ups

[tieguy]

Now back to my original point. Your point here that you would not have gotten what you have without the union has some merit to it. But there is also some merit to the fact that UPS without the union structure would probably have your compensation package structured much differently than what you currently have. UPS would structure the package to remain competitive. An example of this is tuition reimbursment being offered to part-timers. This is another beni not negotiated by your union that UPS is currently offering to part timers. To be perfectly honest if you did not have a union I believe your fulltimer would make a couple of bucks less an hour and your part-timers at least a couple bucks more an hour. Your union puts all it negotiating eggs in the full-time basket and did not even touch the starting part time wage this time.

 

[kidlogic]

The joke was for delivery's post. Competive???? Thats a fancy word for not having the best around.
UPS wouldnt Raise the part timers wages and benifits. We have two clerks (part-timers)both used to be union. Both have great attitudes and perform their jobs top notch. As UPS's need for more clerks has increased both were asked to be non-union clerks. Like most people thinking this would be a positive step. They now realize this as a finacial mis-step.Since they are now salary their work loads increase. They cant complete their jobs in the same amount of time so those hours that would have been time and a half are now free hours because of the salary.The are also asked to stay later more then they used to be cause" why not It doesnt cost the company any more". This was a calculated move by UPS. UPS knew that the clerks were going to be making more money staying union so they made the positions were made non-union to avoid overtime and avoiding calling them full time non-union employees. The clerks who replaced their old jobs are now making more per hour worked. This is just one example of if UPS were non-union. There are many more. Just look at all the subcontracting UPS uses. They just would do what any good and smart company would do .....lowwer costs..

 

[macafee]

KID DONT TALK TO TIEGUY HES A STUPERVISOR WHO COULDNT MAKE IT AS A DRIVER, WONDER HOW FAT HE IS AND WHEN THE HEART ATTACK IS GONNA STRIKE

 

[kidlogic]

New rule for Macfee. No posting until 1 hour has past since you drank your last 12 pack. You may never post again.

 

[tieguy]

"They now realize this as a finacial mis-step.Since they are now salary their work loads increase."

I really don't have a lot of sympathy for anyone that has a big work load. I've never known anyone that ever got hired and was promised a light work load. Everyone I've ever met was told they would work very hard at UPS. Everyone I've met agreed to those terms. Unless you can find a way to help us secure a monopoly on packages we will continue to have to work harder than the other guy in order to stay the best in the business.

 

[kidlogic]

The problem wasnt how long or how hard they worked. The problem is that as union employees that amount of hours would bring them home a larger paycheck then their current salary. If they werent good hard workers they never would have been asked to go non-union in the first place. Like I said it was a calculated cost cutting move.Get more work for less pay. When one of the clerks went non-union her job she left got a pay hike of 2 $ an hour. She would have stayed there if she knew that was going to happen.I dont know what clerks are like in your center but OMS's are very important and I personally think they are underpaid for the value of work they do.

 

[tieguy]

"KID DONT TALK TO TIEGUY HES A STUPERVISOR WHO COULDNT MAKE IT AS A DRIVER, WONDER HOW FAT HE IS AND WHEN THE HEART ATTACK IS GONNA STRIKE"

Mr. Macafee your insanity appears to have no limits. In one post you attack the union employees of UPS in another you attack the management. Just where do you fit in ( I use that expression loosely )

 

[macafee]

tieguy,yeh your right 1minute Im for UPS the next minute Im for the teamsters, you think Im alone feeling like that ? well your wrong I say 9out of 10 feel the same way but will not say it, tie guy have great holiday ps would love to be a supervisor some day

 

[proups]

deliver man: please re-read my post. I never blamed United's problems on the union. I blamed the mechanics for not going along with the union and the company to help bail it out. If you will read about United's problems, and proposed pay cuts, you will see that management took the biggest pay cuts - some as much as 15% - so yes I think they have cut the fat where they could.

Then you said I was lazy by always blaming things on the union. I asked kidlogic not to attack me so you decided that you would. I try not to be contoversial in my posts.

I think my point, put very simply, is that the union that represents United mechanics was working with the company to keep it in business, and save thousands of union jobs.

 

[deliver_man]

deliver man: please re-read my post. I never blamed United's problems on the union. I blamed the mechanics for not going along with the union and the company to help bail it out.

The mechanics ARE the union, if they vote no then the union votes no. And yes, I re-read your post. You said that the airline is facing banckruptcy because they voted no on the paycuts, and I said that was wrong. United was already facing bankruptcy for other reasons. If a man who can't swim falls in the water and drowns, did he drown because noone helped him, or did he drown because he couldn't swim? I think he drowned because he couldn't swim.

Then you said I was lazy by always blaming things on the union. I asked kidlogic not to attack me so you decided that you would.

Actually I didn't specifically call you lazy, my point was that it is a lazy argument to always blame something you can't change, ie., the unionized workforce at UPS, for the company's problems. I should have phrased it better. I'm sorry if you felt I was attacking you, I thought I was addressing points that you made that I didn't agree with. I was careful not to call you names.

(Message edited by deliver_man on December 01, 2002)

 

[proups]

deliverman: I like the swimming anaolgy. It makes sense.

Now a question: Since the guy drowned because he couldn't swim, whose fault is that? His parents? Oops, I'm trying to lay blame again!

I agree that United had many issues prior to their current problems, but I was only commenting that the mechanics ignored their union officials telling them to vote for the contract so they could keep their jobs. That didn't happen, even after ALL of the other union represented employees voted for the pay cuts. That, in my mind, is a problem.

 

[feederdude]

This post is for all Cafe members.....
It is obvious that macafee is interested in stirring . If we just ignore him and his feeble attempts to pretend to know anything about the union or management, then he will fade away.
We all have too much work to do, i.e....getting OUR volume back from Fed-ex, so we can have more union jobs, and continue to profit from all of our hard work. Again, let him sink into the waste that he creates.
Keep up the good work, and have a Happy Holiday season.
Feederdude

 

[deliver_man]

It is obvious that macafee is interested in stirring . If we just ignore him and his feeble attempts to pretend to know anything about the union or management, then he will fade away.

I thought that was obvious from his 1st post. Simple rule of all message boards:
Don't feed the trolls!

 

[Guest]

i would NEVER consider a salaried position at any company 'cause when your told to "stay late" "get lunch" "make coffee" or "scrub the latrine" even "lock-up tonight" added up it makes you a pre-paid MONKEY

 

[traveler]

Wow 242! If everyone had that outlook, no one would ever work any salaried jobs nor would anyone ever open their own business.

On the flip side, why would anyone ever want an hourly job where they had to do the same job most every day? (That's a rhetorical question since the answer is just as obvious as the answer to your question... "it takes all kinds")

 

[upsdawg]

O.K.--I'll jump in with both feet!! I have been in the hourly as well as the salaried---they both have their pros and cons!! It is nice to get overtime pay but it is also nice to have some of the flexibility that comes with salary. I was fortunate to be on salary when I wa soff work for 5 months with back surgery---the checks just came automatically--when I did go back to work I did not lose any vacation time, or anything else.

Owning your own company is being on salary--you are the boss and sometimes you have to clean the toilets--comes with the territory!!!

 

[seahorse]

I'd bet my "former necktie" that some of the fat cats at UAL wasted some big bucks on junkets to who knows where and other corporate spending that had no company purpose. The point here is that both sides of the aisle have to take some responsibility for their problems. It's not "just a union issue" and it's not "just a management issue." My 2 cents worth!

 

[lr1937]

242
I respect your right to choose to be or not to be a salaried person but think prepaid monkey remark sucks. How about if I counter with you are a lazy overpaid jackass! Isn't name calling fun??