UPS Strike prediction

some1else

Banned
Haven't thrown one personal insult at you. Just said I don't like the website you write for @Tom
That’s the definition of an ad hominem attack you didn’t respond to any of the arguments in the article you attacked the source. Second lowest level of argumentation and does not contribute to solving the issues at hand at all. Feel free to read it and pick anything you like that you disagree with and tell me why I’d be happy to respond and/or change my mind on things if you make a good point.
 

542thruNthru

Well-Known Member
That’s the definition of an ad hominem attack you didn’t respond to any of the arguments in the article you attacked the source. Second lowest level of argumentation and does not contribute to solving the issues at hand at all.
Lol what issue? I didn't realize talking with you about your article Tom would "solve" the issue.
Feel free to read it and pick anything you like that you disagree with and tell me why I’d be happy to respond and/or change my mind on things if you make a good point.
You're pathetic lol. I make a comment about the site and you take it so personal that you think I need to discuss and debate it to change your mind. You would be perfect for the current events forum. The reason I'm attacking you is not because of your position on the subject. It's because you feel I should agree with you or explain why I don't. So in short I'm attacking you because of your arrogance because I don’t owe you anything. You approached me with your issues when i wasnt talking to you at all. . ;)
 

Thebrownblob

Well-Known Member
That article is drivel,
Now TDU isn't radical enough? Fake “dissidents" lol.

The 2/3 rule wasn't arcane or mysterious its was right in the constitution and has been used before.
By this writers analysis 90% of the contract is arcane to most members because they don't READ IT. Its gone now, and I was one who voted to be rid of it at the convention, so game on Teamster members, put up or shut up time, no more safety net, or ability to blame the leadership.

Then he said the membership was "Seething" and than says the election had "lowest turnout of any direct elections in the history of the Teamsters, to replace former president James Hoffa Jr." Wow Tom really seething, sounds more like complacency to me. The same reason the 2/3 rule was able to be used in 2018.

Tom Didn't like the speach Sunday? Eh so what, most know its posturing, and many I've talked to liked the energy. At the very least they were interested enough to watch. Haven't seen that in years.

"The “promise” to strike if a deal is not in place by the expiration date only underscores that they intend to get a deal done well in advance of the deadline to pre-empt a strike. Industry consultant Satish Jindel has predicted a deal will get done by the end of June, and that there was “no chance” of a strike, according to an article in Freightwaves" .......

Satish Jindel, who? this garbage article is based off some consultants guess? Does he also know the Powerball numbers for the lottery?

Tom goes on to bitch about the carhaul contract. The very fact Obrian was able to get ANY contract much less one with significant improvements to a DYING industry like Carhaul was an absolute shock and a huge win. Tom is ignorant to the reality of this industry. I am well aware and understand carhaul.

The rest of the article is a leftist rant against the government and the union.Tinfoil hat conspiracy, Pure nonsense/Anarchy against the union.

"This is why the World Socialist Web Site urges workers to take the initiative out of the hands of the Teamsters apparatus by forming rank-and-file committees, which would transfer decision-making power from the union apparatus to workers themselves.".....
So Tom want 250,000+ differnt opinions to negotiate the contact?
Absolute Fool
Absolute Foolish deranged website full of malcontents.8-)
 
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Sacrificial Lamb

Package Shepherd
Yes, can you give me a link to anyone that is covering this issue with more detail and accuracy than myself? Ignoring the editorial comments are there any errors or inaccuracies in my reporting? (The above poster mentioned that usps can not handle ups volume, that was a quote from the freight waves article not me)


I think it’s possible for 524 to make it from level 2 to level 3 but I will delete my account if he can make it to counterargument or higher. Usually one would need triple digits for that.View attachment 424448
Saved, lmao.
 

DELACROIX

In the Spirit of Honore' Daumier
That’s the definition of an ad hominem attack you didn’t respond to any of the arguments in the article you attacked the source. Second lowest level of argumentation and does not contribute to solving the issues at hand at all. Feel free to read it and pick anything you like that you disagree with and tell me why I’d be happy to respond and/or change my mind on things if you make a good point.

Even if you are 100 % correct in your opinions or observations how is going to help the rank and file if the powers to be are that corrupt with the deadline is only a couple of months away?

Sounds like you are providing no hope for our members… basically we are defeated before the first battle. First tactic when you go against an enemy is to destroy any chance of victory. You may see issues with our Union that may be true but unfortunately it is not helping anybody in our upcoming Negotiations except the Company.

O’Brien won by a landslide plain and simple. We will find out soon if he is the real deal, we are not stupid or naive. We have to ride the horse that brought us knowing full well that everything will not be perfect with this Contract. It will take sometime to correct all of the compromises and concessions associated with the previous administrations.
 

Thebrownblob

Well-Known Member
Even if you are 100 % correct in your opinions or observations how is going to help the rank and file if the powers to be are that corrupt with the deadline is only a couple of months away?

Sounds like you are providing no hope for our members… basically we are defeated before the first battle. First tactic when you go against an enemy is to destroy any chance of victory. You may see issues with our Union that may be true but unfortunately it is not helping anybody in our upcoming Negotiations except the Company.

O’Brien won by a landslide plain and simple. We will find out soon if he is the real deal, we are not stupid or naive. We have to ride the horse that brought us knowing full well that everything will not be perfect with this Contract. It will take sometime to correct all of the compromises and concessions associated with the previous administrations.
Because in this ridiculous articles premise the Hoffa administration and the OZ administration are basically one in the same.
 

some1else

Banned
Even if you are 100 % correct in your opinions or observations how is going to help the rank and file if the powers to be are that corrupt with the deadline is only a couple of months away?
Well if it is 100% true that hoffa had his protege hoodwink us with a false conversion into a reformer that would change a lot of peoples view of the situation. Right now we are in trust but verify mode hoping for the best. I would say in that case push O’Brien to put his cards on the table.

it’s like we are sending O’Brien to the Chevy dealership to buy us a Silverado, and are trusting him to get the best deal. I would at least want him to tell me “hey I’m trying to get it for 45k, with a free bedliner thrown in” so when he comes back with a number I can see we’ll they offered 47k, a bed liner, and 5 free oil changes hmm that’s not too bad. If I don’t even know what he went in asking for how do I know he didn’t just bring me the offer the dealer made without even fighting for me?

That would just be one example I think the majority of memebers would support. The only reason I can think of to not tell us what the ask is, would be to minimize disappointment when the contract falls well short. If you want to bring a fight to the company like he said he does show us what you are asking for so if the company dosnt come close and makes a last and best we can see that.

Immediate release:
We are telling the company 6 days are killing our members. We informed the company that we want the same deal they give management, if you work 6 days you get an extra vacation day added to your entitlements. I’m bringing a fight to the company and they need to know we are willing to strike over issues like this. Stand strong more updates to follow

Something like that vs vague confrontational language lacking any detail
 

DELACROIX

In the Spirit of Honore' Daumier
Well if it is 100% true that hoffa had his protege hoodwink us with a false conversion into a reformer that would change a lot of peoples view of the situation. Right now we are in trust but verify mode hoping for the best. I would say in that case push O’Brien to put his cards on the table.

it’s like we are sending O’Brien to the Chevy dealership to buy us a Silverado, and are trusting him to get the best deal. I would at least want him to tell me “hey I’m trying to get it for 45k, with a free bedliner thrown in” so when he comes back with a number I can see we’ll they offered 47k, a bed liner, and 5 free oil changes hmm that’s not too bad. If I don’t even know what he went in asking for how do I know he didn’t just bring me the offer the dealer made without even fighting for me?

That would just be one example I think the majority of memebers would support. The only reason I can think of to not tell us what the ask is, would be to minimize disappointment when the contract falls well short. If you want to bring a fight to the company like he said he does show us what you are asking for so if the company dosnt come close and makes a last and best we can see that.

Immediate release:
We are telling the company 6 days are killing our members. We informed the company that we want the same deal they give management, if you work 6 days you get an extra vacation day added to your entitlements. I’m bringing a fight to the company and they need to know we are willing to strike over issues like this. Stand strong more updates to follow

Something like that vs vague confrontational language lacking any detail

What is vague is management's previous or current entitlements. I know they just recently eliminating any vesting rights and froze their own pension trusts, before that they were stuffing it with a lot of monetary contributions at the end of the year into their own individual pension trusts while paying peanuts or not increasing benefits to our members who are currently under their defined pension plans.

There was a reason that the Company decided to eliminate further funding into their own pension trusts (5) years ago..It gives them a bargaining chip to convert most of us into a 401K similar to what is happening in their management's retirement plan,
Of course they had to provide a healthy GWI to soften the blow. Do we really know just how many perks and entitlements that is currently in place for management, particularly on the corporate levels?

First time hearing about the management's 6 day extra vacation day benefit..presuming O'Brien is pushing for more sick days or more vacation weeks after 25 years.
 

Thebrownblob

Well-Known Member
What is vague is management's previous or current entitlements. I know they just recently eliminating any vesting rights and froze their own pension trusts, before that they were stuffing it with a lot of monetary contributions at the end of the year into their own individual pension trusts while paying peanuts or not increasing benefits to our members who are currently under their defined pension plans.

There was a reason that the Company decided to eliminate further funding into their own pension trusts (5) years ago..It gives them a bargaining chip to convert most of us into a 401K similar to what is happening in their management's retirement plan,
Of course they had to provide a healthy GWI to soften the blow. Do we really know just how many perks and entitlements that is currently in place for management, particularly on the corporate levels?

First time hearing about the management's 6 day extra vacation day benefit..presuming O'Brien is pushing for more sick days or more vacation weeks after 25 years.
Central had a temporary agreement to allow you split up a week of vacation to use as call in or sick days, without scheduling, last week when they reconvened negotiating the company backtracked and said, never mind, we didn’t mean that.
 

UnionStrong

Sorry, but I don’t care anymore.
That article is drivel,
Now TDU isn't radical enough? Fake “dissidents" lol.

The 2/3 rule wasn't arcane or mysterious its was right in the constitution and has been used before.
By this writers analysis 90% of the contract is arcane to most members because they don't READ IT. Its gone now, and I was one who voted to be rid of it at the convention, so game on Teamster members, put up or shut up time, no more safety net, or ability to blame the leadership.

Then he said the membership was "Seething" and than says the election had "lowest turnout of any direct elections in the history of the Teamsters, to replace former president James Hoffa Jr." Wow Tom really seething, sounds more like complacency to me. The same reason the 2/3 rule was able to be used in 2018.

Tom Didn't like the speach Sunday? Eh so what, most know its posturing, and many I've talked to liked the energy. At the very least they were interested enough to watch. Haven't seen that in years.

"The “promise” to strike if a deal is not in place by the expiration date only underscores that they intend to get a deal done well in advance of the deadline to pre-empt a strike. Industry consultant Satish Jindel has predicted a deal will get done by the end of June, and that there was “no chance” of a strike, according to an article in Freightwaves" .......

Satish Jindel, who? this garbage article is based off some consultants guess? Does he also know the Powerball numbers for the lottery?

Tom goes on to bitch about the carhaul contract. The very fact Obrian was able to get ANY contract much less one with significant improvements to a DYING industry like Carhaul was an absolute shock and a huge win. Tom is ignorant to the reality of this industry. I am well aware and understand carhaul.

The rest of the article is a leftist rant against the government and the union.Tinfoil hat conspiracy, Pure nonsense/Anarchy against the union.

"This is why the World Socialist Web Site urges workers to take the initiative out of the hands of the Teamsters apparatus by forming rank-and-file committees, which would transfer decision-making power from the union apparatus to workers themselves.".....
So Tom want 250,000+ differnt opinions to negotiate the contact?
Absolute Fool
Absolute Foolish deranged website full of malcontents.8-)
It’s communist rubbish
 

Thebrownblob

Well-Known Member
With a 25% pay raise. Think the Teamsters will be able to match that?
For the malcontents who wrote that story absolutely nothing would be good enough.
Interesting point about several of the contracts I’ve been involved in two of them were voted down by the members because they wanted less money and more time off. We certainly live in different times.
 

UnionStrong

Sorry, but I don’t care anymore.
For the malcontents who wrote that story absolutely nothing would be good enough.
Interesting point about several of the contracts I’ve been involved in two of them were voted down by the members because they wanted less money and more time off. We certainly live in different times.
Time off was always what I wanted more.
 
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