Contract talks

yeldarb

Well-Known Member
You are so out of touch if you actually believe that. There are tons of us part timers that are still working at a low wage for many years. I've been with UPS for 8 years and signed every bid, full time opportunities are nowhere near as easily accessible as you seem to believe.

So I'm not sure who you think these raises would be "wasted" on. Certainly not me.

Also, maybe turnover wouldn't be as high if the wages were better. I don't see any turnover with full time inside employees, even the ones who have been transferred and are being forced to work split shifts.

As far as turnover of part timers go, I havent had a preloader for over a year in over 5 years. They have NO incentive to stay. Most dont even last long enough to get benefits.
 

upsman68

Well-Known Member
You will be wasting raises on a group that is a high turnover classification. Yes they might start out a little bit higher but most won't get through the 4 year progression. Which probably will be longer with a higher starting pay. Just a thought!


I have to disagree with you. I started 22 years ago as a part timer at 8.50 an hour. I think that is still the starting wage now. I got all my benefits within a year. I think that has changed also. With this low starting pay you don't get part timers that stay on as long.

As a full timer I would like to the company give us more option/sick days.
 

upsman2940

Well-Known Member
I don't care how many preloaders you have to train. Will see how the drivers feel in 5 yrs after giving the pt the raises. I made more money at 23.17 than I do at 31+. Besides told want to argue with a pt sup that is trying to get raise.
 

brown_trousers

Well-Known Member
I don't care how many preloaders you have to train. Will see how the drivers feel in 5 yrs after giving the pt the raises. I made more money at 23.17 than I do at 31+. Besides told want to argue with a pt sup that is trying to get raise.

I think it would take me AT LEAST another 10 years working part time to get my hourly rate up to 23.17. You must have been through some good contracts to make that kind of money part time
 

hellfire

no one considers UPS people."real" Teamsters.-BUG
I don't care how many preloaders you have to train. Will see how the drivers feel in 5 yrs after giving the pt the raises. I made more money at 23.17 than I do at 31+. Besides told want to argue with a pt sup that is trying to get raise.

what?
 

John19841

Well-Known Member
To the ones saying they'd gladly give up raises in the next contract to get the part-timers wages up:

You're all silly. Think about what you're saying. Think of the consequences of that. If you agree with that, then you're either out in Nowheresville Alabama living like a king while those around you scrape by on $20k a year, or you have no eyes for the future.

A part time job is just that, a part time job. While I agree the PT'ers are underpaid, and should be making 10-12/hr to start, I don't think that should come off the backs of the drivers. But I've heard they have no incentive to stay; that's BS. The incentive to stay is the higher paying job, with good benefits and a good retirement. Most of the people in the hub don't have much else going for them in terms of employment. If they're not in college, then they're pretty much there waiting for a FT job anyway. I've heard they can go to Walmart or McDonalds and make the same amount of money, if not more. That's great, but where do those dead end jobs lead to? You can take your Walmart experience and go apply at Target, now that's an improvement. The chance of making $70K plus with no education, and right now, even with college, is slim.

Anyways, back on point; A contract is 5 years. FIVE years....that's half a decade. Do you REALLY want to give up a raise for 5 years? A lot can happen in that time, gas can skyrocket, utilities, food, etc. Look at how much prices on utilities and food have increased in the last year. A $0.12 COLA raise doesn't come close to covering that, and now you want to give up our raises, too? 5 years down the line, you want to be making the same amount of money as you are today? I'm telling you again, you're silly. Our raises are not much, and in the grand scheme of things at UPS, are even less. Should we be doing the same work then as we are now, but making less money? That is what it equates to. Our raises are not extravagant, they only cover basic inflation. We are not going to get rich off our raises, but take them away and I guarantee life will get more expensive for everyone.

And just something else to consider. It would be a lot easier for UPS to not give any raises the contract after the next one, as well. If we're all used to not getting a raise, then it wouldn't take much to leave it out of that contract either.

The part timers do deserve to be making a little more, but not at the level of full time, and not off our backs. UPS can afford to give a little without taking. Besides, getting rid of a few part time sups would more than cover the cost of the raises, and we all know there are more than a few redundancies there....
 

Brownslave688

You want a toe? I can get you a toe.
I have been saying it all along we need raises of at least $1 a year just to keep up with average inflation anything less and we should all vote no.
 

TearsInRain

IE boogeyman
i know this won't happen, but i think the next contract should be focused on acquiring and retaining a good part-time work-force, since frankly that's what needs the most work, union-wise

in regards to FT pay, i think they should keep the raises up with inflation but otherwise realize that FT positions are becoming obsolete in a modern economy

not saying i like it, that's just how i see it

inb4 hurrrmanagement
 

brown_trousers

Well-Known Member
To the ones saying they'd gladly give up raises in the next contract to get the part-timers wages up:

You're all silly. Think about what you're saying. Think of the consequences of that. If you agree with that, then you're either out in Nowheresville Alabama living like a king while those around you scrape by on $20k a year, or you have no eyes for the future.

A part time job is just that, a part time job. While I agree the PT'ers are underpaid, and should be making 10-12/hr to start, I don't think that should come off the backs of the drivers. But I've heard they have no incentive to stay; that's BS. The incentive to stay is the higher paying job, with good benefits and a good retirement. Most of the people in the hub don't have much else going for them in terms of employment. If they're not in college, then they're pretty much there waiting for a FT job anyway. I've heard they can go to Walmart or McDonalds and make the same amount of money, if not more. That's great, but where do those dead end jobs lead to? You can take your Walmart experience and go apply at Target, now that's an improvement. The chance of making $70K plus with no education, and right now, even with college, is slim.

Anyways, back on point; A contract is 5 years. FIVE years....that's half a decade. Do you REALLY want to give up a raise for 5 years? A lot can happen in that time, gas can skyrocket, utilities, food, etc. Look at how much prices on utilities and food have increased in the last year. A $0.12 COLA raise doesn't come close to covering that, and now you want to give up our raises, too? 5 years down the line, you want to be making the same amount of money as you are today? I'm telling you again, you're silly. Our raises are not much, and in the grand scheme of things at UPS, are even less. Should we be doing the same work then as we are now, but making less money? That is what it equates to. Our raises are not extravagant, they only cover basic inflation. We are not going to get rich off our raises, but take them away and I guarantee life will get more expensive for everyone.

And just something else to consider. It would be a lot easier for UPS to not give any raises the contract after the next one, as well. If we're all used to not getting a raise, then it wouldn't take much to leave it out of that contract either.

The part timers do deserve to be making a little more, but not at the level of full time, and not off our backs. UPS can afford to give a little without taking. Besides, getting rid of a few part time sups would more than cover the cost of the raises, and we all know there are more than a few redundancies there....

Or... You could realize thats its not just your greedy self that this union represents in its contract negotiations. there are also people who are working in the part time ranks, some of whom have probably worked this company longer than you, they deserve just as much representation, raises, and other benefits as you do.
 

John19841

Well-Known Member
Or... You could realize thats its not just your greedy self that this union represents in its contract negotiations. there are also people who are working in the part time ranks, some of whom have probably worked this company longer than you, they deserve just as much representation, raises, and other benefits as you do.

Or you could realize that every union-represented worker in this company gets the same deal. I hear it all the time on here when someone complains about the hours, workload, etc...We knew what we were in for when we signed up. Well, The same goes for wages. The people who are full time now were part time too at one time. They put there time in and the reward at the end was a high paying full time job.

And the people who you say deserve just as much representation, raises and other benefits as I do, already do get that. See above.

No one is telling the part timers that they aren't entitled to a full time job, or that they won't get paid the same as every other full timer when they get there.

Finally, let's spin this back on yourself for a second, if we can. Full time drivers get pretty much the same raises year after year, while part timers get little to none. I get that. Yet you're calling me selfish, because I would like to continue what is for lack of a better word, expected. You sir, on the other hand, Want to STRIP THAT RAISE FROM ME AND GIVE IT TO YOURSELF.

Think about that before calling me greedy.
 

UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)

Well-Known Member
Ryan, how much is enough? FT seniority drivers will be at $32+/hr at the end of this contract for a job which only requires a HS diploma; meanwhile the starting wage for PTers has remained unchanged. This needs to be addressed and I would accept a wage freeze provided any raise that I would have received be diverted to the PTers.
 

John19841

Well-Known Member
Ryan, how much is enough? FT seniority drivers will be at $32+/hr at the end of this contract for a job which only requires a HS diploma; meanwhile the starting wage for PTers has remained unchanged. This needs to be addressed and I would accept a wage freeze provided any raise that I would have received be diverted to the PTers.

Until the cost of living stops going up, the pay will never be enough. The point at which we say it's enough, is the point at which the concessions will start.
The cost of EVERYTHING in this world rises. It's a problem to believe that the only thing that should not increase is one's pay. You are effectively telling me that I should take a pay cut.

You need to realize that by doing what you said, and taking a pay freeze in exchange for a raise for the part timers, you're only prolonging the screwing of said part timers. If you give them a raise now, and not give the full timers a raise, then they'll lose out on that pay that should of been when they become full time.

This job is not the end all of jobs. Maybe where you are you're making a killing; where I am it's just average. For the amount of work we do, we are compensated fairly.
Part timers are also compensated at an average rate for a PART time job. A PART TIME job is not a career. The total compensation package for a part time employee is more than just about any other part time job you will ever find.

Give them their benefits after 30 days. I agree with that. Start them at $10 with yearly raises. The incentive to take the part time job with UPS is the guaranteed $70k+ job to come. UPS has no shortage of people applying for that. In a business sense, paying them more to start is throwing money away. I'm not saying they're not worth more than that, so don't put words in my mouth. Just saying it like it is.
 

HEFFERNAN

Huge Member
I do agree that a part time job IS SUPPOSE TO BE a part time job !! When I worked part time, I had a second part time job to compensate when I wasn't in college. The only benefit someone should have working part time is being able to protect their families with their health benefits. That is worth more than a pay raise.

Secondly, everyone seems to forget how fast all full-time drivers got screwed when we voted yes for more 9.5 protection and then got it pulled from under us. Now, every fn driver needs to fight for 11.0 protection. Atlanta has pushed and squeezed and treated every driver like a Grand Canyon mule. You honestly think a full time driver is going to concede a dime !!! NOT A CHANCE !!!!!!
 

Paycheck

Active Member
I agree.
That's why it should be business as usual.
Record profits equals status quo at the table at the very worse.
The past few contracts have mirrored each other monetarily.
Hopefully the company pushes for (and the union agrees) that is the part timers that deserve the spoils this time.
I believe it is essential for the success of both the company and union.

Wasn't it Ron Cary in 1997 that tried to increase the pay and promotion of parttime workers? As I remember we were promised 10,000 + new fulltime jobs, we go 22.3 jobs and that was it. There was no increase in full time driving or feeder jobs that I remember. Also the pay rate for parttimers was proposed to increased dramatically before the strike, but in the end starting rate went from 8.00 a hour to 8.50. In the end the union will claim victory no matter how small the gain actually is. Hopefully there wont be a sell out but that remains to be seen.
 
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