TeamCare upgraded

[Anonymous 10]

I love schooling you........How quickly you forget bashing Andy M and the MOU saying we did not have enough time to make a carve out..... I put you on "check wait" and even your beloved TDU website posted "Western locals and New Jersey Local 177 have also reached an agreement with UPS on their healthcare plan which they say will be equal to or better than the enhanced Central States TeamCare Plan". You acted like you had supreme knowledge on the situation and gave advice as if you were on the negotiation committee but obviously you did not know anything. Here we are again and you talking about trustees on the plan and you are unqualified to give this information. You should be telling everyone to JUST WAIT FOR THE SUMMARY PLAN DESCRIPTIONS like the rest of us and members will be able to read it themselves before they vote on it. It is that simple.......... Guys like you create distrust with our unions when we should take ownership and back the leaders that we voted into office. If the leaders fail then you can criticize them and take action but they deserve the same chance as you to get the job done.


I made a disclaimer for you if you want to continue acting like "loof".

The views expressed by TOS represent the personal views of TDU members and do not represent the opinion of the International Brotherhood of Teamsters serving its members of the United Parcel Service. The IBT assumes no responsibility for the content of individual members on web pages.

Come on quite schooling TOS. She has a lot of issues and can't help herself. I kinda feel sorry for her. Maybe some meds are just what she needs.

 

[kingOFchester]

You know what is scary? The amount UPS will pay into Teamcare in the 5th year (Just the 5th year) is equal to or greater then the net profit from 2011. Just the healthcare expense.

The first year, 2014 UPS will pay 3 billion into teamcare, that's 78% of the total net profit from 2011 of 3.8 billion.

Mind blowing.

 

[Anonymous 10]

You know what is scary? The amount UPS will pay into Teamcare in the 5th year (Just the 5th year) is equal to or greater then the net profit from 2011. Just the healthcare expense.

The first year, 2014 UPS will pay 3 billion into teamcare, that's 78% of the total net profit from 2011 of 3.8 billion.

Mind blowing.

So do you see why ups was so adament that they wanted to get out of the healthcare business? There are a lot of factors that make this a very complex issue. Couple this with the issue of the international dropping the ball on explaining this a long time ago and it's a mess but something that needed to happen. The cost of healthcare is out of this world.

 

[kingOFchester]

Oh yes, since the beginning I have known that HC was an issue and will now be an issue for the IBT. Transferring the administration liability from UPS to the teamsters does not fix the problem. Problem will still be here, except now UPS has secured a defined payment for the next 5 years and the Teamsters have inherited and unknown expense.

Single payer here we come.

 

[Inthegame]

Ingame,

Your theory is laughable at best, but I give you credit for making an attempt at a reasonable argument. However, your opinion is flawed.

The southwest joint council will appoint the three trustees and the company will appoint the others. In your explanation, the locals appoint "employee trustees" and this is not true. The trustees on the union side will consist of officers of various locals.

Your second argument that "control" goes to the voting members, because they vote in officers and therefore can somehow "affect" the decision making progress is again, laughable.

As the administrator evaluates the financial position of the fund at large, and then discovers cost projections that exceed estimated revenue, during a board meeting this will be discussed and motions will be made. A motion is then seconded and a vote of the board members ( trustees) ensues.

If the motion carries, then the plan adjusts accordingly to the motion.

There is NO interaction with the local, the employees or any other entities. Now, the officers of the locals who get appointed by the joint council to the board of the administrator get to vote, and yes, by virtue of being elected into office of their respective locals they get to be on the board, that doesnt give ANY employee a "sayso" on benefit levels.

A benefit level can ALWAYS be amended by the trustees, but that has NOTHING to do with the members. There will be no consultation with ANY of the members of all the southwest locals before decisions are made.

To suggest or infer such is just manipulation on your part.

I gather you speak to the stinks and 407 stewards of the crowd who may believe this, but the rest of the membership understands the separation between trustees authority and employee participation.

Sure, we can vote out officers every three years and recommend to our joint councils replacement trustees, but that in NO WAY gives the employees any bargaining power.

We are just in for the ride with our fingers crossed that the IBT/Trustees/ will keep their word and maintain benefit levels.

If they had intended on protecting benefit levels, why didnt they include this into the MOU:

"benefit levels to remain the same for the duration of this contractual agreement"..

Instead, it says the opposite and furthers that NOTHING in the agreement shall stop them from changing them.

I hope you have a better understanding.

Peace

TOS

Sorry to waste space and repost your entire misguided rant but your continued inaccuracies demand answers. First you must remember the West/Southwest isn't the only HC plan in the UPS kingdom. How the West/Southwest function is not what I was answering and a review of my post should give you that indication. Apparently you have no knowledge of process anywhere but the West/Southwest. The description of process as I posted is exactly as happens in many locals including L177 which was the post you were criticizing. If you think my accurate post was laughable you've proved your inadequacies to hold office. In many points of your odd rebuttal you've agreed with my position then bizarrely reached opposite conclusions . Every decision an employee trustee makes is answerable to the voting members at the next election, regardless of the appointing authority. You've made this exact point by endlessly threatening your local union officers and other employee trustees for failing your perceived notion of nirvana in this contract by warning the world these same officers days are numbered as the mighty TOS will save the day by removing them from office in next years election.

You really need to get a grip. I've been in a Union HC plan longer than you've been a Teamster and have had nothing but improvements, because of negotiated increases that sustain and improve, exactly as this contract provides. The standard BOILERPLATE language you're trying to scare members with has been present in UPS and Union plans since their inceptions. The BS you're spreading about inadequate funding in CS TeamCare is shameful. You know nothing about the running or funding of an HC plan.

There's a good reason you're no longer a Union officer, and your posts prove that statement.

 

[RealPerson]

Year one, UPS will be paying 3 billion for the first year of health benefits.
By year 5, UPS will be paying "close" to 4 billion in that year for our health benefits.

3 billion to 4 billion over 5 years is about a yearly increase of 5.9% depending on how close to 4billion that year 5 contribution will be. My guess it is calculated at 5% which brings year 5 to 3.8 billion.

Another words, if health care cost rise more then an average of 5% a year, we are screwed.

Kaiser Family Foundation states that healthcare costs have gone up on average 4.2 percent per year from 2008 to 2012, do to the slow down in the economy. If the economy picks up, which it is, the average cost of healthcare could rise by an additional 3 points per year.

That would put us over the UPS increase in contributions by as much as 2 percentage points putting us at a deficit of about half a billion dollars. Some where in the neighborhood of 1500 dollars per person depending on whether that would be distributed between just UPSers or everyone at Teamcare.

Numbers never lie. The future is uncertain, and UPS has just secured their future healthcare cost by having a defined healthcare cost for the next 5 years.

Come On ... Obama said everything will be fine.
Just heard his basic plan for coverage is only a few hundred a month, and with a low income waver you can get it for under $200... see we are covered..

LOL ---

Ok I will stop.. I have no idea what that $200 covers since here is a couple higher plans, but yeah...

 

[rpoz11]

So do you see why ups was so adament that they wanted to get out of the healthcare business? There are a lot of factors that make this a very complex issue. Couple this with the issue of the international dropping the ball on explaining this a long time ago and it's a mess but something that needed to happen. The cost of healthcare is out of this world.

What has been discussed throughout our nation, and suggested thru the news media since 2007, that reports of escalating costs of health care was "their reason" or an excuse to exit an unregulated industry.
UPS didn't just decide overnite that getting out of the health coverage business was a new decision.
The ACA and the forthcoming Laws incorporated into it forced UPS to make a decision as to whether or not to take the financial hit for providing such a plan.
I personally don't believe that they were entertaining the future possibility that our Teamster members would revolt and have it be an amicable separation.
They had a decision to make.
I am not promoting corporate UPS's decision to take the direction they did.
However, I do believe that this decision was what they had to take.
Now, the company has had a neutral stance (loosely stated) with the Union.
Over the years, we have both been good for business and their profit.
Certainly, this all is a very complex issue.
What could have transpired is that our IBT leaders could have addressed this earlier with the members.
This decision could have had far better results.
The problem is is that our Gov't has had their hand so deep into rewriting the future Health Care industry, that inviting in Unions across America from the beginning would have derailed their sole intent.
This whole process is a Tornado with no direction.
We all could have resolved this years in advance, but for some reason, and may all of you please call the IBT about this,
is that our IBT has decided to stand on the sidelines for 5 years and allow this whole thing to spiral out of control.

We decide by our votes as to what outcomes we desire.

If this is what you want as our future Health Plan, then by all means approve it.
If this is NOT what you want as our future Health Plan, then by all means Vote NO.

It's all up to us and our Vote.

 

[balland chain]

It appears because of the Vote no movement, that TeamCare benefits has been improved.

I could be wrong but from what I have been told by coworkers is that if your supplement was passed you will get the exact same benefits that you were getting. Only the locals who voted their supplements down will get the enhanced benefits ..

 

[RealPerson]

Ha, I doubt this.....

But, tech it would be Enhanced Enhanced, since we were to get C-6 Enhanced anyway, they just threw some sugar on top to get a yes vote. Once that sugar is gone in the 5th year, I believe it is the same old crap, minus the sugar...

 

[InsideUPS]

Thank you InsideUPS for posting the UPS Plan Amendment for Termination notice. Too many don't understand the very language they fear already exists in UPS's plan. It is a necessary component to protect the plans regardless of who administers benefits. And thank you to Piedmont for another in a long series of astute posts. Not only did UPS try to raise retiree rates in '07, they demanded Hall to reopen after the '08 meltdown. The much ridiculed Ken H responded calmly by saying "Every negotiation UPS cries that the contract will break them and then goes out and sets record profits each succeeding quarter. Not once has the IBT demanded UPS open and share that wealth, we wait til the contract is up. Now you can wait." This has been a long and difficult process. But every UPS'er should be pleased with these results.

Inthegame, I believe it's only fair to evaluate all aspects of an issue and people should know that the UPS plan as written was not without it's concerns.

As you know, this healthcare issue has been extremely difficult for many people to accept, including myself. Most of my concerns were for my part-time co-workers and not myself. I am more than fairly compensated and will have the opportunity to receive the same retiree coverage with TeamCare as my full time co-workers across the country. The TeamCare retiree coverage is actually significantly better than the UPS Part-time Retiree coverage. (Dental, Vision, $200,000 yearly max instead of $150,000 max to name a few)

We have a unique situation at our Local where the FT bargaining unit employees have their H&W with an independent provider in our area (Ohio - Not Medical Mutual). We have a transitioning BA situation where our long time BA is retiring this month. The retiring BA attempted to get the part-timers in our Local in the same plan as the FT in our area. A significant effort was made on his part........and on our part, as all of us PT'ers signed a petition that was sent to Ken H.....

After talking with our new BA and understanding more about the contribution amounts that UPS is making to TeamCare for the part-timers H & W benefits, I have a different understanding why all Part-timers need to be included in TeamCare..... It was always obvious to me that the greater number of part-timers we have in the TeamCare plan, the more fiscally sound the plan would be. What was not clear to me were the economics behind the issue. Our new BA indicated that UPS will be paying the amounts outlined below to TeamCare on behalf of each part-time employee. The amounts that UPS pays for the full-time employees is also listed below.

No reasonable person could expect the company to pay approximately $130 more per week for each and every part-timer so that they could receive the same benefits as their full-time co-worker in our area when TeamCare was offering similar benefits for less. The retiree coverage in our area is fixed at $267 for the retiree and his or her spouse. Our local retiree coverage does not cover children of retirees. There is however no maximum on yearly medical costs.... A risk that our full timers take by not being in TeamCare is that this locally negotiated H&W package is subject to change every 3 years. If for example, this healthcare insurance provider decides to change benefits levels......our BA will be in a difficult situation and will have to "shop" for a better deal. As you can see, our Local has always negotiated it's own H&W package by using all of our IBT members as a "carrot" for these local hospital based H & W plans....

I personally have moved on past this issue and accept and appreciate the TeamCare program for the benefits that it does offer. My only regret is that the improvements we gained in TeamCare by voting NO to the supplements and rider came from the TeamCare fund and not come from the company. A new age....a new company....and an ever changing Union environment to deal with global economics....

Peace to you....peace to 407....peace to Stink.......and last but not least......peace to TOS.... all of you have made my last contract with UPS an interesting one....


Part Time/week


213.77 - Year 1


229.79 - Year 2


234.77 - Year 3


269.77- Year 4


296.57 - Year 5

Full-Time/week

343.82 - Year 1


363,82 - Year 2


384.07 - Year 3


421.16 - Year 4


461.00 - Year 5

 

[RealPerson]

Health care has went up, Yep... So has the cost of shipping a package...

 

[Anonymous 10]

Inthegame, I believe it's only fair to evaluate all aspects of an issue and people should know that the UPS plan as written was not without it's concerns.

As you know, this healthcare issue has been extremely difficult for many people to accept, including myself. Most of my concerns were for my part-time co-workers and not myself. I am more than fairly compensated and will have the opportunity to receive the same retiree coverage with TeamCare as my full time co-workers across the country. The TeamCare retiree coverage is actually significantly better than the UPS Part-time Retiree coverage. (Dental, Vision, $200,000 yearly max instead of $150,000 max to name a few)

We have a unique situation at our Local where the FT bargaining unit employees have their H&W with an independent provider in our area (Ohio - Not Medical Mutual). We have a transitioning BA situation where our long time BA is retiring this month. The retiring BA attempted to get the part-timers in our Local in the same plan as the FT in our area. A significant effort was made on his part........and on our part, as all of us PT'ers signed a petition that was sent to Ken H.....

After talking with our new BA and understanding more about the contribution amounts that UPS is making to TeamCare for the part-timers H & W benefits, I have a different understanding why all Part-timers need to be included in TeamCare..... It was always obvious to me that the greater number of part-timers we have in the TeamCare plan, the more fiscally sound the plan would be. What was not clear to me were the economics behind the issue. Our new BA indicated that UPS will be paying the amounts outlined below to TeamCare on behalf of each part-time employee. The amounts that UPS pays for the full-time employees is also listed below.

No reasonable person could expect the company to pay approximately $130 more per week for each and every part-timer so that they could receive the same benefits as their full-time co-worker in our area when TeamCare was offering similar benefits for less. The retiree coverage in our area is fixed at $267 for the retiree and his or her spouse. Our local retiree coverage does not cover children of retirees. There is however no maximum on yearly medical costs.... A risk that our full timers take by not being in TeamCare is that this locally negotiated H&W package is subject to change every 3 years. If for example, this healthcare insurance provider decides to change benefits levels......our BA will be in a difficult situation and will have to "shop" for a better deal. As you can see, our Local has always negotiated it's own H&W package by using all of our IBT members as a "carrot" for these local hospital based H & W plans....

I personally have moved on past this issue and accept and appreciate the TeamCare program for the benefits that it does offer. My only regret is that the improvements we gained in TeamCare by voting NO to the supplements and rider came from the TeamCare fund and not come from the company. A new age....a new company....and an ever changing Union environment to deal with global economics....

Peace to you....peace to 407....peace to Stink.......and last but not least......peace to TOS.... all of you have made my last contract with UPS an interesting one....


Part Time/week


213.77 - Year 1


229.79 - Year 2


234.77 - Year 3


269.77- Year 4


296.57 - Year 5

Full-Time/week

343.82 - Year 1


363,82 - Year 2


384.07 - Year 3


421.16 - Year 4


461.00 - Year 5

It sounds like you are finally understanding how big this whole deal is. In some instances it does stink but times do a change. We either evolve or we don't. God bless you man.

 

[rpoz11]

So which plan does the members in the southwest go into?
I ask because my local's S/T was at my barn last Thursday saying we are real close on the carve-out. That they were in FINAL negotiations. He was saying this to everyone.
BTW, he was the guy who asked Hoffa/Hall for the carve-out.

Your S/T is a blowhard that no one listens to.
He comes in and does the same freekin routine that everyone has seen since day 1.
Ever notice he is almost never alone???
​

 

[InsideUPS]

It sounds like you are finally understanding how big this whole deal is. In some instances it does stink but times do a change. We either evolve or we don't. God bless you man.

anonymous..... I had many mixed emotions about this whole healthcare issue from the beginning. The part-time Union steward in me naturally wanted to protect the interests of part-time employees. The "business" side of me understands why any business wants to reduce costs and limit potential unknown liabilities (such as this healthcare issue). My steward involvement over the years gave me insight into Union politics, beliefs, and philosophies. In the end, I certainly realize that we all must work together in order to thrive and survive in todays economic environment.

Just an FYI.....for me personally, the major issue that I had with this healthcare issue from the beginning was the way it was "delivered" to me. I'm the kind of person that likes to know straight from the beginning the issues involved. I don't like "sugar coating", etc.. Once I saw the H&W contributions that the company was making on behalf of each and every employee......I had a totally different feeling about this whole issue. I believe most part-time employees do not realize that UPS is contributing more for their healthcare each week than what they are earning in wages. We have all entered an era where healthcare may be the greatest expense of our lifetime.

Your statement, "we either evolve or we don't" goes right along with a principles that I am intimately familiar with as a biology major.... "Adapt or Die"...."Survival of the Fittest" and "Natural Selection". Our negotiations are finished in my mind, I want the "wounds" of our membership to heal and move forward. We now have to remain diligent in our enforcement of the contract which is not always an easy task.

Peace...& God Bless you also...

 

[RealPerson]

anonymous..... I had many mixed emotions about this whole healthcare issue from the beginning. The part-time Union steward in me naturally wanted to protect the interests of part-time employees. The "business" side of me understands why any business wants to reduce costs and limit potential unknown liabilities (such as this healthcare issue). My steward involvement over the years gave me insight into Union politics, beliefs, and philosophies. In the end, I certainly realize that we all must work together in order to thrive and survive in todays economic environment.

Just an FYI.....for me personally, the major issue that I had with this healthcare issue from the beginning was the way it was "delivered" to me. I'm the kind of person that likes to know straight from the beginning the issues involved. I don't like "sugar coating", etc.. Once I saw the H&W contributions that the company was making on behalf of each and every employee......I had a totally different feeling about this whole issue. I believe most part-time employees do not realize that UPS is contributing more for their healthcare each week than what they are earning in wages. We have all entered an era where healthcare may be the greatest expense of our lifetime.

Your statement, "we either evolve or we don't" goes right along with a principles that I am intimately familiar with as a biology major.... "Adapt or Die"...."Survival of the Fittest" and "Natural Selection". Our negotiations are finished in my mind, I want the "wounds" of our membership to heal and move forward. We now have to remain diligent in our enforcement of the contract which is not always an easy task.

Peace...& God Bless you also...

Who cares if UPS is contributing MORE in healthcare than my wages? Current contract you worked an ENTIRE year first, so yeah..
When I started and CONTINUE to work I look at the Hard ass work I do and ADD my Health care into the Wages.. I would QUIT today if it was just wages.

Yes, COsts are going up... But guess what so is the cost to ship a package.... If UPS raised the cost of each package $.10 ... Don't they ship 11 million a day or something like that.
But, No Need for that, UPS had RECORD Profits, and with the boom of ordering Online, with USPS looking worse every day, UPS has a good chance of hitting those Record or over a BILLION each quarter...
Remember I said Profits....

 

[sortaisle]

UPS couldn't raise the costs of shipping to cover our health care expenses because it would price them out of the market. FredEx has no such liabilities and can afford to undercut us. The only thing keeping us afloat is we can handle the volume. FredEx doesn't have the infrastructure as of yet to handle it...yet. They gain on us everyday. The time is coming when UPS will fall to 2nd place volume wise and that's when the ****e will hit the fan for us employees. Unless we can allow UPS to be competitive we stand to lose everything, not just benefits levels. We want to be proactive and not reactive.

 

[Catatonic]

UPS couldn't raise the costs of shipping to cover our health care expenses because it would price them out of the market. FredEx has no such liabilities and can afford to undercut us. The only thing keeping us afloat is we can handle the volume. FredEx doesn't have the infrastructure as of yet to handle it...yet. They gain on us everyday. The time is coming when UPS will fall to 2nd place volume wise and that's when the ****e will hit the fan for us employees. Unless we can allow UPS to be competitive we stand to lose everything, not just benefits levels. We want to be proactive and not reactive.

Unfortunately, this is the reality on down the road.

 

[kingOFchester]

UPS couldn't raise the costs of shipping to cover our health care expenses because it would price them out of the market. FredEx has no such liabilities and can afford to undercut us. The only thing keeping us afloat is we can handle the volume. FredEx doesn't have the infrastructure as of yet to handle it...yet. They gain on us everyday. The time is coming when UPS will fall to 2nd place volume wise and that's when the ****e will hit the fan for us employees. Unless we can allow UPS to be competitive we stand to lose everything, not just benefits levels. We want to be proactive and not reactive.

Its is one hell of a problem we got brewing. No doubt about that. The only hope is that laws change and forces Fedex to unionize. Bottom line. Without that happening, we will see Fedex as the number one shipping company.

 

[sortaisle]

Its is one hell of a problem we got brewing. No doubt about that. The only hope is that laws change and forces Fedex to unionize. Bottom line. Without that happening, we will see Fedex as the number one shipping company.

I think I know what you're talking about...but I think you have it mixed up...FedEx can unionize anytime the employees want...are you talking about changing them from the rail act to air so they have to claim their drivers as employees and not sub contractors?

 

[kingOFchester]

I think I know what you're talking about...but I think you have it mixed up...FedEx can unionize anytime the employees want...are you talking about changing them from the rail act to air so they have to claim their drivers as employees and not sub contractors?

Yes, I am not up to speed with all the laws and fedex's business structure.

I was under the impression that the contracting model has nothing to do with the air/rail act. I just thought that was a business structure that allows fedex (ground) to call them contractors vs employees.

The air division (express) is treated as an airline which is governed by the Railway Labor Act. This means they are an airline, not a a trucking company and this makes it harder for air drivers to unionize. The rail act was in acted to keep unions from paralyzing the air transportation industry.

Thats the way I understood it, but could be completely wrong.