Local 243

Discussion in 'UPS Union Issues' started by Brownpants80, Jan 15, 2019.

  1. Brownpants80

    Brownpants80 Member

    Last I heard they pushed our language through. Now seeing they are going to renegotiate. So they changed there minds and are not pushing it through for detroit rider? Anyone have any idea what's supposed to be worked on for the language?
     
  2. BigUnionGuy

    BigUnionGuy Got the T-Shirt


    You're kind of behind the 8-ball.... on information.

    (3 months late ?)



    No changes were made on that.


    The Local 243 and Detroit riders.... were required to return to the table for

    further negotiations because of the vote count.


    @browned out.... is from your area, and might be able to provide more immediate

    information on the local situation, with a list of member concerns.


    Contact him via a PM, here on the forum.



    -Bug-
     
  3. brownelf

    brownelf Active Member

    Or he could've attended the meeting at the hall a couple weeks ago...
     
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  4. browned out

    browned out Well-Known Member


    Others have told me that the 243 Leaders are incompetent at best. I have no reason to believe otherwise.

    The Latest meeting at the hall produced zero useful information. Nothing.

    Simple Questions are still left unanswered.

    Brownpants 80 should read all of the other supplements again including the NorCal supplement and then read the Metro Detroit and 243 local rider again.

    Then: decide if what you think should be addressed was addressed.

    The consensus belief here is that 243 is doing nothing. It will be voted down again. And then to our elation...…..It will be forced thru despite the members' votes; just as the national was.

    Here's to hoping against hope that at least 243 can clarify issues that should have been 100% crystal clear before the 1st vote.
     
  5. BigUnionGuy

    BigUnionGuy Got the T-Shirt


    Hold the phone.


    Aren't you the "go to" member of Local 243 ?

    Or, just another TDU shill ?


    @browned out just "outed" him/herself as not even being a member

    of this Local....


    And started a new thread.
     
  6. browned out

    browned out Well-Known Member

    What's a phone?

    I am not a member of TDU or Teamsters United.

    Although I actually pay dues which I believe is more than you do.

    If, I am mistaken and you do actually pay dues; please accept my apology.

    Otherwise; put on your big boy pants (BBP) and address the actual issues.

    Pretty simple...no???
     
  7. browned out

    browned out Well-Known Member

    0 progress was made on our rider. 0. No guarantee or clarification on the 40 hour guarantee for RPCDs. No clarification or language on bumping rights for RCPDs that did not reach 40 hours in regards to bumping 22.4s on Saturdays or Sundays. No clarification or new language on Air Drivers rights to extra work vs. 22.4 rights. No progress or clarification on paid time for time spent obtaining airport badges, etc. etc. Nothing. 243 leadership is about to find itself voted out. Look no further that Local 804's ineffective company controlled union...OUT Dallas's ineffective local leadership...OUT. Local 243....This is Strike 3 ....We vote for new leadership and 243's current (lack) of leadership is out. A darn shame.

    These issues should have been addressed in the bargaining sessions and the status should have been passed on to the members. This lack of information was detrimental to the membership, was negligent and placed the Hoffa/Taylor/243 team on the hook for possible Failure to Fulfill their Duty of Fair Representation during contract negotiations.

    We are all hoping it does not come to that. There is still time for 243 and the other outstanding locals to fix these rudimentary mistakes.
     
    Last edited: Jan 16, 2019
  8. brownelf

    brownelf Active Member

    Still trying to understand how being deadlocked in local rider negotiations can be failure to represent the membership. Sounds like a TDU shill to me too. Looking forward to supporting my executive board in their reelection campaign as a longtime steward of local 243.
     
  9. BigUnionGuy

    BigUnionGuy Got the T-Shirt


    You are starting to sound "more and more" like some TDU shill.

    Are you not aware.... that elected Union officials, pay the highest dues ?


    It's not.



    -Bug-
     
  10. browned out

    browned out Well-Known Member

    Regional Supplements, Local supplements and local riders serve many purposes. The primary objective of these supplements is to clarify and improve on language that is vague or inadequate language in the national or regional. Other reasons for the need for supplements could be very local; such as the need for paid time for a shuttle into Worldport in Louisville.

    243 has failed miserably in this duty to the members.

    Simple questions of great importance to members have never been answered. These questions were asked numerous times directly to 243 in person by hundreds of UPS teamsters. The answers we received to numerous questions addressing the proposed language from 243 and UPS management was simply "WE DON'T KNOW"

    243 has a duty; as do all locals; to read thru other local supplements and decide if any of that language could be beneficial to the members of that local. 243 obviously did not read the NorCal supplement. Otherwise that protective language would have been included in the 243 rider.

    "WE DON'T KNOW" does not fulfill a unions duty of fair representation DURING contract negotiations.

    The negligence of 243 has lead to contention in many areas that were essential to the benefit of all 243 members. There are numerous PT and FT issues but for this post I will address some of the FT issues. 243 has not addressed the issues of guaranteeing current full time drivers the right to 40 hours per week. Nor have they addressed the right of Full time drivers who have not reached 40 hours the right to bump Saturday/Sunday 22.4s so the RPCD could reach 40 hours. Or even 4 days at 10 hours to guarantee RPCDs 40 hours. OR ...BETTER YET...FULFILL YOUR DUTY OF REPSENTATION DURING CONTRACT NEGOTIAITONS AS NOR-CAL DID.

    New language was created that guarantees a not-yet existing job classification (22.4s) the absolute right to a 5 day consecutive work week with 8 hour day guarantees. Yet, no such language or adaptation of language was created for the current full time package car drivers.

    So...when UPS goes to a 22.4 Wednesday thru Sunday week; RCPDs will be laid off on Mondays and Tuesdays. These drivers will have no contractual right to make up these hours.....even though their actual work exists on Sat and Sun. (UPS easily manipulates the resi volume)

    Compounding this issue is the concrete fact that we need 1801 hours for a full year of pension credit. (4) Full-time employees will receive one (1) year of Credited Service for each 1801 paid hours in Covered Employment in a calendar year beginning on or after January 1, 2008.

    So RCPDs are laid off Mondays and Tuesdays. Lets just say they average 28 hours per week. 28 hours times 52 weeks equals 1456 hours which does not equate to a full year of Credited service.

    NorCal has obvious protections in place for its' RPCDs.

    243's lack of representation rises to a level beyond incompetence. 243 did not provide adequate language to protect the already sufficient FT work force.

    It is patently unacceptable that 243 refuses to tell the members one way or the other. 243 is not being forthright with the members. We deserve to know what we are voting on.

    243; Just tell us; NO; you can not bump a 22.4 on a Saturday or Sunday. Tell us... NO; RPCDs are not guaranteed 40 hours while 22.4s ARE absolutely guaranteed 40 hours. Transparency. Maybe's or we don't knows does not suffice. Especially when there is actual concrete, not open to interpretation language regarding 22.4s 40 hour guarantees.

    Hopefully we are not forced to file charges with the NLRB.

    Local 243's Union Representatives' incompetence has led to them not being guaranteed 40 hours per week. In the next local election; We will guarantee they receive 0 hours of pay per year.

    Start looking for a new job 243 reps; because you will be out on the street; just like the incompetent 804 and Dallas Teamster Reps.

    You are supposed to work for US; not UPS.

    The 243 leadership will be voted out.
     
    Last edited: Jan 17, 2019
  11. Sounds like Browned Out agrees with the majority of the members that voted the CBA down the first time.

    You sound like more of a true steward than the elf.
     
  12. BigUnionGuy

    BigUnionGuy Got the T-Shirt


    I think it's funny, that you come here and try to "lecture" everyone on what

    your demands are. It's almost like you're talking to Local 243.... without

    actually going to a meeting and confronting them in person.


    After all, it's you that said "others have told me" they are incompetent.



    More idle TDU threats.

    Nut up.... or shut up, and file those NLRB charges.

    We'll see how that works out for you. :biggrin:



    -Bug-
     
  13. BigUnionGuy

    BigUnionGuy Got the T-Shirt


    The majority of the members didn't bother to vote.



    In his nearly 30 years.... he has "helped" people out.

    Which means, he's a locker room lawyer.

    Not a steward.


    How can @browned out (with a straight face) make these fantasy demands,

    when he hasn't stated he has even attended a single meeting at Local 243

    over the contract and has ever met the Local leaders ?
     
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  14. Now BUG, you know it's hard to get traction on filing even valid charges on a local union.

    We've had grievances dragged out for three years locally, not docketed to the panel, the grievant filed FTR charges on the local, and the labor board tells the grievant(s)...4 of them...that as soon as the ba dockets them to the state panel they have to withdraw the charges.

    One grievant had to file twice on the same issue after 3 months because the ba refused to hear them in a timely manner and then refused to docket the multiple deadlocked grievances to the panel.

    Then the ba gloats to the rest of the eboard that all the labor charges against him are always dropped.

    It's failure on the BA's part that members had to file charges to make a BA do their job.

    The labor board will pursue a company with charges but the effort to right the wrongs in a union local is mundane at best.
     
  15. BigUnionGuy

    BigUnionGuy Got the T-Shirt


    When a member files charges against their Local, they are "the moving party"

    and are saddled with the burden of proof. You just can't make accusations.



    You're not going to like hearing this....


    But, the "rules of procedure" for that Panel requires that grievances deadlocked

    at the local level must be docketed for the state within 2 panels. If not, they

    are considered untimely. The exception being discharges, which the company

    incurs no further liability after that point.


    So.... all of those grievance's are untimely, at this point.



    Have your members ever filed internal charges ?



    -Bug-
     
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  16. The voting percentages were the highest in the years I've worked there.
    I'm not in 243 but his issues posted, regardless of his local participation, is what drove the highest percentage of voters to participate this time.

    The percent that voted was not far from the percent necessary to send it back to the table across the board and I will tell you that the perception among members is that as long as H and H are #1 & #2 their votes dont matter therefore the other meager 5 or 6 % needed to have the thing renegotiated have either given up or are comprised of new members who will find a better job in the next 6-9 months and dust their feet off on a company that nets billions but treats them like galley slaves with no insurance and a whopping 3.5 hr guarantee at a poverty wage.

    There's a reason why people are apathetic and it's not just apathy, it's that they've lost faith in this union. We understand that all too well.
     
  17. It doesnt bother me to hear the truth. I embrace it.

    I can fill this page with the absolute garbage that our local has pulled over the years and evidently there's a really strange relationship between the labor mgr and the ba because the member who had multiple grievances heard locally and accrued over a 3 yr period finally gave up and filed nlrb charges. Out of desperation letters and documents were also sent to leaders in the JC, Central Region, and to the Intl VP who gave them to "someone" in Wash DC.

    After three years, the member's grievance (1 of many) finally got docketed to the panel. Our member won and the company had to pay the rest of them based on the outcome of that 1 decision. After three years.

    So, what is going on here BUG? You think this is the only time the labor mgr and the BA have attempted to screw over members? For years this has gone on. Years.

    We have the witnesses and the documentation. This isnt all done under a rock. There are other folks in the system who turn a blind eye to this ba's actions.

    We hate the local because of this corrupt activity and our building is not the only one affected by this cancer.

    Worthless piece of garbage.
     
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  18. browned out

    browned out Well-Known Member

  19. browned out

    browned out Well-Known Member

    BUG; how about some answers? We can handle the truth.

    No lecture kid; only a search for answers. For some unknown reason, you want to name call, insinuate that I am TDU or Teamsters United; and make ignorant statements with no factual basis. It would be refreshing if you would actually address some of the issues.

    I have been a PT committee man, a PT Union steward, and a FT alternate steward and acting FT steward when others were off. I would be a Full Time steward if I was eligible to run last election. Being on a medical leave of absence is the only reason I am not one of the FT stewards.

    I have been to numerous union meetings which were an absolute waste of time; totally useless. I have contact with the local leadership but not as much contact as the stewards do. 243 conducts stewards only meetings. I am in contact with 7 buildings including 2 hubs. So, these contacts allow me to come to an accurate conclusion that the consensus of the stewards in those meetings is that 243 is incompetent. 243 refuses to answer the stewards' questions that directly relate to changes in pay, working conditions and terms of employment. So; when the stewards come back to the barns; they have 0 answers.

    I guess I did not elaborate. I have gone to union meetings and have seen the entire hall packed with members searching for answers and receiving none. The look of exasperation from members is a shame. The leadership is a sham.

    The Other's I mentioned ( stewards and committee persons) have reinforced and elaborated on the inadequacy of 243's "negotiations" and their shell game of hiding answers that will not be open to interpretation in the CBA.

    I highly advise members to refrain from confronting the 243 leadership...or for that matter; confronting anyone at UPS, hourly's, or the public. I will leave the confrontational behavior to the BUG. Spirited discussion is fine but confrontational behavior is unacceptable.

    I will forego the Full-Time steward position and instead run for a position on the slate that ousts the current incompetent 243 leadership.

    Charges can not be filed at this point. And hopefully; it will not be come to that. Charges will only be necessary if 243 does not correct it's behavior and actually start fulfilling their duty of fair representation during contract negotiations.

    The dominoes will continue to fall. The Locals that have turned their backs on the members time is up. Local elections will continue and more leadership changes will occur before the next Teamster convention and National election. Responsible leadership that actually represents the members will take control of the Teamsters. The trash will continue to be removed from Teamster Halls across the nation.
     
  20. burrheadd

    burrheadd KING Of GIFS

    The Teamsters need more people like you involved

    Stay Strong