Israeli Invasion

[av8torntn]

I'm saying that:


B. Water is an effective way to extinguish WP.

When you posted that when phosphorous comes in contact with the air that is what ignites it, then would it not reignite when the water ran off?

I think this may be what we are looking at in those pictures. Either way looks like no war crimes.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/munitions/smoke.htm

 

[The Other Side]

When you posted that when phosphorous comes in contact with the air that is what ignites it, then would it not reignite when the water ran off?

I think this may be what we are looking at in those pictures. Either way looks like no war crimes.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/munitions/smoke.htm

REALLY AV8?

Using phosphorous on a school isnt a war crime? One filled with students? One filled with teachers? One filled with workers?

To you , its just another fire.

What about the people killed in this fire? What about the injuries suffered by civilians?

I dont see any hamas militants putting their textbooks down to combat fires with elementary buckets of water trying to save the school?

This is why people should not ask a former military person his opinion on war.

The have all the answers. The military is never wrong, the wars are always justified, we are always winning (despite facts). To the end, everything is righteous, even the killing of civilians.

Heck, there are vietnam vets who run around today thinking we won the vietnam war.

Little secret though, we didnt.

The last person anyone should listen to for progress on a war, is a person in the military.

They just dont have a sense of perspective. The brainwashing they get in order to go to war will cloud their views until they have no perpective left.

 

[av8torntn]

REALLY AV8?

:

Yes missile boy really. I do not believe the use of a smoke round in an urban setting is a war crime. I will go one farther and say I also believe the use of a smoke round in an urban setting is not in violation of any treaty signed by Israel. Of course I really do not know anything about which treaties Israel is a party to and which they are not. So missile boy it is all on you. If you think the use of smoke is a war crime or violation of a treaty speak up and let us all know which one. I have a feeling this is where you follow your normal pattern and fabricate something and blah blah blah.

 

[UPS Lifer]

POS,
You are so naive. You should go home to your mommy Jane Fonda and have her coddle you.

You remember Jane don't you? She is the one who coddled the Viet Cong and tried to demoralize our troops. You have the right to free speech but it doesn't mean that your free speech is right or just. Jane performed a disservice to America.

I am sorry (to the rest of the posters) but I am so over your ultra left wing righteous indignation.

 

[moreluck]

You are so over it, you called them POS (like piece of !!)

 

[UPS Lifer]

You are so over it, you called them POS (like piece of !!)

OH! You caught that "miscue" did you!!! Opps!

 

[wkmac]

What would you say if the police came into your neighborhood to confront reported criminals, killed a few – and also managed to knock off 18 or so innocent bystanders?

I read this question elsewhere but thought it applied just the same.

 

[The Other Side]

Yes missile boy really. I do not believe the use of a smoke round in an urban setting is a war crime. I will go one farther and say I also believe the use of a smoke round in an urban setting is not in violation of any treaty signed by Israel. Of course I really do not know anything about which treaties Israel is a party to and which they are not. So missile boy it is all on you. If you think the use of smoke is a war crime or violation of a treaty speak up and let us all know which one. I have a feeling this is where you follow your normal pattern and fabricate something and blah blah blah.

AV8, hahaha Pinocchio, unfortunately for you, your previous postings demonstrate how you are willing to exagerate. You claimed Hamas was launching 120mm missiles, I only corrected you.

You stated:

"Were did I ever advocate a fair fight? I know you will not take my word for it but when 120mm rockets land they are not bottle rockets. They are in fact very deadly."

This has NEVER happened. Yet you cite this as your case for military action.

Maybe this is Israels version of WMD's that dont exist, like in IRAQ to justify the destruction of innocent civilians.

You sir, are an inflamist.

A right wing exaggerator who follows the lead of the established right wing nut jobs on TV and radio.

You care not for peace and liberty, you support the beating and tormenting of innocent palestinians who have nothing but the shacks they live in.

To you, GAZA should be a giant concentration camp run by the jews and backed up by the USA.

Whats next? Are you going to tell us Hamas has nukes?

 

[av8torntn]

This has NEVER happened. Yet you cite this as your case for military action.

Missile boy first if I said there were missile in Gaza just quote me where I said it. I made this request days ago yet you keep quoting yourself about missiles. This follows the normal path you have of getting backed into a corner then coming up with some fabrication to justify your idealism. I hope you are still searching far and wide for the war crime of using smoke. I of course think this is another fabrication on your part. No rockets fired from Gaza into Israel you say.

Oh no not a rocket attack on an Israeli city.

[video=youtube;-5Ge2D7oJQs]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-5Ge2D7oJQs[/video]

Oh my goodness a video of Hamas showing how they make their rockets.

[video=youtube;GJsMSffu_MU]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJsMSffu_MU[/video]

Not a Hamas video showing rocket launch after rocket launch.


[video=youtube;K3IBttqOAgA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K3IBttqOAgA[/video]

 

[av8torntn]

I read this question elsewhere but thought it applied just the same.

Happens in Memphis all the time and they do nothing. In my town we would be at the police station demanding to know why they let criminals in our town.

 

[chev]

I think what everyone fails to realize is the fact that Biblically, the Gaza strip does belong to Israel. The land was never to be divided. Of course there are quite a few Atheists here that would take this statement with a grain of salt the same way they consider their eternal soul, but that's a can of worms best not opened here.

 

[Jones]

I think what everyone fails to realize is the fact that Biblically, the Gaza strip does belong to Israel. The land was never to be divided. Of course there are quite a few Atheists here that would take this statement with a grain of salt the same way they consider their eternal soul, but that's a can of worms best not opened here.

Being that neither the Israelis nor the Palestinians are christian, I don't think that the bible is particularly relevant. If you're going to consult a local holy book, you'd be better off with the Koran or the Torah. And since those two will probably give radically different answers, you'll be back to square one. In the middle east religion is generally the root of the problem, not the solution.

 

[chev]

Being that neither the Israelis nor the Palestinians are christian, I don't think that the bible is particularly relevant. If you're going to consult a local holy book, you'd be better off with the Koran or the Torah. And since those two will probably give radically different answers, you'll be back to square one. In the middle east religion is generally the root of the problem, not the solution.

Has nothing to do with being "Christian".
From the very first book of the Bible the Middle East has been at the forefront of God's plan for mankind. More than 3,000 years ago, God called Abraham to leave his home in one of the great cities of antiquity, Ur of the Chaldees, to wander in Palestine as a nomad. Abraham obeyed because he believed and trusted God. He was to become the father of both Jewish and Arab nations. God made promises to Abraham which were at the very heart of the Christian Gospel. The Apostle Paul says in Galatians 3:8 that God "preached before the gospel unto Abraham"! Those promises were about the nation of Israel, the land of Palestine and about one descendant in particular. God would give the land of Palestine to Abraham as an everlasting possession. The promise is contained in the words: "all the land which thou seest, to thee will I give it, and to thy seed for ever" (Genesis 13:15).
The Bible is relevant in everything that ever was or ever will be.

 

[Jones]

Has nothing to do with being Christian.

Of course it does. The bible only matters to christians, muslims and jews have their own holy books.

 

[chev]

Of course it does. The bible only matters to christians, muslims and jews have their own holy books.

The Old Testament is relative to the Jewish people.
The Bible is the central religious text of Judaism and Christianity.
We will just have a difference of opinion and have to leave it at that.

 

[Jones]

The Old Testament is relative to the Jewish people.
We will just have a difference of opinion and have to leave it at that.

Sure it is...according to christians. Jews rely on the Torah, not the bible.

 

[chev]

Sure it is...according to christians. Jews rely on the Torah, not the bible.

What do you call Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, and Deuteronomy. The first five books of the Bible just happen to be the Torah. Hmmmm.

 

[wkmac]

I think what everyone fails to realize is the fact that Biblically, the Gaza strip does belong to Israel. The land was never to be divided. Of course there are quite a few Atheists here that would take this statement with a grain of salt the same way they consider their eternal soul, but that's a can of worms best not opened here.

I guess in my case I'm an extreme atheist as I believe Israel as we know it today has no God granted claim on this land to begin with but for that fact I believe the same in the claim that the muslims make. The bible has many great things within it's pages and lessons of life that are priceless but the simple fact this document is man created. In the case of the old testament, it is written for jews, about jews and by jews so of course in that context how could they not ultimately win at the end of the day. Christians came along and added their own flavor to the mix that in the end is exactly the same.

I believe Jesus the greatest of men to walk the earth and his teachings alone are manna from heaven if you will but if I have to believe that every word in Holy Writ is all from God, then yes I'm an atheist. Does this mean I have to stop looking to Jesus for example and saying grace before I eat? Does this mean my kids must stop attending church and my daughter stop being a musician performing christian and worship music?

Far be it from me to violate another man created rule in my atheistic actions!


By the way Chev, the bible is a wonderful book but 2 suggestions. Either learn hebrew and greek or easier yet, obtain lexicons and other tools to dysect into the words used in the bible. Sure opens up a whole new wonderful world of undertanding and along with that, learn the histories of ancient Mesopotamia with details on Sumer, Babylon and Assyria. Learn about ancient Egypt with close attention to the shepard kings of the 12th dynasty known by the name of hyksos. Find who Zoraster was and what Zorasterism is. Very important influence on biblical monotheistic thought. Learn about the Mesopotamian king Sargon that predates Moses who also as a baby was set adrift in a river only to be taken later and becomes king. Oddly enough, this same story can be found in ancient India concerning one of it's great leaders. Imagine that! Read about Hammurabi and the Hammurabi code. Read about Sargon the Great, the semitic king of but more importantly understand that Abraham came out of this culture.

Read the Epic of Gilgamesh and it's creation story and the great flood which both predate Israelite writtings. Do you think Abram who came from Ur in the Sumer kingdom might have brough with him stories like Gilgamesh and then later his pogeny crafted those stories into a new national context for their own purpose?

Say it ain't so!

Besides, Israel today came about because England in the spoils of WW1 was granted Palestine by mandate and remained so until 1948' when actions of jewish terrorist know as the Irgun used bombings to chase England from it's position of power and the United States in it's global standing recognized these acts of terror by publically recognizing Israel as an independent State. This region has always been in violent conflict because of man created religious dogma and I see nothing to change that so again, we should extract ourselves completely out of the middle of this mess of death and bloodshed.

 

[chev]

I believe

Those two words are the whole reason you and I will not agree, and that's fine. We will just have to agree to disagree. You are right about learning Greek or Hebrew though since the original texts were in Greek and Hebrew, and some were poorly translated.
I believe the land does belong to Israel as it was given to the Hebrew people long before WWII.
You believe Jesus was just the greatest man whereas I believe him to be the messiah.
I appreciate your opinion though.

p.s. You just had to open that can didn't you. lol

 

[drewed]

See what I dont see is why the two sides couldnt have upheld the UN mandates, Isreal has its lands, Palestine has theirs, Jerusalem would effectively be a city state under UN protection, it would have been that simple. Could have been some hostilities? Of course, we still have incidents between N & S Koreans, but each culture would have had a land to call their own and the primary city of the 3 major religions of the region would be independent.