing to sign could be seen as a failure to follow instructions. It is UPS who is opening themselves for problems for so blatantly violating the contract so constantly. By extension, the Union could be opening themselves up to problems for not effectively putting a stop to the company's constant violations.
 

ManInBrown

Well-Known Member
@Thoroughbred Teamster Regarding your “got called into the office” episode......Did you file a harassment grievance for being told to attend the training because you were over allowed? Seems like an intimidation tactic to me as well as over supervision.
Agree. Out of all the episodes thats the one i clicked on and listened to about ten minutes of it. Sure sounds like harassment to me. Union doesnt recognize over/under. Sorry boss. I’ll try harder tomorrow.

And he thinks this overallowed targeting is not only happening in his center, but all across the country? Ya think? Thats all they do.
 

Overpaid Union Thug

Well-Known Member
I haven't had an issue yet. I would think the people who refuse to sign stuff make themselves a bigger target, we are to work as directed and grieve later, correct? Refusing to sign could be seen as a failure to follow instructions. It is UPS who is opening themselves for problems for so blatantly violating the contract so constantly. By extension, the Union could be opening themselves up to problems for not effectively putting a stop to the company's constant violations.
Refusing to sign a document is not failure to work as instructed. It is enforcing Articles 6 and 37.
 

BigUnionGuy

Got the T-Shirt
Maybe I am naive.
Sounds more like inexperience.

language in the contract is poorly written
No.... it's not.

It just doesn't say, what you want it to say.

panel decisions change the way the contract is interpreted and enforced.
No.... panel decisions, reinforce negotiated language.

I would love to see a judicial review of the contract, the grievance procedures, and how unevenly and haphazardly the contract has been enforced.
Please.... that sounds like "locker room lawyer" talk.

If you have questions, ask your BA? That's a farce, when they don't know they just make something up so you will go away.
It sounds like you have an adversarial relationship with your Local.

They don't agree with you.... or tell you what you want to hear.... so they suck.

The truth is we are all stumbling and bumbling through this situation, blindly, day in and day out.
Get involved with your Local.

Participate in the Local meetings, talk with members that work in different crafts.

Does your Local have a retiree's club ? Talk with them.


There are so many opportunities to learn....



-Bug-
 

zubenelgenubi

Well-Known Member
Sounds more like inexperience.
It's an admission that I don't know everything. You should try admitting that to yourself one day.

No.... it's not.
It just doesn't say, what you want it to say.
I have cited many examples of poorly written articles in various posts. It's so bad it almost seems intentional. But, what do you expect when you get a bunch of truck drivers trying to do a lawyer's job?

No.... panel decisions, reinforce negotiated language.
Maybe sometimes. But you can't honestly tell me you actually believe every panel decision is a perfect reflection of both the letter and intention of the contract.

Please.... that sounds like "locker room lawyer" talk.
I probably have a better understanding of the law and contract theory than you, but don't let that get in the way of your unyielding condescension.

It sounds like you have an adversarial relationship with your Local.

They don't agree with you.... or tell you what you want to hear.... so they suck.
Maybe you need to stop reading only want you want to believe. I will call out anyone in a position of authority when they fail to live up to their duties. But that doesn't mean I'm being adversarial. Respect is a two way street. Yes, I'll get frustrated with my interactions with people, and yes I'll come on here and vent, but you should not take that as an invitation to believe you know everything about my circumstances.

Get involved with your Local.

Participate in the Local meetings, talk with members that work in different crafts.

Does your Local have a retiree's club ? Talk with them.


There are so many opportunities to learn....



-Bug-
I am involved. I take every opportunity to learn that I can. I will call BS on anything that is BS. I'm just not saying what you want to hear so I suck.

Maybe you should listen to what other people are actually saying instead of just assuming you know more than everyone, you might just learn something.
 

zubenelgenubi

Well-Known Member
Refusing to sign a document is not failure to work as instructed. It is enforcing Articles 6 and 37.
I'm not saying it is. I am saying that management could try to take that stance on it. If article 6 gives you the right not to sign without fear of discipline, it also nullifies anything you sign anyway. You're saying management will try to use a signed document against you, in breach of contract, but will never try to discipline you for refusing to sign. I don't buy it, but it doesn't bother me in the least if you take that path. In either case we are protected from discipline by the contract, signing or not. Any other take on the situation is a disregard for the language.
 

Overpaid Union Thug

Well-Known Member
I'm not saying it is. I am saying that management could try to take that stance on it. If article 6 gives you the right not to sign without fear of discipline, it also nullifies anything you sign anyway. You're saying management will try to use a signed document against you, in breach of contract, but will never try to discipline you for refusing to sign. I don't buy it, but it doesn't bother me in the least if you take that path. In either case we are protected from discipline by the contract, signing or not. Any other take on the situation is a disregard for the language.
I wasn’t told point blank by our manager that his intent was to use signed documents to hold us accountable for accidents. They know it’s a violation. They don’t care. They also know that most drivers are pu$$ies and will sign them just to get management off their back or are just scared to refuse to sign. They will typically go after the weak. The weak tend to sign everything a supervisor shoves in front of them.
 

zubenelgenubi

Well-Known Member
Yeah....

Keep telling yourself that.

:biggrin:



-Bug-
I've demonstrated it several times. Once again, you epitomize everything wrong with the Union. With elected officials like you, who can blame members for being apathetic. Nothing we do or say will ever get through to people like you, so why bother trying?
 

UnconTROLLed

perfection
I've demonstrated it several times. Once again, you epitomize everything wrong with the Union. With elected officials like you, who can blame members for being apathetic. Nothing we do or say will ever get through to people like you, so why bother trying?
The ignore feature is great. BUG isn't here to help anyone on BC but his own self-importance. Every post is geared towards narcissism, admiring at his own reflection. Unfortunately that is what the union is for many officials, a vehicle to selfish and parasitic relationships.
 

zubenelgenubi

Well-Known Member
I wasn’t told point blank by our manager that his intent was to use signed documents to hold us accountable for accidents. They know it’s a violation. They don’t care. They also know that most drivers are pu$$ies and will sign them just to get management off their back or are just scared to refuse to sign. They will typically go after the weak. The weak tend to sign everything a supervisor shoves in front of them.
Your experience differs from mine, and I fully support you doing what you believe is best.

I'm plenty strong enough to stand up to management if they do try to use a signed paper against me. I haven't been asked to sign many things over the years. I think that the last thing I signed was my VOJS. It wasn't an agreement to do anything different, just an acknowledgement that the information was presented to me. They want me to do things differently based on the VOJS, but what they wrote on there would violate the methods. I could grieve harassment for being given contradicting orders I suppose, but there are much bigger fish to fry in my center.
 

zubenelgenubi

Well-Known Member
The ignore feature is great. BUG isn't here to help anyone on BC but his own self-importance. Every post is geared towards narcissism, admiring at his own reflection. Unfortunately that is what the union is for many officials, a vehicle to selfish and parasitic relationships.
I agree. He's always on the offense, I almost never start any of our interactions. But I have no problem standing up to bullying, and helping to expose the hypocrisy in his views, he makes it almost too easy, really. I don't argue with him because I think I'll change his mind, I do it so other people won't be lead to believe his attitude is normal or appropriate. I dare to dream the impossible dream.
 

Thoroughbred Teamster

Well-Known Member
Agree. Out of all the episodes thats the one i clicked on and listened to about ten minutes of it. Sure sounds like harassment to me. Union doesnt recognize over/under. Sorry boss. I’ll try harder tomorrow.

And he thinks this overallowed targeting is not only happening in his center, but all across the country? Ya think? Thats all they do.
I been giving them the same, consistent numbers on my route for years. When they approach me on my less productive days, they already know I got Article 37 as my first response. It doesn't faze me anymore. If they continue to approach me on this issue after this "class", I'll consider my options. Give this issue to 10 drivers and there will be 10 different ways it's handled. This thread proves it.

As for it happening all across the country, I'm sure it does. I read the news and understand the landscape. I been doing this for almost 20 years, but I don't assume it's an issue at every center because I don't know that for a fact. I'm sure most buildings share core issues with each other, but I guarantee our issues aren't exactly the same as other issues even in our district. We're a small center that was a satellite just a couple years ago. Our issues are on a smaller scale than most.

I appreciate you checking out the episode though, even if just for a few minutes.
 
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