Whether or not the intention of the letter was good or bad - the process by which they got these letters was wrong, if not illegal. The DM in our area wanted the names of those that refused. Every man and woman in our center that fears for there position, and that is quite a few, rolled over and did it without even knowing what the dispute is all about. The shop stewards couldn't even tell you. Cool, huh?
Washington Post Slam
- Thread starter tieguy
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tworavens
JuniorMember for 24 Years
In our building there was no harassment about writing the letters, more like continual nagging to come in and do it on the clock. I haven't heard of any repercussions for any drivers who didn't participate.
I have a question, and I mean this in all sincerity: Suppose you refuse, and your name goes to the DM. Then what? If you're a union member, can you actually be disciplined for refusing? It seems to me you would be within your rights to refuse, like if they ordered you to clean the toilets or something.
HEFFERNAN
Huge Member
I was told as long as you were being paid for it
Work As Directed
That was union's stance
As I said earlier, Teamsters were behind the campaign as well
Though, I (We) have not heard of discipline directly related to the issue anywhere
UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)
Well-Known Member
Maybe it is just better to go with the flow rather than hit the breakwater.
Catatonic
Nine Lives
Welcome to BC shanp. We are always looking for more people from Upstate NY.
dannyboy
From the promised LAND
Let me draw you a picture.
UPS and the Teamsters are after Fedex. UPS and the Teamsters in bed together, while under a Democratic president and congress.
After they are de-certified from being under the RLA, the Teamsters will be totally focused on getting all of Fedex under their umbrella before another union tries to cut in line. Its a power thing, you understand.....
And in doing so, they will throw all their energy to that cause, time is not their friend.
In the mean time, UPS will plod on. Their backroom deals with Hoffa that have neutered the contract on so many different issues will continue for a long time to come, as "they already have us" in the "fold".
Man, you gotta quit trying to sharpen both ends of the pencil at the same time.
Why would FedEx make a smaller profit? Would they not raise their rates to increase the profit margin, just like UPS does? Its posts like that that give the impression you dont have a clue.
The cost of living in America would have no where to go but up, as FedEx and the USPS would have to raise rates to make profits.
d PS, America is capitalized, I changed it for you in your quote
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pickup
Guest
MrFedEx
Engorged Member
Exactly. FedEx will not go out of business or become less profitable. They will raise rates, cut employees, and do whatever they need to do to maintain their profit margin. It will be more difficult because they will no longer have their special RLA "subsidy". Maybe the top managers will have to make a little less and actually make decisions that are logical and productive. They might also have to lose that huge fleet of corporate jets and some of their other costly perks. It would be a major adjustment for them to not be able to use Fred's plane(s) to fly to their second home in Jackson Hole or Aspen. Life is rough.
With all due respect for those that have lasted through the changes at center level since going public on NYSE, going with the flow will only compromise the ability to make a good living for all those that come behind us. You don't ever get back later what you give up now in this modern UPS environment.
UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)
Well-Known Member
I am afraid that the word concession will be added to the vocabulary of UPSers come 2013.
UPSers who participate in the NYS Teamsters Council Health and Hospital Fund recently received a mailing detailing changes in the Supreme and Select Plans. The primary change is the introduction and/or increase of co-pays.
Effective 10/1/09, there will be a $10 co-pay for doctor visits and a $100 co-pay for ER visits which do not result in an inpatient hospital admission for those in the Supreme plan. Co-pays will double for those in the Select plan.
I do believe that 2013 will have us paying a portion of our health care.
UPSers who participate in the NYS Teamsters Council Health and Hospital Fund recently received a mailing detailing changes in the Supreme and Select Plans. The primary change is the introduction and/or increase of co-pays.
Effective 10/1/09, there will be a $10 co-pay for doctor visits and a $100 co-pay for ER visits which do not result in an inpatient hospital admission for those in the Supreme plan. Co-pays will double for those in the Select plan.
I do believe that 2013 will have us paying a portion of our health care.
Sorry Pickup. I didn't know that this was an exclusive club. I don't own a white flag.
I also agree that we will have a laundry list of concessions in the next contract. But as things are going now, will they even wait? Our reps up here need to be blown out. Don't get me wrong, we still have the best plan going even with co-pays (even though the hospital stay thing is a crock and spousal coverage too) but what's stopping them from changing the rules mid stream again? Part-timers will soon be eliminated all together. This is just the beginning. The people that have stood by need to join us in making some noise. We need the union to represent the current members. That's what they are paid to do.
I also agree that we will have a laundry list of concessions in the next contract. But as things are going now, will they even wait? Our reps up here need to be blown out. Don't get me wrong, we still have the best plan going even with co-pays (even though the hospital stay thing is a crock and spousal coverage too) but what's stopping them from changing the rules mid stream again? Part-timers will soon be eliminated all together. This is just the beginning. The people that have stood by need to join us in making some noise. We need the union to represent the current members. That's what they are paid to do.
705red
Browncafe Steward
I personally would rather receive less in wages to maintain my current medical plan. $32 an hour is real good money! We do work hard for it but imagine how much other people pay for family coverage that do not make what we make hourly. 2013 will be interesting, we also need to address part time wages!
I very much agree with your position. Our current coverage is worth more than what we are paying and I too am willing to suppliment my monthly union deduction for it. I know people without any coverage at all and I feel fortunate.
We see it everywhere, these corporate lawyers and CEO's making out like bandits and thats not what a union should be about.
We see it everywhere, these corporate lawyers and CEO's making out like bandits and thats not what a union should be about.
dannyboy
From the promised LAND
I believe what you will see in 13 is that you will be given certain options. UPS will pay a basic amount for the teamsters to provide a level of coverage, say a high copay, high deductible plan. That will be the basic plan. Then you will be offered to upgrade your plan. Those upgrades will be your out of pocket for which you will either actually pay the teamsters for, or will have it deducted from your pay.
Unless Obama gets his way, then who knows.........
I believe that part time wages will increase by 20% or so. The teamsters have finally figured out that there is absolutely no reason at all for part timers to join the union. In fact, the union actually provides the very reasons very few are union.
As for other concessions besides wages, look to see a roll back of vacation time after the first two weeks, paid holidays, and sick days. Not so much for those already there, but for those to follow.
The only way to avert this type of roll back is to grow the business....
d
Unless Obama gets his way, then who knows.........
I believe that part time wages will increase by 20% or so. The teamsters have finally figured out that there is absolutely no reason at all for part timers to join the union. In fact, the union actually provides the very reasons very few are union.
As for other concessions besides wages, look to see a roll back of vacation time after the first two weeks, paid holidays, and sick days. Not so much for those already there, but for those to follow.
The only way to avert this type of roll back is to grow the business....
d
HEFFERNAN
Huge Member
I would have to disagree D
Part time union initiation fees have been a money stream for the Teamsters for many years. It becomes a money river when you add up the turnover rate. I feel with the economy, more new employees are sticking it out so they can get the health plan which in turn slows the stream to a trickle.
This is obviously a post for another thread
dannyboy
From the promised LAND
Actually you and I are both right.
Closed shop states and right to work states do have different laws.
In open states, the number of union part timers is near zero, or at least very small.
In others, they have 100% membership.
Nothing like working for nothing all week making 8.50 an hour for 3.5 hours, and owing money to the union after taxes.
So yes, there are states where the part timer is forced to join, not because the union provided something of value to the person to where they want to join, but they have no other choice.
disgraceful........
d
tworavens
JuniorMember for 24 Years
I capitalized America in mine, as I always do. That last quote was from upssalesguy's post, however I will refrain from suggesting you don't have a clue.
And in any case my point was the same as yours, that Fedex would raise it's rates, not that it would make a smaller profit. Assuming that the rates are currently more or less on par, a Fedex rate increase would tend to push more customers to use UPS. Why would UPS want to raise its rates to match the new, higher Fedex rates? Yes, I realize greed is a powerful incentive to do so, but you seem to assert that having a Teamster-organized UPS and Fedex (which is far from certain, btw) would allow both companies to raise their rates with impunity. I don't believe that would be sustainable.As for the USPS, they will have to raise their rates in any case, they are $7 billion in the hole right now, but that's another discussion.
In your original post to which I responded, you said:
"REally? THat is the only reason UPS wants the to get out from under the RLA? To raise the cost of living on America during this downturn in the economy, just to level your playing field?"
I would be interested to hear why you think UPS wants Fedex out of the RLA.
I'm not sure if I understand you, please correct me if I'm wrong but that few dollars that part-timers pay every month to the union gets them benefits worth hundreds of dollars. You are right about the $8.50 an hour but some people up here would work for nothing but the benefits.
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pickup
Guest
Shanp, no I am the one who is sorry. It was just a joke directed to another member by the name of UPStateNy, a proud member of the 6000 post club.
Welcome aboard, it is not an exclusive club by any means.
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